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Old
03-08-2012, 03:04 PM
  #76
drewcon40
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Originally Posted by Edge View Post
I believe Smith's response to the criticism at the time was, "What do they expect me to do? Go out and get San Jose Sharks?"

Of course, in time, Smith just didn't know when to quit.
I remember when Smith brought in Scott Fraser, Trautwig said something on the pregame like "..and he's a former Oiler, and you know how that has turned out."

Scott Fraser - really? Gretzky, Messier, Kurri, FRASER!??

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03-08-2012, 03:10 PM
  #77
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Originally Posted by Jabroni1994 View Post
Why didn't Robitaille score as many with the Rangers?
It's very simple: Colin Campbell hated Robitaille. To the point where he called Robitaille up soon after he was traded to the Rangers and told him exactly that. Campbell did everything in his power to make him miserable. No matter much you love your job, no matter how much you are paid, when you have a boss like that life/work becomes very difficult.

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03-08-2012, 03:40 PM
  #78
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The Zubov trade wasnt Buhner for Phelps.

Zubov literally forced himself to get traded. He showed up to camp fat for the third year in a row. He was terrible in his own end in 1995, and then he got hurt and was out for 3 weeks.

Then, there was the tampering rumors swirling that Jay Grossman was talking to Savard about a Ricci-for-Zubov swap prior to the 1995 deadline.

After all that, Zubov was manhandled by Quebec and Philly's big forwards in the postseason.

Smith saw young, thuggish, towering rosters brewing in Philly and New Jersey, and didnt think Zubov was strong enough (or determined enough) to deal with the wars on a nightly basis.

In retrospect, it was a horrible trade because Robitaille was a whiny baby. But lets not forget the Pens traded Zubov just a few seasons later (for an aging Kevin hatcher no less), and they got to a CF with him.

Zubov was surrounded by great, great defensive players in Dallas, had a great goalie and a defensive minded coach. If Mike Modano can learn ho to play defense, so could Zubov, and he did.

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03-08-2012, 04:20 PM
  #79
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Brooklyn Ranger View Post
It's very simple: Colin Campbell hated Robitaille. To the point where he called Robitaille up soon after he was traded to the Rangers and told him exactly that. Campbell did everything in his power to make him miserable. No matter much you love your job, no matter how much you are paid, when you have a boss like that life/work becomes very difficult.
Is this the answer for every player that didn't do great here? The coaches hated him? Not picking on you but I read this for 3 different players so far in this thread.

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03-08-2012, 04:48 PM
  #80
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Originally Posted by Radek27 View Post
Is this the answer for every player that didn't do great here? The coaches hated him? Not picking on you but I read this for 3 different players so far in this thread.
Moving to New York if youre an established pro is a huge life event. Heck, anybody moving to New York as an adult must be humbling.

Robitaille was a high maintenance guy. Everything needed to be his way. He needed this kind of center, and needed this much ice time, and he couldnt play on this line, and so on.

Robitaille was a baby. He cried and blamed Gretzky when he was traded from LA, and when he cme to NY for a fresh start, he was out of shape and mad he wasnt on the top line.

That set the tone. Then when Gretz came aboard, they made Robitaille play both right and left wing.

Robitaille was ALWAYS benched. Always.

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03-08-2012, 04:54 PM
  #81
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Radek27 View Post
Is this the answer for every player that didn't do great here? The coaches hated him? Not picking on you but I read this for 3 different players so far in this thread.
Gartner did great here.

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03-08-2012, 05:46 PM
  #82
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To answer some more questions generated by this thread;

The 1991 deadline that brought Kocur here and shipped Kevin Miller out; I've always wondered way the team self imploded that year (I was just turning 10 at the time). John Ogrodnick was kind enough to answer the question last year on his Blueshirt Underground Interview;

Basically Kissio had a Charlie Horse that would not go away and Miller was subbing in on that line while Kissio was out injured. That line was serviceable. Kissio came back but never fully recovered even in the playoffs and once Miller was gone, the Rangers only had one effective scoring line that other teams could shut down. Kocur was brought in because Roger Neilson wanted more toughness. After that playoff disaster Smith threw a temper tantrum, and as German WOW's profile says, 1991 Playoffs=Moose.

Turcotte's career-Soon after the trade in 1993-94 that sent him to Hartford, he had a knee on knee with Yzerman and he took the brunt of the damage. It started a series of knee operations to which he was able to play about five more years, but never fully recovered. His game deteriorated.

As for the Neil Smith stuff and all of his trades, it hurt losing Amonte, Weight, and those guys along with Beezer, Gartner, Erixon, Greschner, Turcotte, and Patrick, it stunk not having them be around for the Cup, but my conclusion is that everything he did up until 1994 was fine (even Aaron Miller for Joe Cirella ) but everything after was a disaster.

The Zubov and Norstrom trades set the Rangers back years.

Even if Beuk never came back from concussions, can you imagine a Rangers D in the early 2000s with Leetch, Karpotsev (RIP), Zubov, Norstrom, Kloucek, Johnson, and then eventually Zidlicky to take over for Leetch? Not too shabby. They probably don't win another Cup, but they would have been in the playoffs every year.

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03-08-2012, 07:04 PM
  #83
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Originally Posted by mahonistan View Post
Also, trading Amonte for Matteau and Noonan was considered nuts at the time. Amonte was a calder winner and he had a lot of points at the time. Little did anyone know that Matteau would be a hero. All of that could have been undone if they had made that trade for Lindros from Quebec though. Kovalev, Amonte, Beezer, Weight, and 3 draft picks. We ended up trading Weight for Tikkanen. Tikkanen, Matteau, and Noonan were vital to the success of the team in the playoffs that year.
Yep

I remember being surprised we got a good player for 2 role players (Honestly wasn't a fan of Matteau ,, Only liked Noonan on Hawks)

In end it was ultimate win/win trade

Rangers got 2 guys who were clutch in cup run ,, Hawks got future 5 time allstar who scored 40+ goals 3 times as a Hawk


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Old
03-08-2012, 10:25 PM
  #84
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Originally Posted by Radek27 View Post
Is this the answer for every player that didn't do great here? The coaches hated him? Not picking on you but I read this for 3 different players so far in this thread.
How many of those players were phoned by their new coach after they were traded to the organization and told that their new coach hated him and hated the fact that the organization had traded for him?

This organization has always been of two minds about certain players--Neil Smith had his favorites, but named coaches who had different ideas and created situations that made it impossible to do anything but get rid of them. In the first half of his tenure, Sather put together groups of players without even bothering to see if they fit together--which resulted in many players being played out of position. And he named coaches (including himself) who were completely clueless on how create a team out of the group. Things have gotten better since the lockout, but there's still a certain amount of tension between who the GM signs and how they fit in as far as the coach is concerned. Renney and especially Tortorella have been much more successful in creating real teams that play hard--but there have been a number of bumps in the road. What happens in the next 2-3 years will have a lot to do with how we look back the period since 1994.

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Old
03-08-2012, 11:40 PM
  #85
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Quote:
Originally Posted by German Way of War View Post
The Zubov trade wasnt Buhner for Phelps.

Zubov literally forced himself to get traded. He showed up to camp fat for the third year in a row. He was terrible in his own end in 1995, and then he got hurt and was out for 3 weeks.

Then, there was the tampering rumors swirling that Jay Grossman was talking to Savard about a Ricci-for-Zubov swap prior to the 1995 deadline.

After all that, Zubov was manhandled by Quebec and Philly's big forwards in the postseason.

Smith saw young, thuggish, towering rosters brewing in Philly and New Jersey, and didnt think Zubov was strong enough (or determined enough) to deal with the wars on a nightly basis.

In retrospect, it was a horrible trade because Robitaille was a whiny baby. But lets not forget the Pens traded Zubov just a few seasons later (for an aging Kevin hatcher no less), and they got to a CF with him.

Zubov was surrounded by great, great defensive players in Dallas, had a great goalie and a defensive minded coach. If Mike Modano can learn ho to play defense, so could Zubov, and he did.
Let us not forget Zubov's two-pack a day habit. Nothing screams dedicated athlete like smoking in the showers.

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Old
03-09-2012, 08:35 AM
  #86
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Originally Posted by frozenrubber View Post
Let us not forget Zubov's two-pack a day habit. Nothing screams dedicated athlete like smoking in the showers.
Well, to be fair, mario Lemieux and Ray Bourque were/are heavy smokers.

But Zubov's smoking/Brighton Beach habits didnt help his case.

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Old
03-09-2012, 11:16 AM
  #87
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Originally Posted by White Plains Batman View Post
Turcotte's career-Soon after the trade in 1993-94 that sent him to Hartford, he had a knee on knee with Yzerman and he took the brunt of the damage. It started a series of knee operations to which he was able to play about five more years, but never fully recovered. His game deteriorated.
Not to turn it into a who's who of back problems, but I think Turcotte's troubles were also compounded by a worsening back. Bad back + bad knee = the beginning of the end.

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03-09-2012, 09:13 PM
  #88
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Originally Posted by frozenrubber View Post
Let us not forget Zubov's two-pack a day habit. Nothing screams dedicated athlete like smoking in the showers.
Yep, it really shortened his career.

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