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Understanding where we are in the rebuild

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Old
03-02-2012, 11:33 AM
  #1
67NCountin
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Understanding where we are in the rebuild

I have been reading this forum for a while but felt the urge to finally post after everything I have recently seen. Let us all take a step back and understand where our team currently is as well as Burke's plan.

This is not Burke's team. Burke has been drafting as well as acquiring prospects by taking on cap dumps. Burke's 'rebuild' is still in the minors. For all those angry about cap management, understand that these are short term deals to acquire more prospects and fill the team in the meantime with vets who can help to give the lockerroom the right attitude needed.

Some people cite Edmonton has a better nucleus going forward. I don't see why. Yes they do have higher end talent on the front line, but after that there is little depth. The leafs, meanwhile, have Kessel (high end talent), talent on the blue line and have all of their prospects/depth of 2,3,4th line players in the minors who will be ready to come up within a few years. Edm does not have the same amount of depth in the minors which the leafs do.

Corollary: Within the next few years, all of the cap dumps we took on will be off of our books. We will be left with low/fair priced young players who will solidify our blue line as well as our 2/3/4th lines + Kessel. We will need 1-2 players of high end talent which may be acquired via FA or trade. This can be accomplished via trade by trading some of our depth of prospects/picks in the future once the team has shown that its ready with our current group of prospects already in the show.

Thus...patience is required. Even next year we may/may not make the playoffs....but our young group (the ones that Burke forsees with us long term) will get more of a chance to come up and in two years once our overpriced cap dumps come off of our books, our current prospects they will be up for good. From there, we are rolling.

As mentioned, the current team is not Burke's team as he envisions it long term. A few players currently playing for the leafs are...but most of the team are currently playign together in the minors. Things will likely still be a bit rough next year...but just wait for all of our prospects to play fulltime. That will be Burke's team.

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03-02-2012, 11:40 AM
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Giuseppe Sallo
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Well... we have a bunch of prospects in the farm system that are good 2nd/3rd liners, so that's a good thing.

Top 6 pick: where do we fit in? And who do we look at? Jacob Trouba?

If we can draft Mikhail Grigorenko, who is versatile, then its a win/win.

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03-02-2012, 11:42 AM
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This certainly is Burke's team. You can't just let him off the hook because they are not making him look great.

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03-02-2012, 11:43 AM
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s1r0ky
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Agreed. We are still in the rebuild. Future looks bright. If we dont make the playoffs after next year then I might question the blueprint.

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03-02-2012, 11:45 AM
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I stopped reading your post after the second sentence..."This is not Burke's team"...What a load of horse dung. Fourth year at the helm, has turned over the entire roster of basically the NHL and AHL franchise. Has extended his #1 star, who has horrible results as coach.....Has his fingerprints all over this organization. How can you write this stuff with a straight face. GM's can point to the future forever buddy....every year they acquire new talent...every year, every GM in the league acquires new talent.

Burke is a jack-a$$. He's got a lot of Leafs Nation under his thumb, waiting and waiting for some progress to be made. This is not Burke's team? Who the hell does it belong to then?

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03-02-2012, 11:46 AM
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Next year is year 5.

Brian Burke said:

"I'm not interested ... in a five-year rebuild like some of these teams have done," said Burke. "Maybe because of my age, maybe just because I know it doesn't have to be five years because it wasn't in Anaheim.

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03-02-2012, 11:48 AM
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Schennanigans
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gatorade View Post
Next year is year 5.

Brian Burke said:

"I'm not interested ... in a five-year rebuild like some of these teams have done," said Burke. "Maybe because of my age, maybe just because I know it doesn't have to be five years because it wasn't in Anaheim.
Pressure will be on to make the playoffs next year. There will be changes made for sure.

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03-02-2012, 11:48 AM
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We are on year 4 of excuses and detours. The rebuild is changing on the fly and nothing works for the Team America coaching staff. I am not trying to call them out because they are American but I am saying their strategies are inferior to Canadian Hybrid coaching styles. ie. Babcock.

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03-02-2012, 11:48 AM
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He's right. This isn't Burke's team yet. Just look at what he did in Vancouver. He was replaced after 4 years, but the team didn't really look like his until a couple years ago when the Sedins and Kesler hit their prime.

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03-02-2012, 11:50 AM
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He's drinking his own kool-aid thinking he could just make a trade or two and get a cup like Anaheim. Maybe he should apply for a GM position with Ottawa when Murray retires give it another shot. Does Chara have a brother? He should wait until Murray gets the goalie position solidified. Cloutier was so good for the Canucks.

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03-02-2012, 11:50 AM
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thewave
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Originally Posted by vezna View Post
He's right. This isn't Burke's team yet. Just look at what he did in Vancouver. He was replaced after 4 years, but the team didn't really look like his until a couple years ago when the Sedins and Kesler hit their prime.
The team is fine, the coach is the major problem. I assure you this and can only hope that we get a more balanced coach in terms of defensive play.

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03-02-2012, 11:50 AM
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hockeyfanz
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gatorade View Post
Next year is year 5.

Brian Burke said:

"I'm not interested ... in a five-year rebuild like some of these teams have done," said Burke. "Maybe because of my age, maybe just because I know it doesn't have to be five years because it wasn't in Anaheim.
Oh Gator stop being so literal. Its not what Brian meant. What he really meant was that after 5 years he will have started to build this team..."From the net out" of course. We will be the hardest team to play against. Or the hardest team to watch...more like it.

The Burke apologists do not stop. So now we have to wait until Biggs, Percy, Kadri, McKegg, Ross, Ashton, Colborne et al. all make the big club before it's "Burke's team"

Of course once those guys are in the lineup...Burke will have acquired another 2 or 3 years worth of Free Agents, draft picks and prospects through trades and drafts....and then we can start the cycle all over again....


Doesn't "we are the youngest team in the league" fit into your argument OP?

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03-02-2012, 11:52 AM
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Originally Posted by hockeyfanz View Post
Oh Gator stop being so literal. Its not what Brian meant. What he really meant was that after 5 years he will have started to build this team..."From the net out" of course. We will be the hardest team to play against. Or the hardest team to watch...more like it.

The Burke apologists do not stop. So now we have to wait until Biggs, Percy, Kadri, McKegg, Ross, Ashton, Colborne et al. all make the big club before it's "Burke's team"

Of course once those guys are in the lineup...Burke will have acquired another 2 or 3 years worth of Free Agents, draft picks and prospects through trades and drafts....and then we can start the cycle all over again....

That was Burkie being literal. He spelled it all out for us. just like he could have had 4 more 1st round picks in the up coming draft.

I am confused. Is he now rebuilding or not?

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03-02-2012, 11:52 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hockeyfanz View Post
Oh Gator stop being so literal. Its not what Brian meant. What he really meant was that after 5 years he will have started to build this team..."From the net out" of course. We will be the hardest team to play against. Or the hardest team to watch...more like it.

The Burke apologists do not stop. So now we have to wait until Biggs, Percy, Kadri, McKegg, Ross, Ashton, Colborne et al. all make the big club before it's "Burke's team"

Of course once those guys are in the lineup...Burke will have acquired another 2 or 3 years worth of Free Agents, draft picks and prospects through trades and drafts....and then we can start the cycle all over again....


Doesn't "we are the youngest team in the league" fit into your argument OP?
As opposed to what? What do you expect a new GM to do?

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03-02-2012, 11:52 AM
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67NCountin
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Originally Posted by Gatorade View Post
This certainly is Burke's team. You can't just let him off the hook because they are not making him look great.
I disagree. As noted...the current group is not the product he envisions long term. It is a stop gap until "his" team is ready.

Lets think of it like cooking. Sure - some of the products mixed together during the cooking process may be ok...but it is not a finished product. Most of the ingredients are still baking away and until they are ready, its not really his main course, now is it? Did Burke assemble this team? Yes. But he assembled it in a such a way that the main ingredients are still baking. The team he envisions long term is not this team....thus it is not his team. Give it two years and you will see his team and then judge.

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03-02-2012, 11:52 AM
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thewave
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hockeyfanz View Post
Oh Gator stop being so literal. Its not what Brian meant. What he really meant was that after 5 years he will have started to build this team..."From the net out" of course. We will be the hardest team to play against. Or the hardest team to watch...more like it.

The Burke apologists do not stop. So now we have to wait until Biggs, Percy, Kadri, McKegg, Ross, Ashton, Colborne et al. all make the big club before it's "Burke's team"

Of course once those guys are in the lineup...Burke will have acquired another 2 or 3 years worth of Free Agents, draft picks and prospects through trades and drafts....and then we can start the cycle all over again....

Isn't that like doing the same thing over and over and expecting different results? Why, that's the definition of insanity.

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03-02-2012, 11:53 AM
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Originally Posted by vezna View Post
As opposed to what? What do you expect a new GM to do?
What he says.

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03-02-2012, 11:54 AM
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thewave
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Originally Posted by Gatorade View Post
What he says.
It's been glaring obvious the coach has needed to go for the past 2 years. The fact people run to the defense of Ron Wilson is absolutely insane.

Burke has not done a "bad" job. He has done a terrible dis-service to the people of Toronto and fans of the Leafs by keeping Ron Wilson on as coach.

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03-02-2012, 11:55 AM
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Probably the best first post I've seen in my time on the Boards so far. I agree with everything you've just said, and have been saying the same kinds of things for quite a while now. Unfortunately, a lot of people won't listen to this kind of logic, but it's pretty obvious to anyone who has an ounce of foresight that this team is headed in a great direction.

Also, in regards to that top-line talent you mentioned, we have a really great chance this year to pick up a very solid piece this draft, given the way the last few weeks have been going. Picking up a Galchenyuk or Grigorenko this off-season would go a very, very long way to helping our future.

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03-02-2012, 11:56 AM
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Originally Posted by IBeL13f View Post
Probably the best first post I've seen in my time on the Boards so far. I agree with everything you've just said, and have been saying the same kinds of things for quite a while now. Unfortunately, a lot of people won't listen to this kind of logic, but it's pretty obvious to anyone who has an ounce of foresight that this team is headed in a great direction.
It's younger. Not sure we have anything else at this point.

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03-02-2012, 11:57 AM
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Originally Posted by Gatorade View Post
This certainly is Burke's team. You can't just let him off the hook because they are not making him look great.
This is 100% not Burke's team. You think Lombardi, Connolly and Crabb are Burke's core. They were plugs that needed to fill a hole!

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03-02-2012, 11:57 AM
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thewave
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Originally Posted by 67NCountin View Post
I disagree. As noted...the current group is not the product he envisions long term. It is a stop gap until "his" team is ready.

Lets think of it like cooking. Sure - some of the products mixed together during the cooking process may be ok...but it is not a finished product. Most of the ingredients are still baking away and until they are ready, its not really his main course, now is it? Did Burke assemble this team? Yes. But he assembled it in a such a way that the main ingredients are still baking. The team he envisions long term is not this team....thus it is not his team. Give it two years and you will see his team and then judge.
Burke teams that won have never been a full out run and gun teams...Where is the grit on the leafs up front? This is nothing more than a team USA experiment. That's it. I'll call it out for what it is.

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03-02-2012, 11:58 AM
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Originally Posted by Gatorade View Post
What he says.
He didn't say the team will make the playoffs this year.

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03-02-2012, 11:58 AM
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I like Burke's moves for the most part. The smartest thing he could do right now is come out and say things aren't going exactly as planned and that they have had to make some changes from the original plan. That's all he has to do quell some of the rage in Leafs nation currently. Also fire Wilson after the end of the season.

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03-02-2012, 11:59 AM
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Down is good. As long as he doesn't trade the next four years of our first picks.

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