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Carey Price: What's he worth?

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Old
03-03-2012, 02:42 PM
  #126
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Originally Posted by Habsawce View Post
Ask Carey what he wants, then give it to him.

Pretty simple to me.
It's not like we had another goalie gem in the system... We have none.

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Old
03-03-2012, 03:31 PM
  #127
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Originally Posted by GeneralManager View Post
I'm the HF mvp.
Of course you are !

You'll probably gonna get call up pretty soon ! What are you still doing here by the way ??

Someone MUST hire you !! You can apparently make sign any kind of deal to any player !! 4 years ... 8 years .. 4,75... or 5,75 millions. all the same !

You also use the best comparable available !! Don't get me wrong... Halak was/is awesome. But a franchise goalie is usually in the net for more then 55 games/years.

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03-03-2012, 04:05 PM
  #128
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Originally Posted by Lafleurs Guy View Post
I don't see why it should fluctuate so wildly... If you considered him a top five goalie last year what has he done to drop out of it so badly now? Price hasn't had the best year but he hasn't been awful and considering the team he's behind he hasn't done badly at all.
First, I never said "Price is a top 5 goalie". I said Price played like a top 5 goalie last season. Big difference.
EDIT: Going back I said "Price was a top 5 goalie". I meant that he played like a top 5 that season.

As for what he has done ? It's more what he hasn't done. He just hasn't been good this year. There's a reason the team is 15th in the east, and he's part of the reason why. Hasn't done anything to change the fortunes of the team. If I had told you the habs would be a lottery team at the start of the season you'd probably have laughed. We're not that bad of a team. People who say "without Price, the team is 30th.." what a joke really.

Price has one good top 5 season where he was the starter. It's still possible for him to have had a good season behind a bad team. I know how to see a good performance in a losing effort when I see it. But more often than not, it hasn't been the case this year.

For me, a top 5 goalie has proven to be consistently good over a at least 3 seasons in a row, or 3 out of 4. One season can be a fluke, 2 seasons is nice, 3 seasons in a row is consistency. As I said earlier, there's around 15 goalies who can have a top 5 season any given year. So who is really a top 5 goalie ? The ones who do it that year or the ones who consistently finds themselves near the top ? Can we say that of Price atm ? No.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Lafleurs Guy View Post

6th best save percentage in the league career wise and he's 24
. I don't see how he's not a top five goalie. Esp when you look at how many games he plays per year.
You keep saying that, and I don't know where you got that list. You have a link ? Not that it means much but whatever.


Last edited by Des Louise: 03-03-2012 at 04:11 PM.
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Old
03-03-2012, 04:34 PM
  #129
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I'd like to see him sign for between 5 and 6, but imagine he'll probably want closer to 7 a year. If we could sign him for 6 years 36mil I'd be satisfied. What's a 500k difference for a franchise goalie?

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Old
03-03-2012, 05:00 PM
  #130
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Originally Posted by Bring_Bak_Damphousse View Post
I'd like to see him sign for between 5 and 6, but imagine he'll probably want closer to 7 a year. If we could sign him for 6 years 36mil I'd be satisfied. What's a 500k difference for a franchise goalie?
http://www.tsn.ca/olympics/feature/?id=38377

We have a very good goalie, sign him long term.

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Old
03-03-2012, 05:06 PM
  #131
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It's going to be in the 5-6M region...and should be no more than 5-6 yrs....

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03-03-2012, 05:08 PM
  #132
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5 years, 28 mil. Likely more.

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Old
03-03-2012, 05:29 PM
  #133
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6 years 33 million is my random guess!

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Old
03-03-2012, 05:42 PM
  #134
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Weber, Campoli, Diaz and Kaberle play in front of Carey Price. Everyone on this board stop and think about it for a moment.


I wonder if Carey would take a slight discount if we can get Suter in front of him.

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Old
03-03-2012, 05:44 PM
  #135
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Not too concerned about Careys contract.
Just make sure he stays here for a long time.

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Old
03-03-2012, 06:04 PM
  #136
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I give him $6 mil for 6 years. $36 Mil in total.

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Old
03-03-2012, 09:12 PM
  #137
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Originally Posted by E = CH² View Post
First, I never said "Price is a top 5 goalie". I said Price played like a top 5 goalie last season. Big difference.
EDIT: Going back I said "Price was a top 5 goalie". I meant that he played like a top 5 that season.
Okay.

However, most folks had him as a top five goalie coming into this year. I don't think he's had a bad enough year to warrant changing that. He's been relatively solid. Certainly his numbers could be better but behind this defense... they should be a lot worse.
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Originally Posted by E = CH² View Post
As for what he has done ? It's more what he hasn't done. He just hasn't been good this year. There's a reason the team is 15th in the east, and he's part of the reason why. Hasn't done anything to change the fortunes of the team. If I had told you the habs would be a lottery team at the start of the season you'd probably have laughed. We're not that bad of a team. People who say "without Price, the team is 30th.." what a joke really.
He wasn't great to start the season... and that's about it. The team could not score while Martin was here and he's playing behind an AHL D. I'm sorry man but you're not going to have great numbers when this happens. There's no way that you can blame Price for this.

Yes, he's let in bad goals here and there but so does every goalie in the league. The difference is that you remember Price's gaffes because we don't have the scorers to bail him out. How many times has he held us in games where we had no business being in and then the club manages to get it's act together and go on to win? It happens a lot but at the end of the day folks don't consider it him 'stealing' a game... Dude, I guarantee you that if we had an average goalie in net we'd be competing with Columbus this year for dead last.


Quote:
Originally Posted by E = CH² View Post
Price has one good top 5 season where he was the starter. It's still possible for him to have had a good season behind a bad team. I know how to see a good performance in a losing effort when I see it. But more often than not, it hasn't been the case this year.

For me, a top 5 goalie has proven to be consistently good over a at least 3 seasons in a row, or 3 out of 4. One season can be a fluke, 2 seasons is nice, 3 seasons in a row is consistency. As I said earlier, there's around 15 goalies who can have a top 5 season any given year. So who is really a top 5 goalie ? The ones who do it that year or the ones who consistently finds themselves near the top ? Can we say that of Price atm ? No.
Why can't we say this?

Dude, a career save percentage of .916 (which he's been around most of this year) is really good. I know you're sitting there comparing it to some guys who are at .920+ this season but those guys aren't going to do that year in and year out. Price's numbers coming into this season were actually (I think) slightly better than Lundqvist's.

Now add in his age and the number of games he played... that's freaking amazing man. What more do you want from this guy? Really... he's playing behind crappy D and has for most of his career. He logs more games than anyone. He's young, plays in the pressure cooker and puts up great numbers.... I just don't get what it is that he has to do to gain some more respect.

Quote:
Originally Posted by E = CH² View Post
You keep saying that, and I don't know where you got that list. You have a link ? Not that it means much but whatever.
I posted his numbers compared to other elite goalies earlier this year. Somebody else posted some numbers in this thread and it was on the CBC the other night and he was 6th.

What you want from your goalie is consistency. I know it's nice to have a goalie who can pull a Hasek and get in the .930 range but that's not going to happen every year. If you have a goalie who can consistently get in the .915 range AND play 70 games a year you hang onto him for dear life, esp when he's playing on a team with a D like ours. There's about five guys with numbers that are comparable to Price's career numbers. But if you go by age, he blows almost every goalie in the league away.

Again, flip Rinne and Price's respective teams... what do you think is going to happen?


Last edited by Lafleurs Guy: 03-03-2012 at 09:30 PM.
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Old
03-03-2012, 09:29 PM
  #138
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lafleurs Guy View Post
In his rookie year he played one good series and one bad one. (20 years old)
In his 2nd year he played behind an awful team that rolled over on him. (21 years old)
In his 3rd year he barely played. (22 years old)
In his 4th year he was stellar and forced the Bruins to 7 games. (23 years old)

Most goalies don't have ANY playoff experience at this age. Wouldn't you say that he showed enough last year to at least earn the benefit of the doubt?
Well in no place am I saying he's not going to prove it. Or that he sucks or whatever. Just that the reality is that he played one great series so far till the start of his career, in 2010-2011 against the B's. Yet, that's one series. That he ended up losing even if it wasn't his fault. So we are not talking about winning 1 great series. And we are not talking about proving it in 2, 3 or 4 series in a row 'cause that's in itself a tougher accomplishment when you are under such opposition, over a short period and all. So yes, he is a very good goalie. Yes, I feel better to have him nonetheless in the playoffs than 20 others.

But one day, we will have to move from the potential of doing great to the reality of doing it.

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Old
03-03-2012, 09:36 PM
  #139
Lafleurs Guy
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Originally Posted by Whitesnake View Post
Well in no place am I saying he's not going to prove it. Or that he sucks or whatever. Just that the reality is that he played one great series so far till the start of his career, in 2010-2011 against the B's. Yet, that's one series. That he ended up losing even if it wasn't his fault. So we are not talking about winning 1 great series. And we are not talking about proving it in 2, 3 or 4 series in a row 'cause that's in itself a tougher accomplishment when you are under such opposition, over a short period and all. So yes, he is a very good goalie. Yes, I feel better to have him nonetheless in the playoffs than 20 others.

But one day, we will have to move from the potential of doing great to the reality of doing it.
That's fine man you'll get no argument from me. My problem with your post seemed to be that you felt like he'd given us no reason to beleive he could do it. I think he very clearly has demonstrated a reason to believe.

As for him proving it... we have to get him a good team in front of him too. He's not going to pull a Roy and get an average team to a cup. He's not that good. If we can actually assemble a strong team in front of him though I think he can take us a long way.

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03-03-2012, 09:53 PM
  #140
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Originally Posted by Pointed Finger View Post
I've been a HFBoards lurker for many years never having felt the need to put in my say since someone would always be of similar mind. But now, no one else seems to think what I'm thinking or is afraid to say it because of a suspicion that they'd be ridiculed or that they would be called a poor fan. I felt compelled to write a post.

I'm a fan of the Canadiens as a team and goalies as a position. I've loved, hated and been ambivalent about many goalies since the 70s. I've loved Tretiak, and Esposito, wondered at the awkward movements of young Dryden, mourned the early loss of Pelle Lindbergh, hoped for Hackett to beat his vertigo to be what he could, laughed in joy at Hasek's flopping saves, marvelled at the brilliance of Roy and Halak in their magical playoff runs... I could go on and on.

But that is just to preface my opinion (which seems to be a lonely one). It's this - I never liked Theodore, and just like Theodore, I don't like Carey Price.

People seem to have a collective unconscious agreement that Price is the Canadiens' goalie now and well into the future. There are threads speculating about how much to pay him and for how long. They talk about the great lateral movement and positioning. They say he is a franchise goalie and franchise goalies are paid top dollar. Statistics are used to validate their claims to his greatness or potential therein. Forgive me but my memory is poor - was Theodore not also assumed to be a great goalie with a great future?
(I do not mean to compare goaltending techniques, only the general consensus of opinion on ability).

What makes me not like Price? I regret I am not supported by the data. The numbers say he is a number one. I only have my gut feeling based on observing his goaltending and perhaps comparing it in my mind to great goalies I have watched in the past. Subconsciously, I was weary of Price, even in his great season last year. Maybe it was the Umberger goals in the Philadelphia series a few years ago that made me turn on him - goals that made my stomach turn and my heart ache for someone else in front of that net. Maybe it was the Boston series before that that had already cemented my opinion.

And again, I am not arguing based on his ability. He obviously has the technique. It's that something you can never put a finger on. And I am certain he doesn't have that "thing". Even if the team was doing well this year, he is not a goalie I want to go to battle for or with.

But now with the team in flux, we want to sign this fellow to a long term deal at superstar wages. It is a mistake. The management of the team made an error in trading Halak instead of riding a tandem to reveal the true identity of the hero in the mask. My wish is that it does not make a second one by rooting us to this particular goalie in an unhealthy financial and performance situation.

My criticism does not come without a recommendation. You may view it as naive. I believe in my heart that we should trade Price while the community at large holds him in high regard.

This is all only my opinion. I may be wrong but no one seems to ever say anything negative about this goalie. I'm wondering why.
My God. No wonder no one wants to play in Montreal.
why does everyone keep saying Carey had a better season last year. His numbers are about equal.

You guys need to get rid of that "what have you done for me lately" mentality. behind every great goaltender there is a solid defense, which he has yet to have in Montreal.

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Old
03-03-2012, 10:06 PM
  #141
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This will turn out in favor of price and the habs will end up getting sucked in the end.
If this team has another bad year again nx season, a big money and long term deal
could get ugly if you don't see elite numbers, including wins.

I'm standing by my earlier post, 4 mill 3 yrs. Not winning a playoff series, having one real good season and being a little better than average for a couple of seasons don't add up to 6-7 mill per yr.

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03-03-2012, 10:10 PM
  #142
Lafleurs Guy
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Originally Posted by Young Gun View Post
This will turn out in favor of price and the habs will end up getting sucked in the end.
If this team has another bad year again nx season, a big money and long term deal
could get ugly if you don't see elite numbers, including wins.

I'm standing by my earlier post, 4 mill 3 yrs. Not winning a playoff series, having one real good season and being a little better than average for a couple of seasons don't add up to 6-7 mill per yr.
Tell us again how we should be trading this guy and Subban away again please. I need a good laugh right now.

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03-03-2012, 10:20 PM
  #143
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its funny how a lot of price lovers like to say, oh it's the crappy team he plays on or every goal scored on him is this d-man or that d-man fault.

You think the team that roy played for was filled with superstars , or halak won 2 playoff rounds cause the habs had a stud lineup???

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03-03-2012, 10:28 PM
  #144
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Originally Posted by Young Gun View Post
its funny how a lot of price lovers like to say, oh it's the crappy team he plays on or every goal scored on him is this d-man or that d-man fault.

You think the team that roy played for was filled with superstars , or halak won 2 playoff rounds cause the habs had a stud lineup???
Dude, I've read you ripping on Price and Subban since you've been here. You're entitled to your opinion. I will just say that I disagree strongly with you.

Again though, if Patrick Roy is your litmus test for success you're going to be disappointed with any goalie that plays here.

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03-03-2012, 10:37 PM
  #145
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Originally Posted by Young Gun View Post
its funny how a lot of price lovers like to say, oh it's the crappy team he plays on or every goal scored on him is this d-man or that d-man fault.

You think the team that roy played for was filled with superstars , or halak won 2 playoff rounds cause the habs had a stud lineup???


Uhh, those teams were a LOT better. Especially defensively.

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Old
03-03-2012, 10:54 PM
  #146
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Originally Posted by Young Gun View Post
its funny how a lot of price lovers like to say, oh it's the crappy team he plays on or every goal scored on him is this d-man or that d-man fault.

You think the team that roy played for was filled with superstars , or halak won 2 playoff rounds cause the habs had a stud lineup???
Did anyone denied what Halak did in those 2 playoff rounds ?

Any good goalie can have an hot streak. Glad it happen with us... we had a great time.

Exemple:Right now, I do say that Cammalleri had a very bad year and was not very good for us ... does it change something to his spetacular performance in those same playoff ? He was a beast in the playoff ... but overall ... he just was not good enough.

Did anyone said Roy was not an all-star ?


This has nothing to do with Price.

The vast majority here say: Price is good, but does not deserve the big long term contract yet.

What is really funny here ... is most of the people that really don't like him say this:

He is'nt that good, he has not prooved much so far (comparing to Halak performance in the playoff)

And yet, you still give him more money then what Halak got at the same age....


Last edited by ProMath: 03-03-2012 at 11:02 PM.
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03-03-2012, 10:59 PM
  #147
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Originally Posted by Young Gun View Post
its funny how a lot of price lovers like to say, oh it's the crappy team he plays on or every goal scored on him is this d-man or that d-man fault.

You think the team that roy played for was filled with superstars , or halak won 2 playoff rounds cause the habs had a stud lineup???
Completely irrelevant. Roy isn't in the NHL anymore and Halak plays for the Blues. Price is our own solid young goaltender and he's going to get whatever he wants in order to stay here. As far as I'm concerned, he doesn't need to become a Roy to justify anything.

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03-03-2012, 11:02 PM
  #148
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Halak could have carried the team even farther IF he had a good team infront of him. The moment he faltered the Habs were done.
Until we assembly a good team we won`t win anything whether it`s with Lundqvist, Rinne, Price or whoever. NY and Nashville had elite goalies but added other quality players and have really great coaches. A goalie by himself wins nothing in today`s NHL.

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03-03-2012, 11:09 PM
  #149
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Halak could have carried the team even farther IF he had a good team infront of him. The moment he faltered the Habs were done.
Until we assembly a good team we won`t win anything whether it`s with Lundqvist, Rinne, Price or whoever. NY and Nashville had elite goalies but added other quality players and have really great coaches. A goalie by himself wins nothing in today`s NHL.
Exactly.

Signing Price is just one less problem to worry about.

When you got a good goalie, you keep him.

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03-04-2012, 01:05 AM
  #150
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Originally Posted by Lafleurs Guy View Post
That's fine man you'll get no argument from me. My problem with your post seemed to be that you felt like he'd given us no reason to beleive he could do it. I think he very clearly has demonstrated a reason to believe.

As for him proving it... we have to get him a good team in front of him too. He's not going to pull a Roy and get an average team to a cup. He's not that good. If we can actually assemble a strong team in front of him though I think he can take us a long way.
Was a perfect post until I noticed the spelling mistake.

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