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Return of red line off-sides. Does it help or hurt B's

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Old
03-09-2012, 02:30 PM
  #51
patty59
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Does the redline make the the trap easier for teams?


If so, I say HELL NO... Don't bring it back.
Teams are going to trap regardless. Look at that 1-3-1. Some teams when they have the lead are just putting one guy in the neutral zone and stacking 4 guys on the blue line(Rangers, Bruins etc)

These coaches are brilliant and can pretty much figure out a way to choke out a game with any rules in place.

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03-09-2012, 02:38 PM
  #52
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Originally Posted by ap3lovr View Post
The concussion issue is an equipment issue. We need new equipment that is designed for a higher impact game...
Helmets need to be redesigned.
http://www2.macleans.ca/2011/02/17/the-aftershocks/

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Old
03-09-2012, 02:48 PM
  #53
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Originally Posted by reidy View Post
Might as well bring back clutch and grab too.

Terrible idea.
the 80's was clutch and grab and the oilers seemed to score. 446 times, thats about 150 goals more than the top team will get this year.

best team this year 3.65 goals a game
83-84 oilers scored 5.43 goals a game

the bruins that year scored 4.09 a game
and they were 7th

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Old
03-09-2012, 02:50 PM
  #54
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You know which surefire safety measure we're never going to see because it eats away the bottom line? A larger (wider) ice surface.

I'm not suggesting IIHF standards, but there's a happy medium where you allow for more speed by offering places to duck contact.

Tell me how much sense this makes: in a league where many players are 6'2" and 200+ lbs of muscle, skaters are going 30+ mph, and shots are coming in over 100 mph on the reg, they're using the same size ice they did when guys were smaller, slower, and less protected.

Look out on the ice when you're at a game: these guys are monsters and they look so bunched together. The ice HAS to get a little bit wider, but the owners of teams that sell out full barns every night stand to lose serious bucks from that proposition.

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03-09-2012, 02:50 PM
  #55
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Originally Posted by patty59 View Post
Teams are going to trap regardless. Look at that 1-3-1. Some teams when they have the lead are just putting one guy in the neutral zone and stacking 4 guys on the blue line(Rangers, Bruins etc)

These coaches are brilliant and can pretty much figure out a way to choke out a game with any rules in place.
bruins dump and chase game beats it.
red line tip dump and go hit a defenseman. then they control the puck with the cycle and no one takes it away from lucic krejci horton when they want it

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03-09-2012, 03:22 PM
  #56
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Not sure why they would even think about bringing back the red line. They say it's to reduce concussions but we're seeing those happen with huge body checks or getting hit against the boards. How is the red line going to help when Boychuk got concussed? How would it have helped Savard?

Seems like the NHL is just desperate to try anything even if it doesn't make a lick of sense.

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Old
03-09-2012, 03:32 PM
  #57
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Instead of adding more excitement, make even more electrifying teams like the Rangers and Blues! Screw offensive scoring!

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03-09-2012, 03:38 PM
  #58
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FutureConsiderations View Post
You know which surefire safety measure we're never going to see because it eats away the bottom line? A larger (wider) ice surface.

I'm not suggesting IIHF standards, but there's a happy medium where you allow for more speed by offering places to duck contact.

Tell me how much sense this makes: in a league where many players are 6'2" and 200+ lbs of muscle, skaters are going 30+ mph, and shots are coming in over 100 mph on the reg, they're using the same size ice they did when guys were smaller, slower, and less protected.

Look out on the ice when you're at a game: these guys are monsters and they look so bunched together. The ice HAS to get a little bit wider, but the owners of teams that sell out full barns every night stand to lose serious bucks from that proposition.
I'm in favor of it. I thought they should have done it when they were building all the new barns in the 90's like the new garden.

Look at film from the Orr days. That rink was even smaller than today's rinks and it looks huge because the players were so much smaller. And yes, slower.

Most folks don't seem to agree with us tho....

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Old
03-09-2012, 03:45 PM
  #59
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Originally Posted by misterjaggers View Post
Yes that is so true. Hemets were never designed to prevent concussions, they were designed to prevent contusions.

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03-09-2012, 03:47 PM
  #60
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FutureConsiderations View Post
You know which surefire safety measure we're never going to see because it eats away the bottom line? A larger (wider) ice surface.

I'm not suggesting IIHF standards, but there's a happy medium where you allow for more speed by offering places to duck contact.

Tell me how much sense this makes: in a league where many players are 6'2" and 200+ lbs of muscle, skaters are going 30+ mph, and shots are coming in over 100 mph on the reg, they're using the same size ice they did when guys were smaller, slower, and less protected.

Look out on the ice when you're at a game: these guys are monsters and they look so bunched together. The ice HAS to get a little bit wider, but the owners of teams that sell out full barns every night stand to lose serious bucks from that proposition.

Totally agree

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03-09-2012, 03:48 PM
  #61
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Originally Posted by panny2727 View Post
the 80's was clutch and grab and the oilers seemed to score. 446 times, thats about 150 goals more than the top team will get this year.

best team this year 3.65 goals a game
83-84 oilers scored 5.43 goals a game

the bruins that year scored 4.09 a game
and they were 7th
The main reason the scoring was higher was because their were only 21 teams and every team had talented players. 4th lines were scoring goals.

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03-09-2012, 03:51 PM
  #62
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Originally Posted by lopey View Post
The main reason the scoring was higher was because their were only 21 teams and every team had talented players. 4th lines were scoring goals.
I think it had more to do with ****** goalies.

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03-09-2012, 04:07 PM
  #63
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Originally Posted by lopey View Post
The main reason the scoring was higher was because their were only 21 teams and every team had talented players. 4th lines were scoring goals.
No, not true at all. It had a lot to do with goaltending...more specifically poor goaltending. It also had a lot to do with teams having guys who simply werent that good on the bottom lines. In comparison to today there are talented guys who play both ways as well as better (bigger) goaltending.

There is no question that today, top to bottom, there is far more talent than in the 80s.

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03-09-2012, 04:07 PM
  #64
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Originally Posted by patty59 View Post
I think it had more to do with ****** goalies.
Yeah that was part of it as well. Goalies are definetly better today. Equipment helps alot

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03-09-2012, 04:09 PM
  #65
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If it did turn into a clutch and grab league again, Lucic may very well slide himself into the top 20 players in the league. He would benefit. Seguin would not, however.

2 line pass violations used to be my least favorite thing ever.

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Old
03-09-2012, 04:12 PM
  #66
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Quote:
Originally Posted by patty59 View Post
I think it had more to do with ****** goalies.
This was my first thought too.

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03-09-2012, 04:13 PM
  #67
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Originally Posted by Bruwinz37 View Post
No, not true at all. It had a lot to do with goaltending...more specifically poor goaltending. It also had a lot to do with teams having guys who simply werent that good on the bottom lines. In comparison to today there are talented guys who play both ways as well as better (bigger) goaltending.

There is no question that today, top to bottom, there is far more talent than in the 80s.
This is true. now we get all the former Soviet Union talent that we didn't get much of in the 80's. Only the few that defected.

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Old
03-09-2012, 06:34 PM
  #69
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Originally Posted by lopey View Post
Yes that is so true. Hemets were never designed to prevent concussions, they were designed to prevent contusions.
They also need to tone down the shoulder and elbow pads. Right now they are practically weaponized.

Shoulder to chin checks are just as likely to cause injury as an elbow to the head, and the helmet cannot help unless a cage is added.

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03-09-2012, 06:39 PM
  #70
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lopey View Post
The main reason the scoring was higher was because their were only 21 teams and every team had talented players. 4th lines were scoring goals.
Pretty much the opposite of this

The NHL had 9 less teams and a continent less of players to draw from.

The higher scoring is because there were more crap players in the league and those crap players make mistakes which lead to entertaining goals like when dmen fall down turning backwards, or goalies let in shots from the red line.

IMO, the NHL is drawing from its deepest talent pool since the original 6 days. And the goals/game reflects that.

http://www.quanthockey.com/TS/TS_GoalsPerGame.php


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03-09-2012, 06:41 PM
  #71
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FutureConsiderations View Post
You know which surefire safety measure we're never going to see because it eats away the bottom line? A larger (wider) ice surface.

I'm not suggesting IIHF standards, but there's a happy medium where you allow for more speed by offering places to duck contact.

Tell me how much sense this makes: in a league where many players are 6'2" and 200+ lbs of muscle, skaters are going 30+ mph, and shots are coming in over 100 mph on the reg, they're using the same size ice they did when guys were smaller, slower, and less protected.

Look out on the ice when you're at a game: these guys are monsters and they look so bunched together. The ice HAS to get a little bit wider, but the owners of teams that sell out full barns every night stand to lose serious bucks from that proposition.
You are right, hitting would go down.

So you pretty much every other entertaining aspect of hockey. The game would be all about angling players off to the corner and "low percentage areas".

Also I read somewhere that retrofit would be in the range of 15mil per arena due to the fact the arenas sloped their concrete to the current rink size.

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Old
03-09-2012, 07:42 PM
  #72
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Originally Posted by Morris Wanchuk View Post
You are right, hitting would go down.

So you pretty much every other entertaining aspect of hockey. The game would be all about angling players off to the corner and "low percentage areas".

Also I read somewhere that retrofit would be in the range of 15mil per arena due to the fact the arenas sloped their concrete to the current rink size.
I wouldn't go to IIHF standards, but if you want to keep the speed of the game, you've got to give them space to keep the best players active.

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Old
03-09-2012, 08:20 PM
  #73
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Concussions will not stop until players STOP lining up their SHOULDER w/ an opponent's CHIN, period. Start showing bantams and juniors how to hit like Neely did, like men. A lot of times Neely just used his forearms, and followed through exploding w/ a push.

Also, see waaaaay too many guys turning into the boards when they know a hit is coming. The worst guy for that? Former Bruin Mark Stuart. He must do it three times a game when I watch the jets. He's gonna get killed.

Redline will do nothing but cause more whistles, stoppages, and choke offense even more than it already is. Especially considering the defensive systems implemented by the majority of NHL coaches today. Are they ****ing high?

I don't agree w/ the equipment issue, but fine, change the equipment, too.

Touch icing, keep hearing arguments to take that out. How many guys were actually concussed retrieving pucks? As opposed to those that were hit late in open ice? Still, rather see that go than to bring back 2 line offsides. Too easy to bottle up teams in the neutral zone as it is.

Accept that the Bertuzzi incident happened, that it was an anomaly, and allow the players to police themselves again. Take out the instigator rule. Intentionally hurt a guy on the other team, accept someone will hurt you, or your star player. That's after you sit for 5-10-15-25 games, depending on how big and often of a colostomy bag you are.

Yeah, i know, I'm dreaming. But, that's what they do in a perfect world. But, it's a pc world now, next everyone will be wearing little bells...

*tinkle tinkle...I'm comin' for ya...tinkle tinkle....*

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03-09-2012, 09:08 PM
  #74
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It sucks. They need to take the trapezoid out and let goalies play the puck anywhere back there and keep the red line out...

Easily just added 10 whistles per game.,,and a brand new generation of New Jersey Devils hockey...We be INCREDIBLY easy to clog up the neutral zone and bog down speed..Will also require the Bruins and other teams to look for Mike Green's and Erik Karlsson's because you are going to need a "4th forward" that can carry over the red line with speed.

Only plus is, teams will play the dump and chase more meaning the players will be even bigger and tougher and maybe create more fights with more teams playing hard nosed hockey.

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03-09-2012, 09:10 PM
  #75
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Neely08 View Post
Concussions will not stop until players STOP lining up their SHOULDER w/ an opponent's CHIN, period. Start showing bantams and juniors how to hit like Neely did, like men. A lot of times Neely just used his forearms, and followed through exploding w/ a push.

Also, see waaaaay too many guys turning into the boards when they know a hit is coming. The worst guy for that? Former Bruin Mark Stuart. He must do it three times a game when I watch the jets. He's gonna get killed.

Redline will do nothing but cause more whistles, stoppages, and choke offense even more than it already is. Especially considering the defensive systems implemented by the majority of NHL coaches today. Are they ****ing high?

I don't agree w/ the equipment issue, but fine, change the equipment, too.

Touch icing, keep hearing arguments to take that out. How many guys were actually concussed retrieving pucks? As opposed to those that were hit late in open ice? Still, rather see that go than to bring back 2 line offsides. Too easy to bottle up teams in the neutral zone as it is.

Accept that the Bertuzzi incident happened, that it was an anomaly, and allow the players to police themselves again. Take out the instigator rule. Intentionally hurt a guy on the other team, accept someone will hurt you, or your star player. That's after you sit for 5-10-15-25 games, depending on how big and often of a colostomy bag you are.

Yeah, i know, I'm dreaming. But, that's what they do in a perfect world. But, it's a pc world now, next everyone will be wearing little bells...

*tinkle tinkle...I'm comin' for ya...tinkle tinkle....*
Right on brother.... 2-1 games with 20 shots a piece.... Boring trap hockey played by all, for all 60 minutes...Going to be a disaster.

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