Next year the "rebuilding" can no longer be a crutch. There is no reason for this team to not make the playoffs.
We need an upgrade in goal - Tambo should be able to address that in ther summer. We should also add a decent NHL defenseman in addition to the young uns that are coming up.
If we could somehow trade for Jonas Enroth and Cody Franson this off-season, I would be happy and would fully expect the Oil in the playoffs next year.
Next year the "rebuilding" can no longer be a crutch. There is no reason for this team to not make the playoffs.
We need an upgrade in goal - Tambo should be able to address that in ther summer. We should also add a decent NHL defenseman in addition to the young uns that are coming up.
If we could somehow trade for Jonas Enroth and Cody Franson this off-season, I would be happy and would fully expect the Oil in the playoffs next year.
So a 29th(currently) team has to become a top 16 team the following season, or it is a failure? If this season isn't evident enough as to why we will not make the playoffs next year, I don't know what is.
It's about pace, if the team continues on the same pace then they will get in that 70 point range which will roughly be an 8-12 point improvement over last season, that's improvement.
Interesting you talk about pace when the Oilers' points improvement seems largely due to an unsustainable hot start. In fact I wonder how much that first month and a half coloured the overall picture.
I expected Tambo to start effectively filling holes on the roster. I expected Tambo to start creating a more balanced roster.
I expected the team to reach the goal that Management put in place for this season...to play meaningful games in March.
What exactly are you meaning by more balanced? We have holes in our top 6, bottom 6, top pairing defence, bottom 6 defence and questionable goaltending. In case you haven't noticed, top UFA's aren't thrilled about signing here, which leaves trades in the offseason to fill all the holes. Are we supposed to trade Eberle for a top pairing defenceman? Who fills the hole in on the top line then? Trade Gagner for a goaltender? Who plays 2nd line centre then?
What exactly are you meaning by more balanced? We have holes in our top 6, bottom 6, top pairing defence, bottom 6 defence and questionable goaltending. In case you haven't noticed, top UFA's aren't thrilled about signing here, which leaves trades to fill all the holes. Are we supposed to trade Eberle for a top pairing defenceman? Who fills the hole in on the top line then? Trade Gagner for a goaltender? Who plays 2nd line centre then?
So you outline the holes in every facet of the team (forwards, defence and goaltending) and then follow it up with excuses and the ridiculous trade suggestions.
Then you excuse the lack of depth as another excuse as to why the team is as bad as it is.
But yet you earlier tried to argue a point that the team is improved.
Interesting you talk about pace when the Oilers' points improvement seems largely due to an unsustainable hot start. In fact I wonder how much that first month and a half coloured the overall picture.
You make it seem like the Oilers are the only team that go through spells like that in a season though.
It isn't like other teams have had really good or really bad spots during the season.
So you outline the holes in every facet of the team (forwards, defence and goaltending) and then follow it up with excuses and the ridiculous trade suggestions.
Then you excuse the lack of depth as another excuse as to why the team is as bad as it is.
But yet you earlier tried to argue a point that the team is improved.
Wow.
Yes, the team still has holes in every facet. Yet, they statistically improved from last year. Is that so hard to understand? I guess so.
Management has elected to fill some of the holes through the draft. People around here seem to think that the holes can be filled by magic or something as all they do is complain yet offer no solutions.
You make it seem like the Oilers are the only team that go through spells like that in a season though.
It isn't like other teams have had really good or really bad spots during the season.
You're missing the point. It's about the Oilers' improvement this year and what that means for next season. If the statistical improvement is due to events that are unlikely to occur again, you can't really take as a sign of things to come.
So a 29th(currently) team has to become a top 16 team the following season, or it is a failure? If this season isn't evident enough as to why we will not make the playoffs next year, I don't know what is.
??????????
Because you anticipate all 4 of our best players missing significant time again next year?
With Hall, RNH, Eberle and Whitney all fully healthy we are a good team. Add another good defenseman, bring up a young one and upgrade in goal, we are a playoff team.
Why sell us short? We have three of the best young offensive players in hockey. The key with young players is: they improve from year to year. Next season we could have three guys at 80-90 points - do we really miss the playoffs with a team like that?
Because you anticipate all 4 of our best players missing significant time again next year?
With Hall, RNH, Eberle and Whitney all fully healthy we are a good team. Add another good defenseman, bring up a young one and upgrade in goal, we are a playoff team.
Why sell us short? We have three of the best young offensive players in hockey. The key with young players is: they improve from year to year. Next season we could have three guys at 80-90 points - do we really miss the playoffs with a team like that?
How is Eberle missing 4 games and Hall missing 10 games significant games lost?
Where is this good defenceman coming from? You are assuming a good UFA wants to come here. I disagree.
Who is this young defenceman that is NHL ready? All I hear about our prospects is that they are at least another year away. Unless we are draft Murray, I doubt a young defenceman plays significant time here and is decent. The last thing we need to do is force a young player before they are ready. Typically, young defenceman in their first full season make a lot of mistakes.
Who is an upgrade in goal and where are they coming from? I keep hearing people saying Harding, but he has never been a #1 and gets injuried a lot.
You are expecting a full season of a healthy, solid Whitney. Why? In his first 2 full seasons with us, he has not been healthy, and now looks like a shadow of his former self.
Interesting you talk about pace when the Oilers' points improvement seems largely due to an unsustainable hot start. In fact I wonder how much that first month and a half coloured the overall picture.
That's ridiculous. The hot start was a part of the season last time i checked, they also had some unsustainable cold stretches too. Should i strike those from the record also?
You can't just exclude certain stretches of the season just to further your argument.
As another example, I could also say that Gagner's unsustainable hot stretch shouldn't count but in reality, it counts all the same.
I think that the team is improved in a lot of areas and significantly in some. If you don't believe that to be so, i really can't say anything more to change your mind because i pretty much outlined all the reasons that i think the team is improved earlier in the thread.
How is Eberle missing 4 games and Hall missing 10 games significant games lost?
Where is this good defenceman coming from? You are assuming a good UFA wants to come here. I disagree.
Who is this young defenceman that is NHL ready? All I hear about our prospects is that they are at least another year away. Unless we are draft Murray, I doubt a young defenceman plays significant time here and is decent. The last thing we need to do is force a young player before they are ready. Typically, young defenceman in their first full season make a lot of mistakes.
Who is an upgrade in goal and where are they coming from? I keep hearing people saying Harding, but he has never been a #1 and gets injuried a lot.
You are expecting a full season of a healthy, solid Whitney. Why? In his first 2 full seasons with us, he has not been healthy, and now looks like a shadow of his former self.
I think you need to find another team to be a fan of. I hear the Rangers are pretty good.
I think you need to find another team to be a fan of. I hear the Rangers are pretty good.
I'm a huge Oilers fan and have been since the 80's. I have no problem with the rebuild and the direction the team is heading, unlike a lot of posters here. I have patience and believe that this will be a powerhouse of a team for a long time once we pull out of this rebuild. The problem with this team right now is that since our run in 2006, we have had no elite talent, and it takes elite talent to be a cup contender. On top of that, our veterans have either sucked(Horcoff) or always injuried(Whitney, Hemsky). This is going to take more than 3 years of sucking to pull out of.
This team now has 3 elite players(Eberle, Hall and RNH), but a lot of holes that are going to take time to fill. We are seeing improvements in the team, and will continue to see some next year. I just don't see us making that huge of improvement in one year unless a lot things go right. Look how awesome a year Eberle is having, and yet, we are still at the bottom.
I'm a huge Oilers fan and have been since the 80's. I have no problem with the rebuild and the direction the team is heading, unlike a lot of posters here. I have patience and believe that this will be a powerhouse of a team for a long time once we pull out of this rebuild. The problem with this team right now is that since our run in 2006, we have had no elite talent, and it takes elite talent to be a cup contender. On top of that, our veterans have either sucked(Horcoff) or always injuried(Whitney, Hemsky). This is going to take more than 3 years of sucking to pull out of.
This team now has 3 elite players(Eberle, Hall and RNH), but a lot of holes that are going to take time to fill. We are seeing improvements in the team, and will continue to see some next year. I just don't see us making that huge of improvement in one year unless a lot things go right. Look how awesome a year Eberle is having, and yet, we are still at the bottom.
We are 5 wins away from being in the mix, battling for a playoff spot. Give us 20 more games of RNH, 10 more games of Hall and a healthy Whitney and I think we have those 5 extra wins.
One more year of improvement and we can be in the playoffs. Hell, add a real goalie into the mix (Enroth?) and I have no doubt we are a playoff team.
That's ridiculous. The hot start was a part of the season last time i checked, they also had some unsustainable cold stretches too. Should i strike those from the record also?
No one is excluding them. But if you are using that to create expectations for next season, you are likely to be disappointed.
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You can't just exclude certain stretches of the season just to further your argument.
Which is why I'm not doing that.
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As another example, I could also say that Gagner's unsustainable hot stretch shouldn't count but in reality, it counts all the same.
Yes it counts. But if you use that to make a bet that Gagner will score 8 points in one game again, you'll lose. That's the point.
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I think that the team is improved in a lot of areas and significantly in some. If you don't believe that to be so, i really can't say anything more to change your mind because i pretty much outlined all the reasons that i think the team is improved earlier in the thread.
I'm not denying they have improved from a statistical standpoint. The question of why and to what extent we can expect that improvement to continue is a fair one to ask, though since the whole point of citing their statistical improvement this season was to create expectations for next one.
No one is excluding them. But if you are using that to create expectations for next season, you are likely to be disappointed.
I'm just using the improvements in the record to illustrate that there has been an improvement in the record. They were 20 games below fake .500 to end last season and are only 8 games under now so they are clearly on a better pace this season and already have 1 more win in 16 less games and 4 less points in 16 less games so they are on pace to show a decent improvement in the win-loss record.
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Originally Posted by Little Fury
Yes it counts. But if you use that to make a bet that Gagner will score 8 points in one game again, you'll lose. That's the point.
I was referring more to his 10 game stretch as opposed to just the one 8 point game. I believe that he had 18 or 19pts in those 10 games.
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Originally Posted by Little Fury
I'm not denying they have improved from a statistical standpoint. The question of why and to what extent we can expect that improvement to continue is a fair one to ask, though since the whole point of citing their statistical improvement this season was to create expectations for next one.
Well, we really don't know how the statistical improvements will affect next seasons' team but i take it that these statistical improvements along with the many individual improvements namely the Big 3, Petry and Smid can only be looked at as a positive going into next season.
It's up to Tambellini to acquire the proper pieces to ensure that there are more significant improvements next season. We'll see.... This is a monster draft and offseason for him, it's time for him to start getting the wheels in motion.
I'm just using the improvements in the record to illustrate that there has been an improvement in the record. They were 20 games below fake .500 to end last season and are only 8 games under now so they are clearly on a better pace this season and already have 1 more win in 16 less games and 4 less points in 16 less games so they are on pace to show a decent improvement in the win-loss record.
Fine. But isn't the point to show that we can expect continued improvement next season?
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Well, we really don't know how the statistical improvements will affect next seasons' team but i take it that these statistical improvements along with the many individual improvements namely the Big 3, Petry and Smid can only be looked at as a positive going into next season.
Let's put it this way: I'd be a lot more optimistic if they were showing real improvement at ES this season, but I think there's a convincing argument to be made that the improvements we've seen came on the back of a hot goalie and the PP, two areas where simple luck can have a tremendous impact. Put another way: it's a bad hockey team and a bad hockey team that needs a heaping does of good luck just to be closer to mediocre is probably a really bad hockey team.
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It's up to Tambellini to acquire the proper pieces to ensure that there are more significant improvements next season. We'll see.... This is a monster draft and offseason for him, it's time for him to start getting the wheels in motion.
The question is whether Tambo really grasps the enormity of the task before him or if he's content to keeping on signing bottom of the roster guys at slightly above market rate while hoping for improvement via draft lottery.
Exactly how did you think we were going to make that big of an improvement coming into this season?
You know, re-building a team isn't about finishing deadlast 4 or 5 years in row. The draft plays a part but procurement comes from other sources. Smarter people than me have questioned management's pro procurement. That's how you rebuild as well. Christ, last summer, the Oilers signed Eager and Belanger and Hordichuk. Hordichuk hardly plays so why the hell sign him? Apart from his faceoffs (I give mngt credit here - they finally addressed a need) Belanger has been a disapointement. And Eager is finally coming around although he can be a lose cannon...
Here's a fact: I think alot of people who didn't expect much from the Oilers are underestimating how good Hall, Eberle, and RNH are. With that much skill up front why not try and shore up he defense? Do you seriously believe that Tambellini was in the dark about Ryan Withney's injury? If he was, the entire medical staff should be fired. My concern is that Tambellini is sold on Dubnyk. That would be tragic...
Difference between the Oilers and the Pens/Hawks? I don't know if Oilers management has what it takes to get NHLers to surround the young core like Pitt and Chi did. Just my opinion...
Fine. But isn't the point to show that we can expect continued improvement next season?
Let's put it this way: I'd be a lot more optimistic if they were showing real improvement at ES this season, but I think there's a convincing argument to be made that the improvements we've seen came on the back of a hot goalie and the PP, two areas where simple luck can have a tremendous impact. Put another way: it's a bad hockey team and a bad hockey team that needs a heaping does of good luck just to be closer to mediocre is probably a really bad hockey team.
The question is whether Tambo really grasps the enormity of the task before him or if he's content to keeping on signing bottom of the roster guys at slightly above market rate while hoping for improvement via draft lottery.
It's funny, everybody's making a big deal because the refs aren't calling penalties and how it affects the Oilers. That's how important 5x5 play is and how so many posters in this thread are missing the boat.
Look, I think it's great that they are #1 in the PP, but with Hall, RNH, Eberle, Withney, Hemsky, etc....it would be a complete disaster if they were 20th or 25th...Again, I think some posters have no clue how good these players are.
Difference between the Oilers and the Pens/Hawks? I don't know if Oilers management has what it takes to get NHLers to surround the young core like Pitt and Chi did. Just my opinion...
Getting star UFA's to sign here is another thing. If they don't push hard for Suter, if he is still available, is a failure on management in my mind. Pittsburgh got Gonchar, among others, and Chicago got Campbell, among others. We need Suter to be comparable to what those organizations did to get themselves to what they became. Its Suter or fail to do what Chicago and Pittsburgh did. Any trade for a top pairing UFA is going to strip this already hole filled team.
