I am in no way an expert, but I've seen probably 10 times as many AHL games as NHL games and I can tell you that progress is not always linear. Guys make two steps forward and one step back, and vice versa. They play well, get called up, get sent down, stumble, progress, regress. In other words, they react as most 20- or 21-year-olds do.
Caron is a hard worker and a talented kid who just turned 21, WAY too young for anyone to pronounce a "bust" (or even worse, "garbage"). He'll have his ups and downs, but IMHO he'll be a decent NHL player.
Do you think that he took an actual step back? Can you determine why, if so?
I've never called Caron garbage and I've always held on to the belief of patience... I've liked his potential. But I haven't been as vocal in support of Caron this season. And I have been pretty realistic as to what his trade value would have been (lousy).
I'm happy that my initial instinct MAY not have been incorrect.
I never watched him in juniors but I was impressed with his play at the beginning of last year. I'd like to see him on Bergeron's line again and get some pk time. What is his potential, 20-25 goals and 50 points at his peak while being one of our better defensive forwards?
His Memorial Cup play was like last night.
I don't think I'm wrong. His regular season was just solid nothing spectacular.
Edit:
He has been lights out in the playoffs so maybe we have someone to replace Ryder.
P.S. There are a whole lot of smilies missing in this post. HaHaHa
Glad Caron played well but from my limited viewing of him I'm gunna say it was a flash in the pan. He is willing to go to the net and might be a net presence on the PP is smart and cycles well but his foot speed and aggresion will never be good enough to take him into a top 9 role.
Hope he proves me wrong but I highly doubt he ends up suprising people like Marchand.
He is young and the key with young players is consistency. He might look like rubbish for a week or two but if the promise of the last two games is there then you have to wait for it and hope it develops into him being very good more often than not. I really like what I've seen the last 2 games though. Keep him on the 3rd line for the time being, we'll figure out where he fits in if he is still playing at this level when Pevvy returns.
Only time will tell with Jordie. He seems to have decent hockey IQ, good size, and decent hands. He needs to work a little bit on his skating, but he's still young, and has time to do so. He plays a lot better when he has confidence in his game.
Do you think that he took an actual step back? Can you determine why, if so?
I've never called Caron garbage and I've always held on to the belief of patience... I've liked his potential. But I haven't been as vocal in support of Caron this season. And I have been pretty realistic as to what his trade value would have been (lousy).
I'm happy that my initial instinct MAY not have been incorrect.
An actual definitive step back, no. Has he spun his wheels and vacillated a bit? I'd say yes, which is also not uncommon. A lot of people (including Julien) have mentioned confidence, and that's a huge factor. Especially for a kid like Caron, who plays much more of a power game than a finesse one.
And I know you haven't called him garbage, but other posters have (and worse).
Glad Caron played well but from my limited viewing of him I'm gunna say it was a flash in the pan. He is willing to go to the net and might be a net presence on the PP is smart and cycles well but his foot speed and aggresion will never be good enough to take him into a top 9 role.
Hope he proves me wrong but I highly doubt he ends up suprising people like Marchand.
Him doing awful was more of a surprise than him doing well, in my opinion. The kid is a bonafide first rounder who put up good numbers in Juniors and showed all the tools to be an NHLer. While he obviously won't keep up anything close to the torrid pace he's had the last two games I think he'll be a serviceable 3rd liner going into the playoffs.
i'll be more optimistic when he puts together something more than a 2 game hot streak. There has been very little to be excited about Caron, sans the last 2 games.
A two game hot streak is way to early to call him anything yet, he could score 2 goals in the next 16 games for all we know. I think he has looked amazing but way too soon to label him anything yet.
A two game hot streak is way to early to call him anything yet, he could score 2 goals in the next 16 games for all we know. I think he has looked amazing but way too soon to label him anything yet.
I can't speak for anyone else, but I'm not judging him based on the last two games. I watched him in the WJC, at development and training camp, and in Boston and Providence, and adding it all together is how I judge him.
In reference to the Pacioretty comparison, I think that is very accurate. Very similar players- big, strong, some mobility, great shot, good instincts. Hopefully he turns into Pacioretty, except without the general douchiness.
I loved Caron during his first stint here as a rookie. Said as much several times.
Then he went down to the AHL and didn't impress. And then he was brought back up here and continued to not impress. He always looked smart and looked as though he knew where to be on the ice and what play to make... But he lacked the ability to execute. It was frustrating to me that I couldn't watch the guy that I saw and had such high hope for just one season ago.
Seems as though he's getting back the promise he showed. It's just a (very) small sample... But I would really like to know WHY there was such a large stumble on the way to get to here. I blame our affiliate in the AHL and how that is being coached/managed. But perhaps that isn't... The thing is, I don't get to watch the Providence Bruins. So I'm only basing that opinion on what I'm seeing in the NHL and what Joe Colborne said after being moved the Maple Leafs.
Still hoping that there is some enlightenment from those more informed than I. But for now, I look forward to Caron continuing along this path to becoming an effective NHL player. If he can stay consistent, it's going to go a long way to helping the Bruins finish strong in spite of all the injuries.
I think you nailed it in paragraph 2 referencing the AHL affiliate. It`s becoming more clear to me, and this is based solely on the lack of development/growth that we aren`t seeing from those prospects down there that a greater focus on finding a true teacher is required there as it just doesn`t seem like the kids are growing as they did under Gordon a few years ago??
Kids are kids, inconsistent all over the place but.....there just isn`t a handbook on when and why prospects seem to either get "it" or don`t. Glad to see Jordan having a nice stretch, but I`m still going to keep in mind that he`ll still have stretches where he looks like.....well....a young player trying to find his way
Pretty common knowledge, I`ve been bangin the Caron drum a long time now, he`s not flashy, but it isn`t easy to find, nor teach a player, especially his age, attention to the details that he arrived in camp with in his rookie year. It`s all up to two things for me, confidence which allows him to feel he belongs, and a solid coach who is a great teacher (and some here still unable to give CJ his due)we are seeing both.
I`m still puzzled now by the diminishing yet still present view some have with Julien about his employment of younger players, not giving them equal chance etc....just not factual
I'll come clean I had him in every trade I proposed, but did also say 5 years from now he'd be a very good third liner. That said, he can be better- its on video.
If Chiarelli told folks he was an untouchable then he is a moron. He doesn't have to come clean, of course he was an offer. You think there were guys out there who aren't better fits for this team.
One robin don't make a spring but its a good sign of hope and better days ahead.
Your honesty is refreshing DKH, if he continues playing well (and I suspect he will but won`t continue with multiple pt games) I have plenty of leftovers of Crow from my Marchand predictions
Him doing awful was more of a surprise than him doing well, in my opinion. The kid is a bonafide first rounder who put up good numbers in Juniors and showed all the tools to be an NHLer. While he obviously won't keep up anything close to the torrid pace he's had the last two games I think he'll be a serviceable 3rd liner going into the playoffs.
Anybody who has a natural tendency and willingness to drive the net, go to the net or plant himself in front of the net as Caron does, will pop some goals, whether that`s 20 or 30 who knows, truth is, he`s a refreshing change on a team that has been noticeably absent when it comes to net presence.
Rumpy states "flash in the pan", no way, he`ll never be a flashy guy, he won`t be a multiple pt per game, not many are, but the kid is like Bergy in that he does a ton of things that never show up on stat sheets right, and the overwhelming majority of solid NHL coaches out there, love guys who can play that way
It sometimes takes kids who were bigger and stronger than alot of junior players and who use that to their advantage in junior more time to adjust to the pros.
The majority of players are as big and as strong and it takes them awhile to adjust.
More often than not I guy like Caron will take 2-3 years to really find his game as a pro.
His progression has been steady and as others have said Claude tends to take the slow approach with young players and once they gain his confidence he lets them go a bit more.
Not every prospect is going to jump righ into the NHL and score 30 goals and be a dominant player at 19,20,21...
It sometimes takes kids who were bigger and stronger than alot of junior players and who use that to their advantage in junior more time to adjust to the pros.
The majority of players are as big and as strong and it takes them awhile to adjust.
More often than not I guy like Caron will take 2-3 years to really find his game as a pro.
His progression has been steady and as others have said Claude tends to take the slow approach with young players and once they gain his confidence he lets them go a bit more.
Not every prospect is going to jump righ into the NHL and score 30 goals and be a dominant player at 19,20,21...
His progression is pretty impressive seeing as he`s been a yo-yo between the PB`s and the Big club, and that, in the eyes of many, may not be receiving the top of the line coaching in Providence when it comes to developing players.
I`m a huge Caron guy, happy about this little stretch he`s in, but more than aware that someone his age will, from time to time take steps back, and when he does, unlike a few, I won`t demand Chia ship him outta town. It`s because of this recent play that it`s imperative this organization be patient with him, kid works hard, is coacheable and it appears like it`s a case of him being able to put it together at the right time on a consistent basis.
His progression is pretty impressive seeing as he`s been a yo-yo between the PB`s and the Big club, and that, in the eyes of many, may not be receiving the top of the line coaching in Providence when it comes to developing players.
I`m a huge Caron guy, happy about this little stretch he`s in, but more than aware that someone his age will, from time to time take steps back, and when he does, unlike a few, I won`t demand Chia ship him outta town. It`s because of this recent play that it`s imperative this organization be patient with him, kid works hard, is coacheable and it appears like it`s a case of him being able to put it together at the right time on a consistent basis.
This line of thinking about Providence being a black hole for prospects not developing through poor coaching/teaching has developed a life of its own here.
While I'm concerned like you are at the poor team results in Providence, I don't know whether this perception is accurate or not. Perhaps the talent level is more indicative of the results, rather than poor coaching/teaching.
I'd be interested in hearing from credible analysts who are very knowledgeable about the situation in Providence. Does anybody come to mind? Perhaps Kirk, fans here who see a lot of Providence games, comments from Bruins management, etc.
This line of thinking about Providence being a black hole for prospects not developing through poor coaching/teaching has developed a life of its own here.
While I'm concerned like you are at the poor team results in Providence, I don't know whether this perception is accurate or not. Perhaps the talent level is more indicative of the results rather than poor coaching/teaching.
I'd be interested in hearing from credible analysts who are very knowledgeable about the situation in Providence. Does anybody come to mind? Perhaps Kirk, fans here who see a lot of Providence games, comments from Bruins management, etc.
Is this subject worth a dedicated thread?
I think it is, not sure where it would belong if under this board or what?? I have made my semi accusations about the situation. It`s one thing when a prospect or two is struggling to find his way but this team hasn`t really had a guy since Krejci who developed his game in the AHL then come up and play a significant role (well Tuukka too I suppose).
Is it an issue with coaching or..........I know it sounds unrealistic.....is it that maybe we have overestimated some of the prospects talent there???
Next year is huge in Providence, Knight/Spooner/Cross and I`m sure I`m missing some, will be there, they HAVE to have the right guy in place, maybe Cass is the man I don`t know, I just haven`t seen the results to say he is yet but I`ve been wrong many times before
I'm gonna be one of the few on here I guess and say that i didn't see it with this kid. I figured he was a good 3 zone player but even in this system maybe he didn't have the confidence in his abilities. I didn't think he'd be a bust, but I figured it would take him longer that he'd probabley end up in a trade, and have some success with another team. I'm hopefully wrong, and I hope the kid makes me eat crow the rest of the season.
Lucic is a 30 goal scorer and he doesn't have Jordan's hands
It's good to see the kid breaking out, just in time too
I see good things for this team in the future. 2011 wasn't a one time thing, and it's due to hard work
he reminds me quite a bit of a young Glen Murray (ever see the early Murray with the mullet)....Caron is about same size and same game- Murray could score but the similarities to me are errie. Neither seem overly aggressive by nature but Murray was so nice I can't imagine Caron or even Santa Claus being as nice as Muzz. That bull rush move the other night was an eye opener; lets face it, if you can do something once it can be done again- the last two games showed he obviously has NHL skills- good ones.
Just mark my words Jordan Caron is no Trent Whitfield.
