He's trying not to throw the kids to the wolves. If the team is going to fail, it might as well be on the backs of the vets. If your putting vets in a situation that is over their abilities, you shouldn't then try to teach them a lesson when they struggle.
Could you imagine your company putting you in a position to fail (tank) for 3-4 years, then having a Tortorella barking at you constantly when you do. It would get old really fast, and create an environment where no one gives a **** and hated going to work.
He's trying not to throw the kids to the wolves. If the team is going to fail, it might as well be on the backs of the vets. If your putting vets in a situation that is over their abilities, you shouldn't then try to teach them a lesson when they struggle.
Could you imagine your company putting you in a position to fail (tank) for 3-4 years, then having a Tortorella barking at you constantly when you do. It would get old really fast, and create an environment where no one gives a **** and hated going to work.
Thinker > blowhard in this situation.
He didnt seem to have any problem putting Paajarvi in a position to fail.
What has Renney ever accomplished in his long career anyway?
Hilarious that posters were throwing Quinn under the bus before he even got here and now they are telling everyone how nurturing Renney is after three years of abject failure.
Im sure my mom could get the same results for a fraction of the price.
He's trying not to throw the kids to the wolves. If the team is going to fail, it might as well be on the backs of the vets. If your putting vets in a situation that is over their abilities, you shouldn't then try to teach them a lesson when they struggle.
Could you imagine your company putting you in a position to fail (tank) for 3-4 years, then having a Tortorella barking at you constantly when you do. It would get old really fast, and create an environment where no one gives a **** and hated going to work. Thinker > blowhard in this situation.
Good post. Some points that aren't often understood. The game has changed, and the kick ass coaches don't last all that long anywhere.
Hitchcock has adjusted, Torts hasn't. Torts is basically a newer version of Mike Keenan. I don't see a lot of difference there.
Kids have more than enough pressure adapting to the NHL game. To have your coach yelling at you as direction is not only tiring but creates added stress, adds to pressure, creates mental blocks, can even overwhelm.
As Alanschu pointed out earlier we have young players that have done amazingly well in Renneys system. Eberle is having a fantastic year. Yet so many comments about Renney holding kids back in some way. The results, if anything, speak to the kids being skillfully managed. The players that have done less well have not brought enough of their effort to the table.
Renney has a pretty good handle on these kids and how to develop them. I don't see any player complaining about the coaching.
What I see instead is a team steadily improving in every category that looks to be poised to making a better run next year.
Hitchcock has adjusted, Torts hasn't. Torts is basically a newer version of Mike Keenan. I don't see a lot of difference there.
I don't agree with this. After watching that latest 24/7, it made me think of Torts as someone more than just a screamer. Yeah he gets mad, but he also gives positive reinforcement as well when it's warranted.
He strikes me as someone that will get in your face, but you will never be left wondering where you stand with him. He'll stab you in your chest, not your back.
Torts won a SC a few short years ago and currently has his team in 1st place in the East. Not sure what you want him to adjust to. Guy is a winner who expects accountability, no matter who you are or how much money you make.
He didnt seem to have any problem putting Paajarvi in a position to fail.
What has Renney ever accomplished in his long career anyway?
Hilarious that posters were throwing Quinn under the bus before he even got here and now they are telling everyone how nurturing Renney is after three years of abject failure.
Im sure my mom could get the same results for a fraction of the price.
She could nurture the hell out of that team.
What's hilarious is that you think of the board as one collective mind. Other posters throw Quinn under the bus, so I'm a hypocrite lol.
MP is a perfect example of what not to do when developing players. Posters around here that are *****ing about the vets icetime are indirectly advocating for doing the same to all of the kids.
IMO Magnus is getting screwed over because there aren't enough soft minutes to go around, and out of all of the young guys he has size and is defensively responsible. You could probably add some sophomore slump in there too. He should be in the AHL instead of being fodder. I guess you can put that on Renny, but I'd offer that its more circumstance and the team that Tambo built.
Torts won a SC a few short years ago and currently has his team in 1st place in the East. Not sure what you want him to adjust to. Guy is a winner who expects accountability, no matter who you are or how much money you make.
For years Mike Keenan was much the same thing and I think its a legit comparison. Absolutely Keenan would've won a couple Cups with the Flyers were it not for the legendary(likely best team ever)Oilers dynasty. But this doesn't prevent people and players despising him to this day. Essentially by being a hardass he kicked himself right out of the NHL eventually.
The win in Tampa conversely was at a time where there was lots of turmoil in the league and the distraction of the looming CBA impasse and lockout. I kind of put an asterisk on both the 04 and 06 seasons. They were kind of unlikely years and with unlikely cup finalists.
Are the Rangers for real this year? We'll see. Motivational coaches tend to get a lot out of their clubs in regular season. A year ago people were saying how well the Caps were coached as well. How did that work out?
Jury is out on what the Rangers will do in the playoffs.
Obviously Torts is a good coach but I still think he has a shelflife. But right now in NY he's in a good situation with a lot of personality types that will go to war for you and do anything asked. Not all clubs, few, have that kind of psyche. I don't think its all Torts either, the Rangers went searching for the type of player.
I don't agree with this. After watching that latest 24/7, it made me think of Torts as someone more than just a screamer. Yeah he gets mad, but he also gives positive reinforcement as well when it's warranted.
He strikes me as someone that will get in your face, but you will never be left wondering where you stand with him. He'll stab you in your chest, not your back.
jmo that Torts has a lot of takes that are decidecly unjust and where he gets on a players back heavily for a bad break, a play that went bad, etc. imo he micromanages way too much and puts too much stock into individual plays, games, that go sour and not always looking at the big picture of how that player is performing in general. Quite a few times you see Torts berating his own player as he skates back to the bench. Maybe he has a good take on who to do that with and who not to do it with. Again I think he has a pretty perfect group of go to war players in NY right now that will listen to anything.
As far as Torts Cam Cole said it best imo:
"Sincerity is a great tool to have if you can fake it"
I always wondered about that quote and how much more Cole might know and have seen than the average fan.
For years Mike Keenan was much the same thing and I think its a legit comparison. Absolutely Keenan would've won a couple Cups with the Flyers were it not for the legendary(likely best team ever)Oilers dynasty. But this doesn't prevent people and players despising him to this day. Essentially by being a hardass he kicked himself right out of the NHL eventually.
The win in Tampa conversely was at a time where there was lots of turmoil in the league and the distraction of the looming CBA impasse and lockout. I kind of put an asterisk on both the 04 and 06 seasons. They were kind of unlikely years and with unlikely cup finalists.
Are the Rangers for real this year? We'll see. Motivational coaches tend to get a lot out of their clubs in regular season. A year ago people were saying how well the Caps were coached as well. How did that work out?
Jury is out on what the Rangers will do in the playoffs.
Obviously Torts is a good coach but I still think he has a shelflife. But right now in NY he's in a good situation with a lot of personality types that will go to war for you and do anything asked. Not all clubs, few, have that kind of psyche. I don't think its all Torts either, the Rangers went searching for the type of player.
From many quotes I have read over the years from former players, Scotty Bowman was an ass to play for, and barely even spoke with the players. Had a pretty good career. Oilers are at the point where they could use some tough love going forward.
From many quotes I have read over the years from former players, Scotty Bowman was an ass to play, and barely even spoke with the players. Had a pretty good career. Oilers are at the point where they could use some tough love going forward.
Yeah, reasonable point. But Bowman picked his battles and was generally skillful enough in knowing what type of thing he could state to what type of player.
Lets be frank here. Bowman lasted a longtime in Montreal, regarded as a pressure cooker coach killer environment and ask Claude Ruel, or Al Mcneil, all about that.
Basically a city that expected SC's every year and with players with fat sense of entitlement. A fair amount of ego's to stroke on that club and politics to deal with.
Not to mention a whole other level of language based, and culture based complications going on at the time.
Where even starting an anglo over a francophone would get you in hot water. MacT never had that to deal with..
Bowman not only danced that high wire act for a decade in Montreal, he excelled at it. It was a graveyard for anybody less intelligent. Bowman was a master.
What's hilarious is that you think of the board as one collective mind. Other posters throw Quinn under the bus, so I'm a hypocrite lol.
MP is a perfect example of what not to do when developing players. Posters around here that are *****ing about the vets icetime are indirectly advocating for doing the same to all of the kids.
IMO Magnus is getting screwed over because there aren't enough soft minutes to go around, and out of all of the young guys he has size and is defensively responsible. You could probably add some sophomore slump in there too. He should be in the AHL instead of being fodder. I guess you can put that on Renny, but I'd offer that its more circumstance and the team that Tambo built.
I wasnt putting the Quinn comments on you. Just pointing out how there seems to be a double standard at play here.
Paajarvi should be in OKC, developing his game in a top six role down there, not stuck in the Belanger triangle up here.
Management is entirely culpable for what's going on here, but at the same time, Renney hasnt really used the tools that they have given to him (Eager, Hordichuk) so that's on him and no one else.
Renney has never done anything to get excited about. He has had good players and decent teams to work with in the past. But he has never really gotten results. He was a clone of Mact, so firing Mact and bringing on Renney was stupid from the get go. If you were going to do that, you may as well just kept Mactavish.
Dont wanna get into the debate on coaches but have a tidbit to add. I read the journal 365 days a year. During the time when Hitchcock was fired he travelled around the WHL watching young teams and evaluating himself as a coach (also lost like 60 pounds). Every sunday Jim Matheson does hockey world in the journal.
I cant remember the dates but on multiple occasions there were quotes from Hitchcock and sometimes full on interviews and he always stressed how he had to adapt and modernize how he dealt with players.
