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March 13: Voracek (mouth stitches) probable; Jagr (hip) returned March 8

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Old
03-07-2012, 09:01 AM
  #51
BernieParent
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Originally Posted by orange is better View Post
Didn't giroux "not have a concussion" after the game, the night Simmonds kneed him in the head as well?

I'll hold off on my disbelief after a couple days.
There's an excellent example of why the immediate news is less than absolute.

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03-07-2012, 09:39 AM
  #52
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The hit on voracek was a good hit to step up on, but it looked clearly like the head was the point of impact, and was targeted with the shoulder. I've only seen replays but im real surprised there's no review. These are the hits the league wants removed I thought.

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03-07-2012, 10:19 AM
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Sometimes players end up concussed after a mild hit from bad angle and sometimes they are run over by a freight train but (almost) no harm is done.

It's easy to jump at the Flyers medical staff but in fact concussions are very treacherous and symptoms may not show up immediatly.

We'll know in a few days...

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03-07-2012, 10:23 AM
  #54
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The hit on voracek was a good hit to step up on, but it looked clearly like the head was the point of impact, and was targeted with the shoulder. I've only seen replays but im real surprised there's no review. These are the hits the league wants removed I thought.
At what point does it fall on the player to lift his head and play like he's not the only guy on the ice. Kronwall changed the way he hits guys this year by turning his back to them when he hits them which usually prevents him from getting elbows and shoulders into the hit. On this particular hit Voracek not only looked up twice and ignored the oncoming hit, he also was lunging for the puck which I'm sure Kronwall didn't suspect and it didn't give him time to get his back towards him. I blame Voracek for this one and would be surprised by a suspension.

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03-07-2012, 10:33 AM
  #55
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At what point does it fall on the player to lift his head and play like he's not the only guy on the ice. Kronwall changed the way he hits guys this year by turning his back to them when he hits them which usually prevents him from getting elbows and shoulders into the hit. On this particular hit Voracek not only looked up twice and ignored the oncoming hit, he also was lunging for the puck which I'm sure Kronwall didn't suspect and it didn't give him time to get his back towards him. I blame Voracek for this one and would be surprised by a suspension.
Not only that but Voracek has played against Detroit a lot because he was with Columbus. He also was in the game where Briere was hit by Kronwall. I'm baffled with him because he looked up, saw him and continued to lead with his face.

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03-07-2012, 10:41 AM
  #56
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https://twitter.com/#!/TSNBobMcKenzi...17384825593856

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No suppl disc for Kronwall on Voracek. PPOC was head but deemed full body on body hit. Not a hit NHL believes should be out of the game.

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03-07-2012, 10:51 AM
  #57
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Shanahan is a ****ing joke. I knew he wouldn't suspend one of 'his own.' Imagine if Rinaldo had made that hit on a Red Wing. He would have gotten 5 games if not more because of his history, for intent to injure. So the players are different, but the intent is still there. If the NHL wants to allow head shots like this to continue, then at least allow the players to take matters into their own hands when they see their teammates get hit like that. Kronwall was running scared the rest of the night, passing it away as quickly as he could to avoid getting hit. Even Red Wings fan acknowledge that. Had he realized that Rinaldo or Coburn would simply start throttling him with no consequences after the hit, he wouldn't have made it in the first place... what a joke this league is.

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03-07-2012, 10:55 AM
  #58
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It was a clean hit. I have no problem with Shanny's call.

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03-07-2012, 11:00 AM
  #59
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I guess the league isn't serious about this head shot thing.

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03-07-2012, 11:05 AM
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Originally Posted by hckyplayer8 View Post
It was a clean hit. I have no problem with Shanny's call.
Same. Head wasn't "targeted". No elbow.

I do have a problem with kronwall not answering the bell after though.

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03-07-2012, 11:09 AM
  #61
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I guess the league isn't serious about this head shot thing.
Not a targeted head shot.

If you want to make it like slashing when a stick breaks....you will see the Danny brieres and mike ribeiros of the league face diving into people for the "automatic" call.

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03-07-2012, 11:13 AM
  #62
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If the league is serious about head injuries, those hits need to go. The head may not have been targeted, but Kronwall has proved in the past he doesn't make much of an effort to avoid a player's head.

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03-07-2012, 11:25 AM
  #63
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I do question if there was any other way to deliver the hit. He didnt jump. He didnt have his elbows out. He didnt have his arms high.

I dont think it's as bad as some of you are making it.

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03-07-2012, 11:31 AM
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Vicious hit, but I think it was clean. One of the things Shanny and co. look for is responsibility of the victim. Voracek put himself in a bad position there.

Our guys are droppin' like flies.

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03-07-2012, 11:40 AM
  #65
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It would be a miracle if Voracek didn't have a concussion.

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03-07-2012, 11:42 AM
  #66
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the hit was a dumb move on both parts. voracek needs to keep his head up and expect a hit in that situation, and kronwall needs to acknowledge that voracek has his head down. anyone who's played hockey knows that there are multiple ways you can take a player out of the play that don't include giving them possible brain damage in that situation. kronwall could have just as easily stood and shoved to get him off the puck, forced him against the boards or just poked the puck away. there needs to be respect for your fellow hockey player there.

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03-07-2012, 11:46 AM
  #67
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Originally Posted by orange is better View Post
the hit was a dumb move on both parts. voracek needs to keep his head up and expect a hit in that situation, and kronwall needs to acknowledge that voracek has his head down. anyone who's played hockey knows that there are multiple ways you can take a player out of the play that don't include giving them possible brain damage in that situation. kronwall could have just as easily stood and shoved to get him off the puck, forced him against the boards or just poked the puck away. there needs to be respect for your fellow hockey player there.
That's my biggest gripe about this whole thing; Kronwall is a noted big hitter who preys on unsuspecting players like Voracek.

He has done this MANY times over his career, and a few of them have been quite dirty (leaving the feet-which he used to do a lot).

And he has NEVER answered the bell. 0 NHL fights.

I have no respect for players who dish out hits like that but don't back it up with their fists.

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03-07-2012, 11:59 AM
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Someone on puck daddy posted something about the decerebrate position, in response to a brain injury.

I don't know if that's exactly it, but I found this on wikipedia: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fencing_response

Quote:
The fencing response is a peculiar position of the arms following a concussion. Immediately after moderate forces have been applied to the brainstem, the forearms are held flexed or extended (typically into the air) for a period lasting up to several seconds after the impact. The fencing response is often observed during athletic competition involving contact, such as football, hockey, rugby and martial arts. It is used as an overt indicator of injury force magnitude and midbrain localization to aid in injury identification and classification for events including, but not limited to, on-field and/or bystander observations of sports-related head injuries.

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03-07-2012, 12:02 PM
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Originally Posted by chimrichalds18 View Post
Someone on puck daddy posted something about the decerebrate position, in response to a brain injury.

I don't know if that's exactly it, but I found this on wikipedia: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fencing_response
this is interesting, but im not convinced that just because his body had that reaction that it means he has any brain trauma. it could just be a coincidence.

then again....

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03-07-2012, 12:04 PM
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Originally Posted by chimrichalds18 View Post
Someone on puck daddy posted something about the decerebrate position, in response to a brain injury.

I don't know if that's exactly it, but I found this on wikipedia: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fencing_response
I said this to my father last night at the game. I couldn't remember for the life of me the name of it but when I saw his limbs go stiff in the air like that I said immediately its a concussion. I always recall it happening much more in football, but knew that when that happened it meant the brain was injured.

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03-07-2012, 12:16 PM
  #71
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I have no respect for players who dish out hits like that but don't back it up with their fists.
wholeheartedly agree, i have no issue with the play, but you need to answer the bell. IMO he should eat a butt end to the face soon..."accidentally" of course.

IMO if simmonds or hartnell had been on the ice instead of Schenn
He would have been drug into a fight. Sometimes the instigator is worth it.

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03-07-2012, 12:21 PM
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wholeheartedly agree, i have no issue with the play, but you need to answer the bell. IMO he should eat a butt end to the face soon..."accidentally" of course.

IMO if simmonds or hartnell had been on the ice instead of Schenn
He would have been drug into a fight. Sometimes the instigator is worth it.
And Kronwall being the ***** that he is, 0 career fights even with a history of vicious hits, would've drew 7 minutes of powerplay time (instigator plus fight) by not even dropping them.

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03-07-2012, 12:21 PM
  #73
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The hit on Voracek and how he went down reminded me of when Coffey was accidently smashed by Lindros...I thought Coffey was dead.

Found an article from that incident..no video

http://articles.philly.com/1997-01-0...h-terry-murray

BTW..best quote from Coffey

Quote:
``Why can't I ever run into Pat Falloon?'' Coffey asked.

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03-07-2012, 12:26 PM
  #74
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My biggest problem with the play is similar to Bill. Where was the immediate whistle? It was obvious that a devastating hit had just taken place. It was obvious that the player who had received the hit was in trouble health wise.

That was not the time for the refs to wait for Flyer possession of the puck to blow the play dead.

It should have been blown dead immediately with the faceoff taking place to the right of Bryz.

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03-07-2012, 12:52 PM
  #75
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Quote:
Originally Posted by achdumeingute View Post
Not a targeted head shot.

If you want to make it like slashing when a stick breaks....you will see the Danny brieres and mike ribeiros of the league face diving into people for the "automatic" call.
Kronwall didn't HAVE to hit him in the head, and he did. It's not like Kronwall didn't have plenty of time to do something else, and it wasn't incidental. It's the kind of hit the NHL claims they want to get rid of. This isn't helping that, and it sends loads of confusing signals to the players.

Also, NO player is going to begin diving into hits headfirst, are you kidding me? "Woo! My season is ended, but I drew a minor! In your face! Or mine, really!"

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