They've been playing like garbage since the Boston game.
Henrik: 22GP, 17pts, pointless in 12 games
Daniel: 22GP, 16pts, pointless in 13 games
Take out the game against Toronto and their joke of a defence, they've been producing like 45-50 pt players
What's more concerning is the number of games they've gone pointless. In more than half of the games (since boston), Sedins have contributed absolutely nothing to this team, and probably cost the team with their amateur defensive play. 22 games is more than a quarter of the season, and this level of play is really concerning to me...
Even just watching the games, it's not like they're generating lots of chances, they've been completely invisible for this past stretch. They also seem to struggle mightily against teams that play a stifling defensive style. I believe the Sedins, more than any other player in the league, are affected by the amount of open ice they have to work with. They just get completely shut down, generating almost nothing against these defensive teams that don't give them much room, and it will only get much worse in the playoffs.
I honestly believe the reason for the Sedins' lack of success in the playoffs doesn't have anything to do with them lacking heart, not caring enough, chokers. etcetc, they just can't produce when there is less open ice. In the playoffs, they've done well against teams that play less defensively, Blues in 09, Kings in 10, Sharks in 11.
If the Canucks face the Blues, Preds, Coyotes in the playoffs does anyone honestly believe that the Sedins can produce more than 3-4 points over a hypothetical seven game series? It's a complete joke how we can't rely on our first line forwards to produce offence for us when we face those teams.
I seriously don't see how the Canucks can get past the likes of Nashville this year. You just know that the Sedins will be Weber and Suter's b****, are we expecting Kesler to repeat his heroics from last year? Not something I'd feel confident in counting on considering Kesler's offensive output this year, but that's for another thread....
And this coming from a huge Sedin fan, half my posts probably have to do with defending the sedins from idiots in the past, but I've just about had it with these guys.
They're resting for the playoffs. They've realized that the individual honour stuff didn't win a cup and they are just waiting to get back to the games that really matter... Just my 4.5 cents.
Let's be honest the entire team is putting for as little effort as necessary to get the W. They play hard to get the first point, and once they're up they are conservative.
It makes sense. And what's really baffling is that despite them all not performing to the full 100% they are the top team in the league. Imagine if the team was putting for a do or die attitude every game? Insane to think about.
The Sedins can under-perform right now. They both got back to back Art Ross' they aren't interested in trying to get the title this year their goal is the playoffs. Last year our whole roster went in with bruises into the playoffs, they've seen now that they want to keep the amount of work they put to the minimal.
Nothing is wrong with them they have their eyes on a bigger prize.
Nothing wrong with them...its the D men that are struggling to support them. The Sedins rely heavily on D men for their cycle and to generate point shots and scoring chances. When D men arent supporting well the twins are not as effective.
Twins like to slow the game down, looking for a lot of drop passes or hitting the trailer. Problem is, in the playoffs, the opposing forwards come back a lot harder than they do in the regular season. As a result the Dman is going to be either covered or not get as good a look.
Twins also play on the perimeter too much and don't put the puck on net to generate rebounds. They need to realize that a shot on net that produces a rebound for Burrows to bang away at 5 on 5, or for Kesler to bang away at on the PP is just as good as a perfect pass to them. Like to see them get the puck on the goalie low and into his pads, ideally aiming for the far side pad as much as possible so that the rebound has to go to the slot area rather than being pushed to the side.
Kassian can help the twins out, not by playing with them, but by being a physical force against the shutdown pair of Dmen when he's on the ice against them. He has to use his 225 lb frame and wear down the likes of Suter, Weber, Pieterangelo, Seabrook, Keith, Lidstrom, Kronvall, Yandle, etc.
They may need to be split up if they are not going well. Perry/Getzlaf, Datsyuk/Zetterberg, St. Louis/Stamkos, etc. all get split up if they aren't producing. Twins should be no different. Playing with the same guy for 25 years, you can fall into your comfort zone and not change things up. Playoffs is all about adapting to what the opposition is doing.
Just like in football. You can be the best running team, but if the Defense commits 9 to the box, leaving the WR with single coverage, you are going to have to throw the football to move the offense. Can't keeping pounding away for 2 yards per rush all game long. Go with your bread and butter, but you have to be able to do something else too. If you rely on the point shot on the PP, you can bet the opposition has scouted that and will try to take it away, therefore, you have to be able to execute a down low play with the 3 forwards.
Last edited by Street Hawk: 02-29-2012 at 01:23 AM.
They can coast the rest of the season and get 0 points the rest of the way for all I care, as long as they produce when it matters. Plus, it's ticking me off how Rome is out there with the Sedins a lot more then he should be.
They can coast the rest of the season and get 0 points the rest of the way for all I care, as long as they produce when it matters. Plus, it's ticking me off how Rome is out there with the Sedins a lot more then he should be.
I've noticed this before too. Having an Edler (or Ehrhoff last year) at the point vs. having Rome makes a significant difference 5 on 5.
I've noticed this before. Having an Edler (or Ehrhoff last year) at the point vs. having Rome makes a significant difference 5 on 5.
Especially in our own zone, and breaking out of our own zone. Some passes Rome gives, yeah, it doesn't help the Sedins offensive game, let's just say that.
I honestly believe the reason for the Sedins' lack of success in the playoffs doesn't have anything to do with them lacking heart, not caring enough, chokers. etcetc, they just can't produce when there is less open ice.
It may seem like the sedins are not producing because there is no stanley cup in Vancouver yet. People have to find somebody to blame, but if you look at the last 3 playoffs. Henrik has 46 points in 47 games and Daniel has 44 points in 47 games. Both are just under a point a game. There not many players that could produce stats like that. There not Crosby or Malkin out there. There not really that bad actually. Many superstars including Crosby get shut down in series as well. The year the Pens won the cup. Crosby has 3 point against Det in a 7 game series. When Crosby didn't produce Malkin took over. Daniel Sedin had 4 points against boston. Last year playoff The sedins got shut down. If somebody took over and the canucks won the stanley cup. We wouldn't be having this conversation right now.
I would wager that they are tuning their fitness curve, like most elite athletes does coming mastership. Be good when it matters, the last two years they each clearly were at their top during the regular season - proved by their individual trophies.
I think it is awesome that many things in the team isn't at its best but still we are at the top of the heap.
It may seem like the sedins are not producing because there is no stanley cup in Vancouver yet. People have to find somebody to blame, but if you look at the last 3 playoffs. Henrik has 46 points in 47 games and Daniel has 44 points in 47 games. Both are just under a point a game. There not many players that could produce stats like that. There not Crosby or Malkin out there. There not really that bad actually. Many superstars including Crosby get shut down in series as well. The year the Pens won the cup. Crosby has 3 point against Det in a 7 game series. When Crosby didn't produce Malkin took over. Daniel Sedin had 4 points against boston. Last year playoff The sedins got shut down. If somebody took over and the canucks won the stanley cup. We wouldn't be having this conversation right now.
Problem is, the Sedins are the Nucks 2 best players and always play on the same line together. When they get points, 46 and 44 respectively, how many total goals are they generating? Maybe 60 tops, assuming that they are in on 30-35 goals together.
That's why teams sometimes split up their top 2 players so that if 1 gets shut down due to a great D pair, the other has a chance to produce against the 2nd D pair and hopefully put up points.
you saw the couple games they played with bitz that they seemed energized, and had more room to work. the extra room was as much a function of the teams they played but i think burrows isn't creating enough space for that line to function well in a tight checking game. he's so weak in front of the net against tough dmen and always on his ass at the first shove. the pass from behind the net to the slot is not there and that's a huge part of their offense both 5-5 and (less so) on the pp.
if kassian (or bitz) could develop into a guy capable of playing on that line you'd see an increase in their offense in the tight games, but i don't see that happening this year. bitz could be a good option with a full offseason because his main problem so far is his conditioning, he wasn't able to skate the number or length of shifts that the sedins do when he was playing with them. he did look comfortable enough playing on that line to think that it's isn't beyond his ability to be that guy for stretches, provided the fitness is there.
Most players slump at some point during the season. Their doing it now.
As long as they don't slump in the playoffs we'll be good.
22 games seem a little long for a slump for these 2 superstar players. i don't mind the lack of points, but the lack of chances is concerning.
i think the biggest problem is the lack of PP. the sedins feasts on the PP, and have won the last 2 art ross in large part due to the points they rack up on the leagues best PP. i think daniel have like 40+ points on the PP last year? he have 24 this year. the PP also boost their confidence and allow them to be more creative on even strength. the first half of the season we have lots of PP and the sedins were leading the league in points. since the boston game we average about 2 PP/game, and the sedins struggle.
this does not bode well for playoff....
meh, were still 1st in the league and as long as they score when it counts (playoffs) i'm fine with it. It would be nice for them to step it up though.
It's called Christian Ehrhoff, or the lack of. It's not a coincidence that his tenure here resulted in two of their most dominant seasons offensively. This is what great puck moving defensemen do: they make the offense flow more smoothly, allowing for greater output from the forwards. By getting rid of Ehrhoff, the Canucks lost the ability to get out of the zone as fluidly as last season, leading to a change or adaptation in team strategy that's clearly affected the Sedin's game. Players on the ice develop a symbiotic chemistry that can really be disrupted if tampered with. This isn't me complaining about letting Ehrhoff go, it's just me assessing what I think is the problem based on what I see on the tube.
Look at Mike Green's return to the Capitals recently. Ovechkin's been playing a little better as a result, scoring more often. Then Drew Doughty. When he struggles, the entire King's offense looks like they're moving through quicksand and have no cohesion. Lidstrom to some degree too (which is why I think Detroit is absolutely finished once he retires but that's not relevant to this discussion). It's amazing people still can't figure out the importance of a offensive wizard on the back end.
The way the Canucks played last season, the puck moved from their own end, through the neutral zone and into the offensive zone in mere seconds and with a certain fluid nature. This year, it kind of seems wonky at times. It's there some games, others not. I think the Sedins fed off of that and as a result, their numbers have dropped back to the 80-85 point range.
The fans still looking for more offensive punch are slightly behind the curve in my opinion. Getting someone like Gragnani is a step in the right direction but he could bust. But the acquisition itself says something about Gillis (who I think more often than not, displays incredible foresight and anticipation) and what he believes the team needs to kind of restore some of that magic from last year.
Interestingly enough, once Ehrhoff hurt his shoulder in the playoffs, the offense was completely done. The Sedins were at their absolute worst in the finals and that was in my opinion, a combination of the Bruins' smothering style and the injured backend (specifically Ehrhoff).
The Canucks in the offseason really need to target someone like Wideman but ideally, it would be Mike Green. Since Vokoun is coming off the books and they only have Neuvirth, they should try and work something involving Schneider for Mike Green. I know my praise for him might seem unwarranted but I think the utility value he brings to the team far surpasses the Rick Nash's or even the Corey Perry's of the league. The timing is perfect: upcoming RFA and his value is at all time low in light of all his injuries but when he's on, he's absolutely explosive and would likely catapult the Sedins back up to MVP stratosphere.
