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Is Halak a product of his team?

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He is a product of his team. 23 13.53%
He is able to carry a team and he is doing it with Blues to some extent. 27 15.88%
He is a good goalie on a good team. 120 70.59%
Voters: 170. You may not vote on this poll

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Old
03-09-2012, 02:09 PM
  #1
begbeee
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Is Halak a product of his team?

Is he a product of his team and system or he is a really as good as shows his numbers?
Or is he a good goalie on a good team?

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03-09-2012, 02:21 PM
  #2
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He is definitely not Osgood.

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Old
03-09-2012, 02:21 PM
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MsChanandlerBong
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Halak is a very good goalie...he proved that countless times with MTL when they depended on him. He had a very shaky start this season but he has bounced back and St. Louis' goalie tandem is working out great. People just need to know that because of his small frame he will never be able to play more than 55 games a season, which is why things will work out great in St. Louis for him with Elliot.

A top 15 tender in the league for sure.

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03-09-2012, 02:39 PM
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vippe
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good team, good goalie

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03-09-2012, 02:44 PM
  #5
Dolph Ziggler
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Halak is a top 10 goalie IMO.

Now Elliott I would say is more a product of the team.

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03-09-2012, 02:50 PM
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Sevanston
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If you mean his stats are inflated beyond what they would be on an average team, yes.

If you mean he's an average or below average goalie, no.

If you mean going 1a/1b is fantastic for him since it will keep him rested for the playoffs, absolutely yes.

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03-09-2012, 02:56 PM
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ricky0034
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yes

even Brian freaking Elliot is looking good on that team this year

the real Halak is an average to below average starting goalie

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Old
03-09-2012, 03:04 PM
  #8
bleedblue1223
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the most underrated goalie on HF

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Old
03-09-2012, 03:25 PM
  #9
begbeee
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bleedblue1223 View Post
the most underrated goalie on HF
The most controversial.

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Old
03-09-2012, 03:46 PM
  #10
MessierII
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No Halak is sick. I maintain that Montreal made a mistake. Not a knock on Carey Price but Halak is better.

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03-09-2012, 03:53 PM
  #11
darglor
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Considering Elliot's numbers, I'd say it's a product of the team... although I do consider that Halak is a decent goalie too.

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03-09-2012, 03:55 PM
  #12
Erza Scarlet
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He's a solid goaltender but the Blues style makes him a product of the team. I don't think Elliot just got that much better. But he wasn't as terrible as people make him out to be.

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03-09-2012, 04:06 PM
  #13
bleedblue1223
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Halak has put up numbers on every team that he has been on. He is a very good goalie.

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03-09-2012, 04:12 PM
  #14
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It's easy for people to look at the Blues' defensive numbers and conclude that Halak and Elliott must be products of the defense. But if you've watched Blues games this season you'll see that they've both made timely saves to bail out the defense on a number of occasions. It's a case of the both the defense and the goaltending playing well. The goaltenders play well enough to give the team a chance to win and the defense plays well enough to provide support for the goaltenders. I won't say Halak is carrying the team but he certainly deserves as much credit as the defense.

Remember Halak's success in Montreal. It shouldn't come as a surprise that he's been this good for St. Louis.

As for Elliott, he's had some success in the past, has he not? With St. Louis, he's worked hard to replicate that success while eliminating his weaknesses.

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03-09-2012, 04:16 PM
  #15
shadow1
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Both. He's a proven goaltender but his 1.86 GAA is representative of the system he plays in.

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03-09-2012, 04:18 PM
  #16
The Note
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Of course playing behind the D he does helps, but he's still a good starter in the NHL

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03-09-2012, 04:19 PM
  #17
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Not as much as Elliott is.

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Old
03-09-2012, 04:28 PM
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I voted product of his team because I think Halak is best suited for a 1A/B role, he can't handle big work load of 65-70 games, mainly due to his 5'11 size. Last year he got off to a hot start, but he cooled off, he had no one to step in for him for a bit. This year Halak started off slowly by Elliot was able to step in, and give Halak a bit more time to regain his form, Halak seems to sometimes go on a bad streak and needs a bit of time to regain his confidence.

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03-09-2012, 04:28 PM
  #19
ponder
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I'd put more in the top 20 range than top 10. All goalies stats are somewhat influenced by the team in front of them, some teams allow a lot of high percentage scoring chances, some allow few high percentage scoring chances. St. Louis are a great defensive team, who do a great job of trapping in the neutral zone and limiting odd man rushes (which are one of the highest percentage plays in the game), so I think his stats look better than they would on a team like Toronto, Columbus, Edmonton, etc. When he played for Montreal, they also had a fairly tight defensive system. He's a legit starting goalie IMO, a top 20ish goalie in the league, but not as elite as his stats suggest. Calling him top 10 is IMO kind of crazy, no way I take him over any of these 11:
- Lundqvist
- Thomas
- Rinne
- Luongo
- Quick
- Fleury
- Price
- Kiprusoff
- Miller
- Ward

I think he's more with goalies outside the top 10, like Lehtonen, Niemi, Backstrom, Elliott, Pavelec, Anderson, Rask, Schneider, etc.

One thing though, why does him being small mean he can't handle a full workload? Of the current small starters, Nabokov had 77, 71, 67 and 66 game seasons, Theodore had two 67 game seasons, Thomas doesn't play a tonne (has never played more than 66 games in a season) but he didn't really break out until he was already into his 30s. Irbe is the smallest goalie I can remember, and he had seasons where he played 77, 75 and 74 games. I don't see how being small means you can't play as much, if anything smaller athletes tend to suffer less wear/tear/stress on their bodies, simply because they don't have to carry so much weight around.

I didn't vote, as I think he's a legit starter, but not the franchise goalie/superstar his sv% and GAA would suggest. Didn't really see the option for that one.


Last edited by ponder: 03-09-2012 at 04:40 PM.
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Old
03-09-2012, 04:41 PM
  #20
PocketNines
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Elliott was singlehandedly keeping the team in contention early when Halak was terrible. He stole a few games. At San Jose, at Philly, at Vancouver. When Hitchcock showed up, they both started playing well.

I know people need to come up with a reason for what they think is an aberration, but the Blues have one of the very best impact players in the entire NHL on their roster and it's gone underappreciated because many are chalking everything up to Hitchcock. You put a second year Peyton Manning on the Colts, guess what, they start winning. The Blues now have that guy and his name is Alex Pietrangelo. Beyond the huge effect having an impact player like that has on a team's success, the reason the Blues are winning so much is they have a lot of good players on the ice, and that includes two very strong goaltenders who have made skilled, timely saves again and again this year. Hitchcock doesn't come in and personally block the puck on a breakaway or an odd-man rush. It's at the point this season when I see a breakaway on either goalie, I assume either Halak or Elliott will save it.

Occam's Razor, people. If it looks like a player is performing really well out there, you know what? He probably is and he's probably good.

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Old
03-09-2012, 04:49 PM
  #21
Muminek
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He`s on a very strong team but also a talented goalie in his own right. The great stats are made possible by the system, but he would be an important quality player on any team, just with worse numbers.

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03-09-2012, 05:08 PM
  #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ponder View Post
One thing though, why does him being small mean he can't handle a full workload?
It doesn't... unless you're a Habs fan from the Carey Price side of the fence in that old debate. Outside of those threads, I've never seen people go on at length so much about the size of a goalie (especially one that is far from Darren Pang sized, for example).

Back on topic, he's the goalie his career averages suggest; not the one this year's stats do. His stats are better because of the way the team is now playing in front of him, and the Blues are better because of the way he is playing behind them. Wouldn't be surprised if he wins a Cup or two with St. Louis, and becomes the new Osgood who is well-respected for his accomplishments, but always given an * beside his stats because of the coach/team/system/whatever in front of him, or not being regarded as the clear-cut #1 of some tandems he has been a part of.

Now as for the poll, he has carried a team... not all the way, but through some pretty important and unexpected upsets. Is he doing it to some extent with the Blues now? Not nearly the same extent, lol, but there are plenty of nights when he's the biggest difference (and continues to be at his best when busiest), so sure.

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Old
03-09-2012, 05:17 PM
  #23
vezna*
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anyone who watched the 2010 playoffs wouldn't even ask this question

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03-09-2012, 05:18 PM
  #24
bleedblue1223
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Halak is 6th in SV% this season and climbing. He was 4th in SV% in his last season in Montreal. Halak is a very good goalie.

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Old
03-09-2012, 05:19 PM
  #25
Matthew
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Good goalie + Hitchcock + players buying into the system = Dominance.

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