The Business of HockeyDiscuss the financial and business aspects of the NHL. Franchise sales, valuations, TV contracts, ratings, expansion, relocation, the CBA and work stoppage discussion goes here.
I didn't say they shouldn't. I just find it hypocritical for a corporation to demand benefits to set-up shop in a locale, and then cry for 'less government,' as so often happens.
fair enough. they're not really demanding any benefits though. they just don't want the government to take what they already have from them. less government doesn't necessarily mean more benefits.
Absolutely, I know a half dozen people who get Leaf tickets from relatives. None of them could name you 5 or 6 players on the team. They go and text message all their friends throughout the whole game, oh we're at the Leaf game.. Everybody down the line seemed to have gotten the tickets for free. My guess is some company with about 100,000 shareholders is paying and none of the users really care.
what you're saying is understandable, but when you're a business, would you rather make more money from less interested fans, or less money from diehard fans? i'd go with more $$$$$$$$$$$$$$. the diehards will watch on tv anyway
what you're saying is understandable, but when you're a business, would you rather make more money from less interested fans, or less money from diehard fans? i'd go with more $$$$$$$$$$$$$$. the diehards will watch on tv anyway
Absolutely, but as the Math guy said if there were no freebies and the people there had to buy their own tickets for the most part, the atmosphere would be way better. Not saying it is terrible now but it naturally would be alot better if more of the fans were into it.
Anybody spending 100 or more of their own money would be watching and cheering every second.
Absolutely, but as the Math guy said if there were no freebies and the people there had to buy their own tickets for the most part, the atmosphere would be way better. Not saying it is terrible now but it naturally would be alot better if more of the fans were into it.
Anybody spending 100 or more of their own money would be watching and cheering every second.
hopefully there's a plan.
but i have no idea what to think. i dont know anything on the subject, but it would suck to lose the team for a government decision.
if they need money they shoulf milk it directly on those companies ant not make the ontario teams lose.
(i know the leafs will be fine, but i guess they still "lose" money)
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another random thing.... could moving the arena to hull/gatineau help them? is it legal? (according theyre still called the "ottawa" sens to not piss the already small* fan base
hopefully there's a plan.
but i have no idea what to think. i dont know anything on the subject, but it would suck to lose the team for a government decision.
if they need money they shoulf milk it directly on those companies ant not make the ontario teams lose.
(i know the leafs will be fine, but i guess they still "lose" money)
It won't happen. When the Liberals regain a bit of sanity they'll realize that the money the taxman makes as a result of the Sens being in Ottawa far outweighs the money the taxman loses through this write off.
I recall reading where the Canadiens paid more in municipal tax than all the American teams combined (2004 I think)
I have no idea what the Leafs and Sens pay to their respective municipalities but I'd bet it's higher than most.
Canadian teams and fans are at a disadvantage in so much they pay more than their American counterparts but they still pay their fair share into revenue sharing.
I for one am not worried, but I will call my local Liberal MPP and express my opinion. If he wants my vote again, he better listen.
another random thing.... could moving the arena to hull/gatineau help them? is it legal? (according theyre still called the "ottawa" sens to not piss the already small* fan base
why. Entertaining your customers or potential customers is a huge part of doing business in many industries. Its also a large expense. Its no different than having a marketing budget.
No, I get that.... but you wouldn't expect spending on marketing to be tax deductible, would you?
Have nothing against companies having an entertainment budget for employee appreciation and to try to attract clients, but don't like the idea of it being a tax deductible expenditure. That, to me, makes absolutely no sense.
[QUOTE=htpwn;45316701]There is more than enough corporate support in the Greater Toronto Area for a second team, tax break or not, especially with the absence of an NFL team.
This should not effect Toronto teams in the slightest. The Leafs may not even need to reduce prices (and if they do, it will be on the high end tickets ranging from $250-800 and not the ones that the average fan can afford QUOTE]
Those tickets will go begging as will all the corporate boxes. All these cookie cutter arenas were built with corporations in mind. Now that may possibly be out the window.
Corporate support is based on the write-off. Pure and simple. Corporations are in it to make money and save on taxes. If they don't save taxes, those boxes will all be empty. Every single one other than a billionaire nut who will spend 100k to watch hockey from a box with no tax credit...but rich people aren't stupid. MLSE can saygoodbye to upwards of 20 million. Easy.
There is more than enough corporate support in the Greater Toronto Area for a second team, tax break or not, especially with the absence of an NFL team.
This should not effect Toronto teams in the slightest. The Leafs may not even need to reduce prices (and if they do, it will be on the high end tickets ranging from $250-800 and not the ones that the average fan can afford QUOTE]
Those tickets will go begging as will all the corporate boxes. All these cookie cutter arenas were built with corporations in mind. Now that may possibly be out the window.
Corporate support is based on the write-off. Pure and simple. Corporations are in it to make money and save on taxes. If they don't save taxes, those boxes will all be empty. Every single one other than a billionaire nut who will spend 100k to watch hockey from a box with no tax credit...but rich people aren't stupid. MLSE can saygoodbye to upwards of 20 million. Easy.
if the boxes are empty and not sold, then the quality of the league would fall. it would be a disaster. teams need that money to you know, run their business. the maple leafs making lots of money is good for the league.
Those tickets will go begging as will all the corporate boxes. All these cookie cutter arenas were built with corporations in mind. Now that may possibly be out the window.
Corporate support is based on the write-off. Pure and simple. Corporations are in it to make money and save on taxes. If they don't save taxes, those boxes will all be empty. Every single one other than a billionaire nut who will spend 100k to watch hockey from a box with no tax credit...but rich people aren't stupid. MLSE can saygoodbye to upwards of 20 million. Easy.
Again, I doubt it.
For every company that declines to purchase platinum seats or boxes, another will step up. Toronto's corporate community is large enough for its sports teams to avoid any kind of significant blow.
Even if (in your worst case scenario) MLSE can "say goodbye to upwards of $20 million," they'd still be making more than $80 million annually.
Corporate support is based on the write-off. Pure and simple. Corporations are in it to make money and save on taxes. If they don't save taxes, those boxes will all be empty. Every single one other than a billionaire nut who will spend 100k to watch hockey from a box with no tax credit...but rich people aren't stupid. MLSE can saygoodbye to upwards of 20 million. Easy.
If you want $20 million+ per year of your tax dollars to support your hockey team, may I suggest moving to Glendale, Arizona?
I've been a lifelong small-C conservative, but the current setup makes me sympathize with the "Occupy" protestors. Why should working stiffs, who can barely make their mortgage payments, subsidize the rich in their "expense account lifestyle"?
Why should working stiffs, who can barely make their mortgage payments, subsidize the rich in their "expense account lifestyle"?
Completely agree. If the modern pro sports business model is dependent on those write offs, then maybe it's time to change tax laws and the business model as well in the interests of fairness.
Leaf tickets will still sellout albeit at a cheaper price. Ottawa however........
It could be a good idea but the same article also says this:
Quote:
However, cancelling the subsidy for sporting events will actually end up having little impact on the corporate sector’s bottom line. As part of the harmonized sales tax agreement Ontario signed with the federal government in 2009, large corporations will get a sales tax rebate on certain expenses, including meals and entertainment, beginning in 2015
Absolutely, I know a half dozen people who get Leaf tickets from relatives. None of them could name you 5 or 6 players on the team. They go and text message all their friends throughout the whole game, oh we're at the Leaf game.. Everybody down the line seemed to have gotten the tickets for free. My guess is some company with about 100,000 shareholders is paying and none of the users really care.
I was told, if you were lucky to go to a game at the ACC, you could even hear your neighbor write their text messages.
Senators face extinction if Ontario scraps tax exemption
What it means is that most of the companies are buying the seasons tickets for tax rebates and not sports/entertainement as it is.
I mean, for companies having a box is a big marketing offer. Then, if it cost them 100k per year, they can always rent it for 20ish games per season making it half the price for them. Then when they get the tax, it's already betweek 25-50% rebate they are getting, the rest (25%) it's marketing expenses.
It won't happen. When the Liberals regain a bit of sanity they'll realize that the money the taxman makes as a result of the Sens being in Ottawa far outweighs the money the taxman loses through this write off.
I recall reading where the Canadiens paid more in municipal tax than all the American teams combined (2004 I think)
I have no idea what the Leafs and Sens pay to their respective municipalities but I'd bet it's higher than most.
Canadian teams and fans are at a disadvantage in so much they pay more than their American counterparts but they still pay their fair share into revenue sharing.
I for one am not worried, but I will call my local Liberal MPP and express my opinion. If he wants my vote again, he better listen.
For every company that declines to purchase platinum seats or boxes, another will step up. Toronto's corporate community is large enough for its sports teams to avoid any kind of significant blow.
Even if (in your worst case scenario) MLSE can "say goodbye to upwards of $20 million," they'd still be making more than $80 million annually.
The leafs are already having trouble selling Luxury Boxes:
. Everybody down the line seemed to have gotten the tickets for free. My guess is some company with about 100,000 shareholders is paying and none of the users really care.
