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Death to the Undertaker....The all purpose Fire McPhee thread

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Old
03-07-2012, 02:13 PM
  #251
RandyHolt
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Is 2007 recent enough?

Stolen blatantly from HF:

Despite having a whopping 10 selections in the 2007 NHL Entry Draft, only Alzner remains in the Washington Capitals' organization.

http://www.hockeysfuture.com/article...7_draft_class/

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Old
03-07-2012, 02:32 PM
  #252
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Originally Posted by CapitalsCupFantasy View Post
Who cares about 10 years ago? It's done, get over it and move on.

And firing the GM does not mean a rebuild. Crazy talk.


Once again...this thread is to evaluate GMGM's job security. To do that properly you must look at his ENTIRE body of work as opposed to the "what have you done for me lately" mentality.

Also I didn't realize the 2007 draft was so bad for us. Sheesh..10 players only 1 of which is still in the org? Thats pretty ugly

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03-07-2012, 02:44 PM
  #253
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Originally Posted by RandyHolt View Post
Is 2007 recent enough?

Stolen blatantly from HF:

Despite having a whopping 10 selections in the 2007 NHL Entry Draft, only Alzner remains in the Washington Capitals' organization.

http://www.hockeysfuture.com/article...7_draft_class/
yeesh!?

its not so much only one ( albeit a high first rounder ) is with the big club as it is the other 9 not even in the organization anymore in any capacity. much less even so much as 1 stinking game in the nhl across the entire lot of them?

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Old
03-07-2012, 03:25 PM
  #254
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Originally Posted by BobRouse View Post


Once again...this thread is to evaluate GMGM's job security. To do that properly you must look at his ENTIRE body of work as opposed to the "what have you done for me lately" mentality.

Also I didn't realize the 2007 draft was so bad for us. Sheesh..10 players only 1 of which is still in the org? Thats pretty ugly
Oh I'm all good with talking about the merits or lack thereof of GMGM, but I don't care to hear someone say I told you so about something from 10 years ago, that they professed to have been doing or saying.

Sounds more and more like BCTG (or whatever his name is) the resident Detroit/Caps Leonsis conspiracy theorist when you're trying to pat yourself on the back all the time. We get it, at sometime in the past you called for McPhees head and we're all paying for not listening.

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Old
03-07-2012, 03:29 PM
  #255
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Man....come a long way from the times when GMGM could do not wrong.

I don't necessarily disagree, but I have to admit I'm a little surprised.

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03-07-2012, 03:31 PM
  #256
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Originally Posted by CapitalsCupFantasy View Post
Oh I'm all good with talking about the merits or lack thereof of GMGM, but I don't care to hear someone say I told you so about something from 10 years ago, that they professed to have been doing or saying.

Sounds more and more like BCTG (or whatever his name is) the resident Detroit/Caps Leonsis conspiracy theorist when you're trying to pat yourself on the back all the time. We get it, at sometime in the past you called for McPhees head and we're all paying for not listening.
Truer words have not been spoken!!!

You'd be pretty self righteous too if you had taken the unpopular position back then that a few of us did. So its cool for others to blast/ridicule/ban those who express an unpopular view...but then when that unpopular view stands to be correct 10 years in the future its not ok to bring it up by those who were persecuted? Please eat your crow and enjoy it! haha

And I like BCTG but we have not always seen eye to eye on things thats for sure.

But in the end there are no winners should McPhee get canned. That would mean that we either fail to make the playoffs this year or get ousted in bad fashion. That would mean alot of uncertainty about the future of the team. Its essential to make the playoffs and do some damage this year.

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03-07-2012, 05:12 PM
  #257
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I've never been a strong McPhee supporter, nor until this season a strong critic. No crow for me.

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Old
03-09-2012, 12:33 PM
  #258
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CapitalsCupFantasy View Post
Oh I'm all good with talking about the merits or lack thereof of GMGM, but I don't care to hear someone say I told you so about something from 10 years ago, that they professed to have been doing or saying.

Sounds more and more like BCTG (or whatever his name is) the resident Detroit/Caps Leonsis conspiracy theorist when you're trying to pat yourself on the back all the time. We get it, at sometime in the past you called for McPhees head and we're all paying for not listening.
LOL,

I though you had me on ignore? I knew you weren't telling the truth.

His posts do sound like mine.

There's a good reason: I spotted these issues years ago, and we discussed them throughly on the old ESPN board. I'd listen to BR and Dogs: they know their stuff.

As to Ted, he and GMGM met with Discovery Crew, and Ted asked us to work with him behind the scenes to keep negative posts off of the message boards.

This is old news, and in light of the fact that we had a president who ruled based on poll numbers, and actually bombed an aspirin factory to take the heat off the Monica Lewinski (spelled correctly?) story, it's pretty much a nothing burger.

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Old
03-09-2012, 12:46 PM
  #259
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Originally Posted by BobRouse View Post
Truer words have not been spoken!!!

You'd be pretty self righteous too if you had taken the unpopular position back then that a few of us did. So its cool for others to blast/ridicule/ban those who express an unpopular view...but then when that unpopular view stands to be correct 10 years in the future its not ok to bring it up by those who were persecuted? Please eat your crow and enjoy it! haha

And I like BCTG but we have not always seen eye to eye on things thats for sure.

But in the end there are no winners should McPhee get canned. That would mean that we either fail to make the playoffs this year or get ousted in bad fashion. That would mean alot of uncertainty about the future of the team. Its essential to make the playoffs and do some damage this year.
Yes, we differed (you were always polite), but even those with what I call "alligator mouths" came about-face, and we all became pretty fond of each other.

Those alligator's were, of course, CStanton and ToBeMellow, and our chats over the years were a lot of fun.


Now, allow me to differ from you again.

I have a different take on GMGM's drafting. I find it average.

Why? How many 2-way forwards has he landed for us?

Since someone else brought up the Red Wings, allow me to make a few distinctions.

It's true that the Wing's first round picks rarely work out.

That's because the NHL rewards failure, and the Wings rarely have first round picks.

And when they do have a first rounder, it's always at the very end of the 1st round.

Little known fact: the last top-ten Red Wing pick happened in 1991 (Keith Primeau).

But take a look at their drafted forwards: they're all damn good 2-way players, and the 2 best are in a league of their own: Zetts and Datsyuk.

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Old
03-09-2012, 12:47 PM
  #260
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CapitalsCupFantasy View Post
I've never been a strong McPhee supporter, nor until this season a strong critic. No crow for me.
If you'll come down off of your high horse, I believe that I've commented before that I enjoy reading your posts.

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Old
03-09-2012, 12:50 PM
  #261
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If you'll come down off of your high horse, I believe that I've commented before that I enjoy reading your posts.
I'm not at all surprised.

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Old
03-09-2012, 12:51 PM
  #262
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As an in town observer/supporter of the Caps, I've thought McPhee wasn't getting it done for a couple years now. I don't know who to replace him with though, or when. Should Ted wait and see what he does with this offseason? Or should he act sooner?

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Old
03-09-2012, 12:56 PM
  #263
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Originally Posted by Beef Invictus View Post
As an in town observer/supporter of the Caps, I've thought McPhee wasn't getting it done for a couple years now. I don't know who to replace him with though, or when. Should Ted wait and see what he does with this offseason? Or should he act sooner?
Love yer avatar: little guy looks delicious.

You live in Alexandria,eh? Lucky guy, that's where I go when I need meat: Restaurant Depot.

RD is nearly an hour from Gaithersburg, so I don't get to go there as often as I'd like.

Good post!

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Old
03-09-2012, 01:02 PM
  #264
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Beef Invictus View Post
As an in town observer/supporter of the Caps, I've thought McPhee wasn't getting it done for a couple years now. I don't know who to replace him with though, or when. Should Ted wait and see what he does with this offseason? Or should he act sooner?
I've wondered the same thing. We did all we could to get BB out of town without caring to much about who replaced him. The result has been a team that's pressing the panic later then they've ever had before, at least in recent memory (ie 2007). And if they do succeed they will do so as an 8th seed in the easiest division in all of hockey.

Basically the point is that we shouldn't make the same mistake again of change for the sake of change (and no that is not a political statement).

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03-09-2012, 01:12 PM
  #265
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Originally Posted by sonsofcain View Post
I'm not at all surprised.
Truth told (and last in this vein) I enjoy yours, as well.

My biggest fear is in not getting the right replacement for GMGM. I've never wavered from who I'd like: Mark Howe.

Howe is a scout for the Wings, but I'd wager that if he wanted to give the job a whirl, the Wings wouldn't hold him to a no-compete clause.

Howe knows the players well, and is universally liked and respected. He makes in home in the Philly area, I'm told, and might be willing to buy a 2nd home for here in the DC area.


Last edited by mrwarden: 03-09-2012 at 01:23 PM. Reason: pretty sure I'm saving you
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Old
03-09-2012, 01:14 PM
  #266
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Originally Posted by BTCG View Post
Love yer avatar: little guy looks delicious.

You live in Alexandria,eh? Lucky guy, that's where I go when I need meat: Restaurant Depot.

RD is nearly an hour from Gaithersburg, so I don't get to go there as often as I'd like.

Good post!
I'm gonna need to check this place out. I've lived here for a year and a half, and still haven't really explored

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Old
03-09-2012, 01:24 PM
  #267
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Originally Posted by BTCG View Post
Yes, we differed (you were always polite), but even those with what I call "alligator mouths" came about-face, and we all became pretty fond of each other.

Those alligator's were, of course, CStanton and ToBeMellow, and our chats over the years were a lot of fun.


Now, allow me to differ from you again.

I have a different take on GMGM's drafting. I find it average.

Why? How many 2-way forwards has he landed for us?

Since someone else brought up the Red Wings, allow me to make a few distinctions.

It's true that the Wing's first round picks rarely work out.

That's because the NHL rewards failure, and the Wings rarely have first round picks.

And when they do have a first rounder, it's always at the very end of the 1st round.

Little known fact: the last top-ten Red Wing pick happened in 1991 (Keith Primeau).

But take a look at their drafted forwards: they're all damn good 2-way players, and the 2 best are in a league of their own: Zetts and Datsyuk.
I guess I was "polite" ...relatively speaking! haha..I admit I got frustrated towards the boiling point year (one before lockout) and lashed out a ton on the off caps boards and somewhat on here too.

Overall McPhee's drafting has shown improvement but I know what you say. He can't seem to get well rounded forwards...his scorers usually aren't tough or defensively responsible. His defensive forwards usually can't score or aren't tough. etc etc

Either way I'd prefer McPhee improve and learn rather than get fired. At best it would be pyrrhic victory should that happen even to the most ardent of GMGM haters.

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Old
03-09-2012, 01:24 PM
  #268
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Originally Posted by Beef Invictus View Post
I'm gonna need to check this place out. I've lived here for a year and a half, and still haven't really explored
http://www.restaurantdepot.com/

I do a lot of BBQing, and they've got a great meat department.

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03-09-2012, 01:32 PM
  #269
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I guess I was "polite" ...relatively speaking! haha..I admit I got frustrated towards the boiling point year (one before lockout) and lashed out a ton on the off caps boards and somewhat on here too.

Overall McPhee's drafting has shown improvement but I know what you say. He can't seem to get well rounded forwards...his scorers usually aren't tough or defensively responsible. His defensive forwards usually can't score or aren't tough. etc etc

Either way I'd prefer McPhee improve and learn rather than get fired. At best it would be pyrrhic victory should that happen even to the most ardent of GMGM haters.




Once in a while, I hear from Thin Icer and others from the old gang. I always enjoy it when I do.

I can relate to your fear of the time it'll take to "right the ship" with a new GM. There's just no way around it, I fear.

Got a real kick outta seeing your post and Dog's post up there back to back. Reminded me of the old days. Kinda cool.

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03-09-2012, 01:56 PM
  #270
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Originally Posted by RandyHolt View Post
Is 2007 recent enough?

Stolen blatantly from HF:

Despite having a whopping 10 selections in the 2007 NHL Entry Draft, only Alzner remains in the Washington Capitals' organization.

http://www.hockeysfuture.com/article...7_draft_class/
That's a little disingenuous and you likely knew it while typing it. 6 of those picks were 4th round or later and Teddy Ruth is still a prospect, just with Columbus now as part of the Fedorov trade. Not the best draft ever, but it's not like he whiffed on a half dozen first and second rounders.

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03-09-2012, 03:10 PM
  #271
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Originally Posted by BTCG View Post


Once in a while, I hear from Thin Icer and others from the old gang. I always enjoy it when I do.

I can relate to your fear of the time it'll take to "right the ship" with a new GM. There's just no way around it, I fear.

Got a real kick outta seeing your post and Dog's post up there back to back. Reminded me of the old days. Kinda cool.
Yeah I saw them around on Bumpers boards a while back.

Well hopefully there IS a way around it and that McPhee finally "gets it".

But alot rides on the rest of this year and how it pans out.

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03-11-2012, 11:21 AM
  #272
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Yeah I saw them around on Bumpers boards a while back.

Well hopefully there IS a way around it and that McPhee finally "gets it".

But alot rides on the rest of this year and how it pans out.

Here's the thing: the Caps are not like the Red Wings.

The Caps are like your friend's little brother in your neighborhood whiffle ball league.

Remember your neighborhood whiffle ball league?

Everybody had their own team (I was the Tigers), and you played one on one against the other kids and their teams (my buddy was always the Orioles) in a fenced-in back yard.

We had this old gate that we leaned against the back of our house, and the batter stood next to the gate, batting. When you threw the ball and the batter missed it, you could hear it hit the gate, which signified that it was a strike.

If the batter hit the ball over the fence, it was a home run. If the ball hit the fence without hitting the ground, it was a triple. Etc, etc.

You'd pitch and get 3 outs, and then it was your turn to bat. We played in the mornings all summer, and kept stasticis. It was a blast.

But there was always one kid who had a little brother. And that kid's mother had orders: the older brother had to refuse to play unless his little brother was allowed to play, too.

And it wasn't enough to just allow him to play: the little brother had to be allowed to win a certain amount of games.

So... we all took turns booting ground balls and walking in the winning run, so the little brother would win once in a while, and he wouldn't go home crying to his Mom.

The Caps... are like your buddy's little brother.

No matter how far they are out of it... they can win 1 or 2 games, and like the little brother, they're right back in contention.

And what's so disgusting is that unlike the whiffle ball league, where the games are intentionally being thrown, the SouthEast division is so inept that it does this by default.

I am convinced: the Caps could lose their next 10 games, but win the next 3 after that, and like your friend's little brother, they'd be right back in the race, probably in 8th place.

Truly, the Caps are like your buddy's little brother.

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03-11-2012, 11:34 AM
  #273
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It really has more to do with what they do in the playoffs.

I am not ready to write off this years team and Alex Ovechkin like many others are.

Sure the Caps arent the Red Wings that we know today.

But at one point the Red Wings were a very promising young team who kept coming up short time after time in the playoffs. Back in 87 they swept the Blackhawks, rallied from 3-1 down to beat the leafs (remember how BAD the Norris division was back then?) and then lost a hard fought series to the Oilers.

Most were saying they were a team on the rise. Then there was the incident a couple years later where Probert, Klima, Chabot (I think these were the culprits) were out all night doing coke during the conference finals.

Then there was multiple "chokings" in the playoffs despite having incredible regular seasons and Yzerman, Fedorov, Lidstrom, etc

There was talk of trading Yzerman because he wasn't a "leader" and couldn't "change his game"

What happened when they FINALLY made it to the cup finals? Swept by an underdog..

How have things worked out for them since? People seem to forget their struggles, and struggle they did in comparison to expectations, up to the point where they beat Philly and the Legion of Doom.

Today Yzerman is known as a "great leader"

Back in 94 he was a "terrible leader" and a "selfish player"

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03-11-2012, 11:57 AM
  #274
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It really has more to do with what they do in the playoffs.

I am not ready to write off this years team and Alex Ovechkin like many others are.

Sure the Caps arent the Red Wings that we know today.

But at one point the Red Wings were a very promising young team who kept coming up short time after time in the playoffs. Back in 87 they swept the Blackhawks, rallied from 3-1 down to beat the leafs (remember how BAD the Norris division was back then?) and then lost a hard fought series to the Oilers.

Most were saying they were a team on the rise. Then there was the incident a couple years later where Probert, Klima, Chabot (I think these were the culprits) were out all night doing coke during the conference finals.

Then there was multiple "chokings" in the playoffs despite having incredible regular seasons and Yzerman, Fedorov, Lidstrom, etc

There was talk of trading Yzerman because he wasn't a "leader" and couldn't "change his game"

What happened when they FINALLY made it to the cup finals? Swept by an underdog..

How have things worked out for them since? People seem to forget their struggles, and struggle they did in comparison to expectations, up to the point where they beat Philly and the Legion of Doom.

Today Yzerman is known as a "great leader"

Back in 94 he was a "terrible leader" and a "selfish player"

Yzerman did change his game.

And yes, that change was an important factor.

But the truth is, it was just one of many changes the Wings made that turned things around.

They also went out and got Scotty Bowman to coach.

The entire team embraced a defenceive system, and just as big a change as Yzerman becoming a 2-way player, was Paul Coffey being shown the door.

The addition of Brendan Shanahan was also a key change.

AND... the addition of Mike Vernon between the pipes made a huge difference.



Let's just look at Yzerman. I don't make this statement as a homer fan. I honestly believe it: Yzerman was a much better player than AO ever was, or ever will be.

AO does not have the ability to change his game in the manner that Stevie Y did.

My point as to GMGM's drafting is a very important point: George McPhee does not value 2-way forwards, and this lack is a glaring hole in the Cap's armour.

IMO: Ted needs to hire a good hockey analyst to come in and appraise the team, and make changes from that level... on.

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03-11-2012, 12:19 PM
  #275
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Those Red Wings who might realistically face Nashville in the first round and lose?

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