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2012 NHL Entry Draft Talk 5.0

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Old
03-22-2012, 12:43 PM
  #951
Monctonscout
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WeThreeKings View Post
If we win all our remaining games and every other team loses their remaining games (impossible..)

Worst we can pick is 19th.
Realistically it's 7th. Say we go 6-2-0 to 7-1-0 and finish with 81 to 83 points, we'd end up passing 2 to 4 teams at most and pick 5th to 7th.

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03-22-2012, 12:46 PM
  #952
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The hate on Grigorenko is really strong. It feels like every Russians playing CHL (except Yakupov, and only god knows why) do not want to play in the NHL and prefer the money of the KHL. Yet, the only top prospect to do was Radulov and he's back in the NHL. At this point it's up to your guts feeling but does it ever feel like he has red flags everywhere. Yakupov and Galchenyuk are considered gods here and they have yet to prove they're healthy again and performing well again. Grigorenko posted a 40g/85pts season in his first year of CHL but HE has to perform during playoffs. And only Grigorenko can make more than these two if the KHL offer them more money. It's getting to the lame point of him being compared to Esposito. His stock is supposedly dropping yet at the beginning of the year he was ranked 7th i believe, and now he's second. This viral ''Russian factor'' is getting out of hands, applied to one individual and not the others. At this point I'll just ignore these posts and only give my reviews on the games I'll see him play.

I'll give a short update tomorrow on how he looked in his first playoff game.

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Old
03-22-2012, 12:52 PM
  #953
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Originally Posted by domdo345 View Post
The hate on Grigorenko is really strong. It feels like every Russians playing CHL (except Yakupov, and only god knows why) do not want to play in the NHL and prefer the money of the KHL. Yet, the only top prospect to do was Radulov and he's back in the NHL. At this point it's up to your guts feeling but does it ever feel like he has red flags everywhere. Yakupov and Galchenyuk are considered gods here and they have yet to prove they're healthy again and performing well again. Grigorenko posted a 40g/85pts season in his first year of CHL but HE has to perform during playoffs. And only Grigorenko can make more than these two if the KHL offer them more money. It's getting to the lame point of him being compared to Esposito. His stock is supposedly dropping yet at the beginning of the year he was ranked 7th i believe, and now he's second. This viral ''Russian factor'' is getting out of hands, applied to one individual and not the others. At this point I'll just ignore these posts and only give my reviews on the games I'll see him play.

I'll give a short update tomorrow on how he looked in his first playoff game.
Keep in mind that's for the armchair scouts here. I very much doubt any legit amateur scouts have actually any reservations about what he brings to the table.

Unless he falls off the map in the POs or has a really bad combine, he's pretty much a lock for the top 5.

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03-22-2012, 12:53 PM
  #954
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I'm worried about those pesky Oilers getting their grubby hands on my GRIGS

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03-22-2012, 12:54 PM
  #955
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Does anyone actually believe Grigorenko is not a top 5 pick? Even the haters pretty much all agree his upside is elite, the only argument that he's not a top pick comes from a scout who probably just wanted to get quoted on TSN.

Thinking Forsberg, Galchenyuk or Murray is a better pick doesn't make you a "hater". There's no reason to have blind loyalty for a player before he's even drafted.

Quote:
Originally Posted by WeThreeKings View Post
I'm worried about those pesky Oilers getting their grubby hands on my GRIGS
Oilers will be taking a defender, hopefully. There is a risk they take Grig because he's the only potentially NHL-ready forward besides Yakupov, but it would mean they are trading Gagner.

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Old
03-22-2012, 12:56 PM
  #956
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Here are McKenzie's top 10 rankings for the draft from last month, by the looks of it Dumba is compared to Subban and Grigorenko seems to be described like the next Malkin, but ONLY if he works on his consistency and work ethic etc.

I would love Grigorenko but I don't see it happening!

http://www.tsn.ca/draftcentre/feature/?id=58415

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Old
03-22-2012, 01:00 PM
  #957
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Dumba is my favourite of the defenders but I think if we go that route we are picking someone "safer" like Murray.

But hopefully we get Grig or Forsberg.

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Old
03-22-2012, 01:00 PM
  #958
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Quote:
Originally Posted by domdo345 View Post
The hate on Grigorenko is really strong. It feels like every Russians playing CHL (except Yakupov, and only god knows why) do not want to play in the NHL and prefer the money of the KHL. Yet, the only top prospect to do was Radulov and he's back in the NHL. At this point it's up to your guts feeling but does it ever feel like he has red flags everywhere. Yakupov and Galchenyuk are considered gods here and they have yet to prove they're healthy again and performing well again. Grigorenko posted a 40g/85pts season in his first year of CHL but HE has to perform during playoffs. And only Grigorenko can make more than these two if the KHL offer them more money. It's getting to the lame point of him being compared to Esposito. His stock is supposedly dropping yet at the beginning of the year he was ranked 7th i believe, and now he's second. This viral ''Russian factor'' is getting out of hands, applied to one individual and not the others. At this point I'll just ignore these posts and only give my reviews on the games I'll see him play.

I'll give a short update tomorrow on how he looked in his first playoff game.
Before this season he was seen as a contender for #1. His stock has dropped a bit and he is now a potential #2 depending who drafts there, he could go as low as #5 but probably at #2-3-4.

Nobody is suggesting Grigorenko or other Russians would rather play KHL than NHL...but young players' development is not usually linear. For example...If a guy like Pacioretty was Russian and could get big money(2-3 mil) in the KHL he may have been gone before last year's break out season. If Filatov and Zherdev were Canadians they'd still be in NA trying to make it in the NHL and this useable/tradeable assets. One of the reasons we got next to nothing for SK is because if the team taht got him tried to send him down or not give him enough ice time he could bolt for the KHL(plus he had baggage off ice).

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03-22-2012, 01:04 PM
  #959
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Em Ancien View Post
Keep in mind that's for the armchair scouts here. I very much doubt any legit amateur scouts have actually any reservations about what he brings to the table.

Unless he falls off the map in the POs or has a really bad combine, he's pretty much a lock for the top 5.
********.

The concerns on Grigorenko come from pro scouts. Nobody is doubting his skill scouts are questioning his desire and work ethic.

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Old
03-22-2012, 01:07 PM
  #960
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Carey Price View Post
********.

The concerns on Grigorenko come from pro scouts. Nobody is doubting his skill scouts are questioning his desire and work ethic.
From 'a' pro scout would be more accurate. Could just be smoke and mirrors for all we know.

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Old
03-22-2012, 01:09 PM
  #961
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Originally Posted by Em Ancien View Post
From 'a' pro scout would be more accurate. Could just be smoke and mirrors for all we know.
I know a few NHL scouts and have heard those concerns from two of them without prompting. Do you think no others have the same concerns?

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03-22-2012, 01:17 PM
  #962
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Originally Posted by Carey Price View Post
I know a few NHL scouts and have heard those concerns from two of them without prompting. Do you think no others have the same concerns?
Maybe some do, but it's not a real red flag to me. For one, he wouldn't be sticking in the top 5 talks. For two, there have been plenty of players with low compete levels and they didn't look like Grigorenko. They looked like Stefanovich, Fedorov Jr., Gilbert, Wellwood, etc. He's at least on par with guys like Getzlaf, Staal, Lecavalier, etc.

I just don't buy it, since it happens every single year that some red flags suddenly pop up. He just got unlucky because 2 of the top 4 forwards were hidden away for most of the year.

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03-22-2012, 02:24 PM
  #963
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Em Ancien View Post
Maybe some do, but it's not a real red flag to me. For one, he wouldn't be sticking in the top 5 talks. For two, there have been plenty of players with low compete levels and they didn't look like Grigorenko. They looked like Stefanovich, Fedorov Jr., Gilbert, Wellwood, etc. He's at least on par with guys like Getzlaf, Staal, Lecavalier, etc.

I just don't buy it, since it happens every single year that some red flags suddenly pop up. He just got unlucky because 2 of the top 4 forwards were hidden away for most of the year.
If Bob McKenzie is saying it, I put a lot of faith in his opinion. He's been doing this for years and trusts his contacts immensely.

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03-22-2012, 02:29 PM
  #964
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If Bob McKenzie is saying it, I put a lot of faith in his opinion. He's been doing this for years and trusts his contacts immensely.
The writing is made by Grant McCagg and not Bob himself.

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Old
03-22-2012, 02:32 PM
  #965
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Now the Habs have Moen,Staubitz and White to protect their teammates,it may be time to look long term for a heavyweight like Cody Beach of the Moose Jaw Warriors.He could be the perfect tonic needed to assure the normal growth of the Habs young prospects. A 6'6 RW behemoth to play alongside the draft pick this year and Tinordi in another year or two,perfect having them learn and grow together as teammates.

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Old
03-22-2012, 02:41 PM
  #966
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Now the Habs have Moen,Staubitz and White to protect their teammates,it may be time to look long term for a heavyweight like Cody Beach of the Moose Jaw Warriors.He could be the perfect tonic needed to assure the normal growth of the Habs young prospects. A 6'6 RW behemoth to play alongside the draft pick this year and Tinordi in another year or two,perfect having them learn and grow together as teammates.
We already have Schultz Conboy Dietz Tinordi Didier. I could see us signing somebody in another year if Conboy leaves.

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Old
03-22-2012, 02:42 PM
  #967
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The writing is made by Grant McCagg and not Bob himself.
Still his sources.

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03-22-2012, 02:44 PM
  #968
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Still his sources.
Yet he's still ranked 2nd overall in his midterm rankings.

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03-22-2012, 02:54 PM
  #969
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Still his sources.
Yeah, I heard rumblings of questionable work ethic for other players before. I just don't buy it when it comes late into the season after they've been on his dick the whole year.

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Old
03-22-2012, 03:15 PM
  #970
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I honestly doubt the motivation problems with having Roy as your head coach. I'd take that chance with the talent he has anyways

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03-22-2012, 03:17 PM
  #971
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I honestly doubt the motivation problems with having Roy as your head coach. I'd take that chance with the talent he has anyways
Huh?

Roy has had a lot of unmotivated players with a lot of talent, just ask the Maple Leafs about Stefanovich.

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03-22-2012, 03:20 PM
  #972
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Huh?

Roy has had a lot of unmotivated players with a lot of talent, just ask the Maple Leafs about Stefanovich.
He ripped him in the medias too. Why didn't he do it with Grigo if is he's such a lazy ass???

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Old
03-22-2012, 03:53 PM
  #973
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He ripped him in the medias too. Why didn't he do it with Grigo if is he's such a lazy ass???
When did he rip Stefanovich in the media?

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Old
03-22-2012, 03:56 PM
  #974
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When did he rip Stefanovich in the media?

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Old
03-22-2012, 04:02 PM
  #975
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Quote:
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...
This just re-inforces my opinion that Roy would be an amazing coach for us. I don't think it will be a circus, he seems very tactical and poised in front of the cameras. Wow.

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