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Old
03-01-2012, 03:43 AM
  #76
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Originally Posted by Campoli2Burrows View Post
I might be in the minority here, but after the acquisition of Kassian I have no interest in Connolly. Our two best prospects, Kassian and Jensen, are both RWs so I see no point in grabbing another blue chipper there. Frankly I think the only deal here that makes sense for either team is Schneider for Tampa 1st + mid 2nd. Lightning will still have what, 4 top 60 picks? It's not exactly mortgaging the future or anything.
Kassian, Jensen and Rodin are all right hand wingers and we have Burrows and Hansen as 2 of the top 9 right handed wingers, Kassian trade now makes trading for Connolly a useless one. Connolly has a ton of skill and would be a great return but Canucks have no need for him, Carter Ashton is a left handed power forward and he would be a nice piece with the Wings first, I'd do that. That would give use a nice future on the wing with Kassian(RH) Jensen(RW) Rodin(RW) and Ashton(LW) and Schroeder(C) if Schroeder ends up being a winger in the NHL he'll be a RW, we're loaded on the right side with little coming up for the left side.

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Old
03-01-2012, 04:00 AM
  #77
ShouldveDraftedFiala
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Originally Posted by Cherith Cutestory View Post
Gotta ask Canucks fans since I can't understand why they wouldn't trade Schneider...do you think the team is holding out on trading him in case they can find a taker for Luongo in the off-season? There's no way Schneider re-ups for more than next season since he knows, as we all do, that he's gonna be a #1 and could be right now.
I think there's 2 reasons we're holding onto him. And MG is a genius for doing it, as it's playing out perfectly.

1. The last couple of seasons have been a bit rocky for Luongo, and there's been a lot of questions whether he was able to step up his game when it mattered most (playoffs) or not.

There had been a lot of media and fan scrutiny brewing in this time and I'm sure that MG felt it coming. Even during our run last year there were questionable games and body language, which resulted in Cory playing a game against Chicago.

If there was a fan backlash against Luongo AFTER trading Cory, it would be an absolute disaster.

So by deciding to keep Cory this year, it not only puts pressure on Luongo to perform, but it gives the team a reassurance that he can step in during the playoffs and get the job done.

2. It drives his value up, and it's skyrocketed since the same time last year that's for sure.

We've seen MG and AV both commit to putting Cory on display to the NHL this year by playing him in big games, against the top teams. And it's worked.



With that said the only way I see Luongo being traded is if he has a horrible playoffs and Cory takes over and runs with it. If that happens there will be fan and media pressure to keep Cory as the starter, and Luongo might be resigned to waive his NTC and leave. Tampa being an ideal destination.

But from how Luongo is playing right now, if he continues with it into the playoffs and even if we don't win the cup, as long as he's not the reason why, I think he'll stay and Cory will be moved.

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Old
03-01-2012, 04:06 AM
  #78
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BLAME CANADA View Post
Kassian, Jensen and Rodin are all right hand wingers and we have Burrows and Hansen as 2 of the top 9 right handed wingers, Kassian trade now makes trading for Connolly a useless one. Connolly has a ton of skill and would be a great return but Canucks have no need for him, Carter Ashton is a left handed power forward and he would be a nice piece with the Wings first, I'd do that. That would give use a nice future on the wing with Kassian(RH) Jensen(RW) Rodin(RW) and Ashton(LW) and Schroeder(C) if Schroeder ends up being a winger in the NHL he'll be a RW, we're loaded on the right side with little coming up for the left side.
Ashton was traded to the Leafs for Aulie.

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03-01-2012, 04:11 AM
  #79
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I personally feel realistically that Tampa Bays 1st and a 2nd in 2013 would be enough for me to move Schneider.

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Old
03-01-2012, 04:12 AM
  #80
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Originally Posted by Figz14 View Post
Ashton was traded to the Leafs for Aulie.
Yeah I know.. just saying that from TB that's what I would've done if Ashton was still with TB, as I don't see how Connolly fits here. Maybe Ashton and the Leafs 1st

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03-01-2012, 04:12 AM
  #81
ShouldveDraftedFiala
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Originally Posted by matt1 View Post
I know you guys do not think this is a fair trade but if you look at Schneider's stat line, it is a very small sample size on an extremely good time. He has played 49 games in the last two years with GAA of 2.23 and 2.13 which is exceptional.

But you have to look at other trades of young goalies like Schneider. Look at the Halak trade. He went 26-13-5 with a 2.48 GAA and a .925 SV%. So in this one season Halak has pretty much the same amount of games on a slightly less-skilled team. He took Montreal into the playoffs and was the sole reason they made it to the 2nd round. He posted a 9-9 record with a 2.55 GAA and a .923 SV%.

After the season Halak was traded for Lars Eller (former 14th overall pick from 2007) and Ian Schultz ( former 87th overall pick from 2008).Overall i think that the trade is pretty equal that I first posted.

Detroits 1st Round Pick <Lars Eller
Tokarski> Ian Schultz

Thoughts?
Except that the situation of the Halak trade had a huge impact on what Montreal got.

They handled that situation horribly and were put into a position where teams could take advantage of them and get him cheap. MG is smart enough to not allow that to happen to us.

Tokarski and a 2nd rounder won't cut it. We have Lack in the system and would be looking for an impact player now, and or a mid to high first rounder.

Step your offer up.

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Old
03-01-2012, 04:42 AM
  #82
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Originally Posted by palindrom View Post
1. This is an interpretation of a rumor.

2.This rumor was about Colorado who is now out of the market for a goalie.

3.Next summer Schneider will be 1 year older, his cheap contract will expire, he could receive a offer sheet, and he will be 1 year closer to UFA eligibility. To the eyes of many all these point usually decrease a player value.
1. Rumor with more than one source and just before Col paid for another goalie using next year's 1st (clearly plan B if the rumors were true and it seems likely).

2. Yes but new teams need goalies this year (namely CBJ, TBL... maybe Was? maybe Tor?). The demand for goalies this draft should be higher than last unless Chicago wins the cup again (most of the other "contenders" have a good/elite goalie).

3. One year older, yes but his value (if anything) is higher just 'cause of the simple fact he's more proven. He played in bigger games this year (Chicago, Boston, etc) and his numbers are similar to last year. Not to mention he has been playing a lot behind a tired team (4 straight wins in the 2nd 1/2 of back to back... i.e. NJ where the team really just disappear'd due to 5 games in 7 nights). He on pace to play ~30 games this year... not much less than your typical #1. Numbers are still ~top 5.

Can he get an offer sheet? Only if he makes it to July 1st. But remember offering up an offer sheet (for the 'nucks not to match) would require a 1st + 3rd and pay more than you have to if you trade for his rights/work out a deal with the 'nucks before trying to offer him an OS come the draft. Not to mention OS possibility might not even be there given the 'nucks can sign him before July 1st while waiting to trade him.

Basically his value is at least a 1st + 3rd for any team that wants him. But likely will end up quite a bit higher (1st + bluechip prospect/recent 1st with a lot upside).

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Old
03-01-2012, 05:01 AM
  #83
Al Swearengen
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A lot of talk about offer sheets on HF.

There has only been ONE accepted offer sheet in nearly 15 years - D. Penner to the Oil in '07. In that time, there have only been 8 offer sheets tabled. So, in recent history, an offer sheet has a 12.5% chance of being accepted, and only one gets tabled every two-ish years on average. I don't think Schneider will prove to be the exception to this.
...Unless you think the NHL is "due" for some serious offer-sheet action, in which case, gambler's fallacy the hell out of it.

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03-01-2012, 06:10 AM
  #84
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Originally Posted by 19canuck90 View Post
Havent read anything else in this thread but i just hate this argument so much but it gets thrown around all the time. Its flawed in so many ways its ridiculous. It assumes Schneider will hit UFA (which i doubt) and that Schneider will sign in these places, which you are saying he will sign with both teams essentially since why would either team give anything up to get him when both teams can just sign him anyways?

There is no chance if Schnieder is a UFA he signs in columbus aside from massive overpayment, and i guess Tampa is possible but by NO means a guarentee.
But if Colombus acquire Schneider, what are the chance Schneider stay in Colombus beyond his UFA status (2013) ?

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03-01-2012, 06:19 AM
  #85
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Al Swearengen View Post
A lot of talk about offer sheets on HF.

There has only been ONE accepted offer sheet in nearly 15 years - D. Penner to the Oil in '07. In that time, there have only been 8 offer sheets tabled. So, in recent history, an offer sheet has a 12.5% chance of being accepted, and only one gets tabled every two-ish years on average. I don't think Schneider will prove to be the exception to this.
...Unless you think the NHL is "due" for some serious offer-sheet action, in which case, gambler's fallacy the hell out of it.
I cant find a situation as much inviting to an offer sheet in the last 15 year than Schneider situation. Offer sheet was created exactly to allow player in Schneider situation to have a shoot to at least get more $, at bestPlay a more important role on another teams.

And i dont know why people are talking about 1+3 Compensation, it is based on last year 3 200 000$ offer. With the cap rising a 3 500 000$ offer next summer could bring only a 2nd compensation.

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Old
03-01-2012, 07:41 AM
  #86
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Originally Posted by Nuck This View Post
I honestly think it's gonna take your early first and Connolly.
wow man, you're gonna get dissappointed draft day BIG TIME

Think about this... a 6th overall pick plus a proably top-10 or even top-5 pick??

YEAH NO

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03-01-2012, 07:43 AM
  #87
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Well i can bet somebody is going to be surprised at corys return and i hope its not us Canuck fans.

I consider the op's proposal a joke so just wondering what TB fans seem to think is the most Stevie Y will give up?
Connolly + Detroits 1st + 2nd round

And that's overpaying from us

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03-01-2012, 08:04 AM
  #88
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Quote:
Originally Posted by viktors89 View Post
Connolly + Detroits 1st + 2nd round

And that's overpaying from us
That would be a pretty big overpayment, and I wouldn't go around calling him SFY, but I wouldn't be too pissed either. Connolly is a big piece to give up, and I think him + 2nd would be good value for both teams.

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Old
03-01-2012, 08:26 AM
  #89
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Vancouver would be happy to keep Schneider if all he would get is a kid and a pick.

Look for Schneider to be packaged with Raymond or Ballard for a good young ROSTER player.

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Old
03-01-2012, 08:31 AM
  #90
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Quote:
Originally Posted by viktors89 View Post
Connolly + Detroits 1st + 2nd round

And that's overpaying from us
I'd be happy with that as a Canucks fan. Canucks would then have a roadblock of right wings, but I don't see that as a problem.

Sedin-Sedin-Burrows
Booth-Kesler-Kassian
Higgins-Lapierre-Connolly
Bitz-Malhotra-Hansen

Burrows is also a natural LW which opens up some options for shuffling the lineup.

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Old
03-01-2012, 08:38 AM
  #91
Cherith Cutestory
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Originally Posted by 19canuck90 View Post
Havent read anything else in this thread but i just hate this argument so much but it gets thrown around all the time. Its flawed in so many ways its ridiculous. It assumes Schneider will hit UFA (which i doubt) and that Schneider will sign in these places, which you are saying he will sign with both teams essentially since why would either team give anything up to get him when both teams can just sign him anyways?

There is no chance if Schnieder is a UFA he signs in columbus aside from massive overpayment, and i guess Tampa is possible but by NO means a guarentee.

I just hate how this is always said but it makes no sense at all, if you want the guy go out and get him or odds are you will be left behind.

P.S. to your first point no trade schneider keep Luongo. From this nucks fan at least.
You honestly believe that Schneider is going to sign in Van-City to back up Luongo? I find THAT belief to be completely ridiculous. Why would he not want to reach his full potential? And for the record, I'm not saying he WILL sign with those cities, I was responding to the trade offer from the poster above my initial reply. I don't know whether he'll sign there or not, but that's more believable than him signing in Vancouver to back-up Luongo for the next several years.

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Old
03-01-2012, 08:58 AM
  #92
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JAK View Post
Vancouver would be happy to keep Schneider if all he would get is a kid and a pick.

Look for Schneider to be packaged with Raymond or Ballard for a good young ROSTER player.
How much $ do you offer Schneider to make him happy to stay in Vancouver?

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03-01-2012, 08:59 AM
  #93
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Stop over-valuing your back up goalie Canucks fans. He's an RFA this season. Go ahead and qualify him and pay him the $1.75-2 million based on his performance. Maybe $1.5 million if you're lucky. Then you can have a ton of money tied up in net. His value drops in the offseason if you ask me. Yzerman would be silly to trade his top prospect in Connolly for Schneider. I think he offers a couple second rounders and a mid-level prospect. If Vancouver doesn't bite, then he takes the offer to LA. If they don't bite, he can sign a veteran to tandem with Garon who has been playing well lately for next season until Tokarski is ready.

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Old
03-01-2012, 10:02 AM
  #94
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Canucks fans who are saying Tampa 1st and Connolly are insane. It will be something like Tampa's 2x late 1sts and a 3rd, or Connolly and TBL 2nd, or TBL 1st and a late 2nd. Something along those lines if he goes to Tampa. We need to be reasonable here and set a fair price or they look elsewhere for a goalie.

Connolly is a top prospect, like Schneider, who is undeveloped. Add a 2nd to that to make up for the risk and you have a pretty fair deal if you ask me.

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03-01-2012, 10:04 AM
  #95
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Originally Posted by deckercky View Post
I'd be happy with that as a Canucks fan. Canucks would then have a roadblock of right wings, but I don't see that as a problem.

Sedin-Sedin-Burrows
Booth-Kesler-Kassian
Higgins-Lapierre-Connolly
Bitz-Malhotra-Hansen

Burrows is also a natural LW which opens up some options for shuffling the lineup.
Connolly would very likely be sent to the AHL for the season. The only reason he wasn't this season is because he wasnt old enough yet. I have no idea why Tampa didn't send this kid back to juniors, stupid move, he clearly wasn't NHL ready.

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Old
03-01-2012, 10:13 AM
  #96
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Stop with Connolly proposals as the Canucks really need a dman, we have enough forwards with a balanced forward group now, with prospects who can play in the top 6 in the future already.

After TB lost Ashton and Downie, and after we acquired Kassian, all we would really want from TB now is Hedman, which has probably been said many times now.

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03-01-2012, 10:16 AM
  #97
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Originally Posted by Kagee View Post
Stop with Connolly proposals as the Canucks really need a dman, we have enough forwards with a balanced forward group now, with prospects who can play in the top 6 in the future already.

After TB lost Ashton and Downie, and after we acquired Kassian, all we would really want from TB now is Hedman, which has probably been said many times now.
good luck trying to acquire him

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03-01-2012, 10:18 AM
  #98
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Originally Posted by 91Stamkos View Post
good luck trying to acquire him.
Thanks for the support!

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Old
03-01-2012, 10:18 AM
  #99
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Vancouver would say no to that one...

Their Counter would mostlikely be

Hedman
------------
Schneider/1st (2012)

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03-01-2012, 10:43 AM
  #100
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Originally Posted by Kagee View Post
Stop with Connolly proposals as the Canucks really need a dman, we have enough forwards with a balanced forward group now, with prospects who can play in the top 6 in the future already.

After TB lost Ashton and Downie, and after we acquired Kassian, all we would really want from TB now is Hedman, which has probably been said many times now.
They will trade him for assets and Connolly is that. There is a poor fit between Canuck needs and the teams that have keepers available. The best fit would have been Phoenix prior to their acquisition of Smith as they have a ton of young defenders (far too many IMO).

Buyers:
Tampa
Toronto
Columbus
New Jersey

Possible:
Edmonton
Washington

Improbable:
NY Islanders
Chicago
Philadelphia
San Jose
Phoenix

Tampa can't trade Hedman as they need help on D. They have little in the system on D. Columbus same story though they are in a better position to deal young D with the acquisition of Johnson. New Jersey have Merril but little else and need to restock on D. Toronto have one extra young defender if they can sign a UFA at the end of the year (Schenn). Edmonton is a firm no on D, and Washington are not likely to trade Carlson with Greren being such a crock. The improbable list has no help either.

Phoenix have the young D the Canucks need but are no longer a buyer in the goalie market. They need centers and we no longer have any to trade. Grrrr.


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