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03-07-2012, 07:42 AM
  #126
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Weber will not cut it in the NHL. He was horrendeous once again yesterday.

The MAIN reason for the Habs woes this year is defense.

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03-07-2012, 07:52 AM
  #127
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habs need to shore the d, and get a big draft pick,

and demote gomer,

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03-07-2012, 07:56 AM
  #128
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Originally Posted by Kriss E View Post
Can't blame him really. He's been used like crap since he got here.


RC is such a horrible coach, it's pretty unbelievable. I really don't understand how this guy was given a chance. But it's not just from Gauthier, McGuire said RC was talked about as the next one from the AHL to graduate whether it was in Mtl or somewhere else.

I hope we win the lottery.
I have not said this before, but it is my growing opinion that most NHL coaches are a joke. Glorified cheerleaders.

It is well known the 86 Habs for example coached themselves to the cup.

Hockey is too fluid, too fast as played, for a coach to make that much difference.

Line matching would be the only thing that I see coaches useful for, and even then, player's could organize that themselves.

And line formation? I actually think coaches **** this up way more than players would, if it was up to them.

And strategy, positioning and tactics? All NHL players over 25 know this already, and could teach the rookies this themselves. This is the most ******** part of NHL coaching by far.

Just look at the sad sack coaches you see in the NHL. No psychology, no management skills, nothing of use to players who need to play and win the game, really.

I would love to see a good experienced NHL club go without a coach one year.

The coach position is a tradition, nothing more, and it should be reviewed. Maybe a brilliant GM might think of this one day.


Last edited by bsl: 03-07-2012 at 08:07 AM.
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03-07-2012, 07:58 AM
  #129
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Wow i just realized from last year, we are playing without Gionta, Gomez, Cammy, Kosty, Gill, Spacek, Wiz, Hamrlik and some what Markov.

That is way to much movement on a hockey team to have any type of team spirit.

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03-07-2012, 08:36 AM
  #130
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Originally Posted by blueinmtl View Post
I've always thought the Sutters were unimaginative neanderthals, yet it feels like the Flames can't ever get enough.

Do their fans think this Sutter addiction is holding them back?

Not that Feaster was the sharpest of GM's, but be interesting if he cuts a lot of ties and tries the overhaul.
Their last couple of drafts have been decent. I wouldn't be surprised to see Bartschi in the NHL next year.

Still a bad team though. And with all the injuries most of their decent prospects (and some non-decent ones) are already up with the Flames - Horak, Brodie, Nemisz. Backlund has had two big injuries this year so the jury is still out on him. Irving also looked decent when he got playing time.

The rest of their best prospects are still in the WHL, NCAA (Reinhart, Ferland, Arnold, Gaudreau, Ramage) and won't contribute any time soon. I don't see any real point in them blowing things up. They won't get a ton for the players they have.

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03-07-2012, 08:49 AM
  #131
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Originally Posted by bsl View Post
I have not said this before, but it is my growing opinion that most NHL coaches are a joke. Glorified cheerleaders.

It is well known the 86 Habs for example coached themselves to the cup.

Hockey is too fluid, too fast as played, for a coach to make that much difference.

Line matching would be the only thing that I see coaches useful for, and even then, player's could organize that themselves.

And line formation? I actually think coaches **** this up way more than players would, if it was up to them.

And strategy, positioning and tactics? All NHL players over 25 know this already, and could teach the rookies this themselves. This is the most ******** part of NHL coaching by far.

Just look at the sad sack coaches you see in the NHL. No psychology, no management skills, nothing of use to players who need to play and win the game, really.

I would love to see a good experienced NHL club go without a coach one year.

The coach position is a tradition, nothing more, and it should be reviewed. Maybe a brilliant GM might think of this one day.
No doubt. You know hockey....




Last edited by habitue*: 03-07-2012 at 08:56 AM.
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03-07-2012, 08:53 AM
  #132
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Originally Posted by OneSharpMarble View Post
RC = Tank.

Like I said before this team only needs a good coach and this season will just be a bad memory. We are much better than the standings indicate.
Really?

I counted 8 players on habs' lineup that are either minor league players, or 13th forward, or 7th dman. That sounds a lot like a 15th place team to me.

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03-07-2012, 08:59 AM
  #133
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Originally Posted by bsl View Post
I have not said this before, but it is my growing opinion that most NHL coaches are a joke. Glorified cheerleaders.

It is well known the 86 Habs for example coached themselves to the cup.

Hockey is too fluid, too fast as played, for a coach to make that much difference.

Line matching would be the only thing that I see coaches useful for, and even then, player's could organize that themselves.

And line formation? I actually think coaches **** this up way more than players would, if it was up to them.

And strategy, positioning and tactics? All NHL players over 25 know this already, and could teach the rookies this themselves. This is the most ******** part of NHL coaching by far.

Just look at the sad sack coaches you see in the NHL. No psychology, no management skills, nothing of use to players who need to play and win the game, really.

I would love to see a good experienced NHL club go without a coach one year.

The coach position is a tradition, nothing more, and it should be reviewed. Maybe a brilliant GM might think of this one day.
It would make for a good movie...........The coach dies and the veterans stand up in the room and say: Lets do this for (insert coaches name) . It would be a good hockey movie........Or maybe we could use Gomez as coach. He cant play hockey anyway so maybe he could be Head coach with Darche and Kaberle as assistants.

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03-07-2012, 09:06 AM
  #134
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Originally Posted by bsl View Post
I have not said this before, but it is my growing opinion that most NHL coaches are a joke. Glorified cheerleaders.

It is well known the 86 Habs for example coached themselves to the cup.

Hockey is too fluid, too fast as played, for a coach to make that much difference.

Line matching would be the only thing that I see coaches useful for, and even then, player's could organize that themselves.

And line formation? I actually think coaches **** this up way more than players would, if it was up to them.

And strategy, positioning and tactics? All NHL players over 25 know this already, and could teach the rookies this themselves. This is the most ******** part of NHL coaching by far.

Just look at the sad sack coaches you see in the NHL. No psychology, no management skills, nothing of use to players who need to play and win the game, really.

I would love to see a good experienced NHL club go without a coach one year.

The coach position is a tradition, nothing more, and it should be reviewed. Maybe a brilliant GM might think of this one day.
I think we had the ''opportunity'' to see just how important a coach can be unfold in front of our eyes this year.
Look at our record under Martin as opposed to RC.

Of course, you can say that a coach is absolutely garbage and unimportant when there's a guy like RC behind the bench. But when you have one that actually makes your team play better than what most observers pegged them to, which is what happened under Martin, then you know a coach can make a difference.

You never stop learning, even as a pro, players are still learning. It's not like they've learned everything that there is to know once they reach 25.

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03-07-2012, 09:26 AM
  #135
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Originally Posted by TampaHabsFan View Post
Weber will not cut it in the NHL. He was horrendeous once again yesterday.

The MAIN reason for the Habs woes this year is defense.
Partially true, but blaming things on Weber? Gorges has been terrible , and exposed, now that Gill is gone.

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03-07-2012, 09:28 AM
  #136
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Send Weber to the KHL next year (Poprad, Milan or Lokomotiv)...

At least we got an entertaining loss out of it!

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03-07-2012, 03:25 PM
  #137
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Weber seriously sucked last night haha. Poor Emelin stuck with this guy. I am a game close to name him janne veveber.

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03-07-2012, 03:33 PM
  #138
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I went to bed after the 1st. Any big hits, or anything of note to happen in the last 2 periods ?

TSN ****ing sucks. Why wouldn't they have Eller's goal in the highlights ?

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Old
03-07-2012, 03:39 PM
  #139
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Originally Posted by domdo345 View Post
Weber seriously sucked last night haha. Poor Emelin stuck with this guy. I am a game close to name him janne veveber.
The same Emelin who was out of position on at least 2 goals, because he was looking for a hit instead of the puck? Lets get real, Emelin's defensive play is probably worse than Weber's at this point and has some work to do. He's getting a free pass because of his physical play.

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03-07-2012, 03:50 PM
  #140
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Originally Posted by Habs View Post
The same Emelin who was out of position on at least 2 goals, because he was looking for a hit instead of the puck? Lets get real, Emelin's defensive play is probably worse than Weber's at this point and has some work to do. He's getting a free pass because of his physical play.
Which goals do you mean ? The first two, he did what he should have done. Though, on Iginla's cake walk to the net he should have smoked him, but stayed in the middle incase of a pass across.

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03-07-2012, 04:29 PM
  #141
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Weber seriously sucked last night haha. Poor Emelin stuck with this guy. I am a game close to name him janne veveber.
did you ever stop think that Weber wants a better draft pick? He's doing his best to help the tank, should be playing 30 minutes a game, same for Crapoli.

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03-07-2012, 04:49 PM
  #142
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I don't think any of our young dmen suck. Weber, Emelin and Diaz are all good prospects. The problem is that you're supposed to make prospects play with, at least, some decent vets. They will learn from playing with those vets. On top of learning from observing them, and talking strategy on the bench, they will also have stability, which is absolutely necessary for development. Emelin brings an element that we lacked so badly so he benefited from the most stability, but even then, he looked quite lost when he kept brin moved around and in/out of the line up.
That's why a guy like Hammer was great. He was perfect with the younger guys.

We just completely crapped the boat this year.

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03-07-2012, 06:13 PM
  #143
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Originally Posted by bsl View Post
I have not said this before, but it is my growing opinion that most NHL coaches are a joke. Glorified cheerleaders.

It is well known the 86 Habs for example coached themselves to the cup.

Hockey is too fluid, too fast as played, for a coach to make that much difference.

Line matching would be the only thing that I see coaches useful for, and even then, player's could organize that themselves.

And line formation? I actually think coaches **** this up way more than players would, if it was up to them.

And strategy, positioning and tactics? All NHL players over 25 know this already, and could teach the rookies this themselves. This is the most ******** part of NHL coaching by far.

Just look at the sad sack coaches you see in the NHL. No psychology, no management skills, nothing of use to players who need to play and win the game, really.

I would love to see a good experienced NHL club go without a coach one year.

The coach position is a tradition, nothing more, and it should be reviewed. Maybe a brilliant GM might think of this one day.
You make some valid points, but how about the Sens, the only major change they made was the coach, and look at the results...

Scotty Bowman once said, once the game starts it's all on the players...the one thing a coach HAS to do, is make sure the right people are on the ice at the right time...this is far more important than most people realize...

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03-07-2012, 07:47 PM
  #144
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Originally Posted by bsl View Post
I have not said this before, but it is my growing opinion that most NHL coaches are a joke. Glorified cheerleaders.

It is well known the 86 Habs for example coached themselves to the cup.

Hockey is too fluid, too fast as played, for a coach to make that much difference.

Line matching would be the only thing that I see coaches useful for, and even then, player's could organize that themselves.

And line formation? I actually think coaches **** this up way more than players would, if it was up to them.

And strategy, positioning and tactics? All NHL players over 25 know this already, and could teach the rookies this themselves. This is the most ******** part of NHL coaching by far.

Just look at the sad sack coaches you see in the NHL. No psychology, no management skills, nothing of use to players who need to play and win the game, really.

I would love to see a good experienced NHL club go without a coach one year.

The coach position is a tradition, nothing more, and it should be reviewed. Maybe a brilliant GM might think of this one day.
You're right about the 1986 Habs. Perron was a figurehead. After winning the Cup he sank to his natural level and had a short lived NHL coaching career. I had a chat with him in the 1986-87 season and he seemed to be as knowledgeable as a bag of stale popcorn.

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03-07-2012, 08:37 PM
  #145
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Originally Posted by FlyingKostitsyn View Post
And what should we do? Talk about how we can still win 15 games and perhaps finish 9th place? Moral victory?

Saying ''WIN!!!'' is pointless, so we say ''TANK!!!''. The Stanley cup for us this year is a top3 draft pick. Why not let Colombus catch us? only 10 points back now!



I find Bourque to be extremely disappointing so far. Once again the Habs downgraded and kept the wrong player...
It seems this organization has a little bit of a streak going when it comes to ruining players, coaches or GMs. at some point we have to wonder what goes on behind closed doors.
Until their is someone in charge of this team who is dedicated to winning and given the absolute freedom to do so, without constant distractions and harrasment that seem to come from playing in this city, I'm not sure we will win.
I'm still confident for next year in a naive sort of way, but we have to admit, the problems of this organization seem to stare everyone in the face and nobody can seem to do anything to fix it.
PS Tank

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03-07-2012, 09:56 PM
  #146
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Originally Posted by Kriss E View Post
I don't think any of our young dmen suck. Weber, Emelin and Diaz are all good prospects. The problem is that you're supposed to make prospects play with, at least, some decent vets. They will learn from playing with those vets. On top of learning from observing them, and talking strategy on the bench, they will also have stability, which is absolutely necessary for development. Emelin brings an element that we lacked so badly so he benefited from the most stability, but even then, he looked quite lost when he kept brin moved around and in/out of the line up.
That's why a guy like Hammer was great. He was perfect with the younger guys.

We just completely crapped the boat this year.
This.

I think if Diaz and Weber split time as the #6 d-man with a partner like Gill, Hamrlik or Spacek things would of been a lot better for their development. It seems like Weber lacks the physical stamina/strength to play anything near 80 games a year, half of that is more like it and Diaz isn't much better.

We didn't crap the boat, Gauthier did it all by himself. Hamrlik and Jagr (both who seemed to want to be here) and we could of been fighting for 5th or 6th place instead of bottom in the division.

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03-07-2012, 10:02 PM
  #147
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This.

I think if Diaz and Weber split time as the #6 d-man with a partner like Gill, Hamrlik or Spacek things would of been a lot better for their development. It seems like Weber lacks the physical stamina/strength to play anything near 80 games a year, half of that is more like it and Diaz isn't much better.

We didn't crap the boat, Gauthier did it all by himself. Hamrlik and Jagr (both who seemed to want to be here) and we could of been fighting for 5th or 6th place instead of bottom in the division.
Personally... I think we're better off where we are. Perpetually being a bubble team accomplishes nothing anyway. Jagr would've been here for a year or two and we wouldnt' have won anything.

Yes it's painful to be where we are but hopefully some good comes out of this. We get a new GM and coach. We get (hopefully) a top pick that we can build around.

We needed change and now we'll get it. I just hope that it's good change.

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03-07-2012, 10:51 PM
  #148
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Personally... I think we're better off where we are. Perpetually being a bubble team accomplishes nothing anyway. Jagr would've been here for a year or two and we wouldnt' have won anything.

Yes it's painful to be where we are but hopefully some good comes out of this. We get a new GM and coach. We get (hopefully) a top pick that we can build around.

We needed change and now we'll get it. I just hope that it's good change.
It needed to get done sooner or later.
Sooner, we might of gotten Seguin and later, someone else.

Ideally, we would of had better quality prospects to bring up and give them lots of ice time but c'est la vie.

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03-08-2012, 12:23 AM
  #149
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I think we had the ''opportunity'' to see just how important a coach can be unfold in front of our eyes this year.
Look at our record under Martin as opposed to RC.

Of course, you can say that a coach is absolutely garbage and unimportant when there's a guy like RC behind the bench. But when you have one that actually makes your team play better than what most observers pegged them to, which is what happened under Martin, then you know a coach can make a difference.

You never stop learning, even as a pro, players are still learning. It's not like they've learned everything that there is to know once they reach 25.
I think NHL coaching is akin to NHL goaltending. There isn't a huge difference between the most of the guys teams have in terms of consistent impact on their team's fortunes (although you can see large impacts over short periods of time from goaltending and probably from coaching too). The real limits of what most coaches can do get hit pretty fast (although I believe someone like Bylsma might be getting more out of his lineup than most, call them the Thomas or Lundqvist of this analogy).

The big impact is if your stuck with someone notably sub-par and it sinks your team like sup-par goaltending has sunk Tampa or Toronto or even Philadelphia in recent years.

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