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Old
03-13-2012, 02:55 PM
  #1
Stephen
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Which group was worse?

Which group of players is worse?

Hagman, Blake, Kubina and Finger?

Or

Connolly, Armstrong, Komisarek and Lebda?

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03-13-2012, 02:57 PM
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shaner89
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Lack

And it's Lombardi, not lebda

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03-13-2012, 02:58 PM
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Giuseppe Sallo
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THIS group... because this team was good enough to make the playoffs.

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03-13-2012, 02:58 PM
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Michael Gary Scott
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Stephen View Post
Which group of players is worse?

Hagman, Blake, Kubina and Finger?

Or

Connolly, Armstrong, Komisarek and Lebda?
Connolly>Hagman
Armstrong=Blake
Kubina>Komisarek
Finger>Lebad

Edge to the Hagman group. Sad...

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Old
03-13-2012, 02:59 PM
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bobbyflex
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Quote:
Originally Posted by shaner89 View Post
Lack

And it's Lombardi, not lebda
add Schenn to LACK:

SLACK

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Old
03-13-2012, 02:59 PM
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Stephen
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Quote:
Originally Posted by shaner89 View Post
Lack

And it's Lombardi, not lebda
Just UFAs...

Add Beauchemin too

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Old
03-13-2012, 03:04 PM
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iPunch
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bobbyflex View Post
add Schenn to LACK:

SLACK

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Old
03-13-2012, 03:06 PM
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Funk Volume
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The group we have now is definitely worse.

Hagman was a talented player (when he wanted to be). Alexei Kovalev syndrome.
Blake was extremely overpaid, but at least we got 20+ goals outta him.
Kubina should've never been traded IMO. He's better than Komisarek at both ends of the ice.
Finger could be a good bottom pairing defenceman at like 1.5M, not 3.5.

Connolly is similar to Hagman. Lots of talent, but the drive isnt there.
Komisarek was made by Andrei Markov. Easily to look good(apparently even all-star good in the eyes of Habs fans) when playing with an elite defenceman.
Lombardi is Fredrik Sjostrom 2.0. All speed and nothing else.
Lebda......lol.

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Old
03-13-2012, 03:10 PM
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LetzgoEggo
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Michael Gary Scott View Post
Connolly>Hagman
Armstrong=Blake
Kubina>Komisarek
Finger>Lebad

Edge to the Hagman group. Sad...
Come on Army better than Blake? I don't agree with that. Sad but you have to give it to the LACK group. Anybody remember the salaries?

Edit: Found salaries:

Hagman 3mil
Blake 4.5
Kubina 5
Finger 3.5

Just to hit it home, previously Blake or currently Komi get $54,878.05 for each and every hockey game.


Last edited by LetzgoEggo: 03-13-2012 at 03:22 PM.
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Old
03-13-2012, 03:12 PM
  #10
Terrence
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Lebda was bad, but Finger was worse. At least Lebda has a spot (temporarily) on a NHL roster. I highly doubt Finger will get anything more than a Pro Tryout Contract next season. The way I see it:

Connolly>Hagman
Armstrong<Blake
Komisarek<Kubina
Lebda>Finger

Pretty even, imo.

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Old
03-13-2012, 03:18 PM
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hockeyfanz
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LetzgoEggo View Post
Come on Army better than Blake? I don't agree with that. Sad but you have to give it to the LACK group. Anybody remember the salaries?
Agreed...Blake was overpaid but not useless. He was frustrating at times but the guy did produce some points. Army does nothing. Useless.

Re Op, the current day FAs are worse IMO. Kubina was decent. So was Blake. Hagman scored 27? I believe for the Leafs and I have always argued tha Komisarek is no better than Jeff Finger. Only reason Finger is in the AHL and Komisarek is not is because of Komi's NMC, imo.

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03-13-2012, 03:18 PM
  #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Stephen View Post
Which group of players is worse?

Hagman, Blake, Kubina and Finger?

Or

Connolly, Armstrong, Komisarek and Lebda?
You could take your question of which group is better to the higher level..

The 2008-09 team Burke inherited with Blake, Pony, Stajan and Antropov and company scored 250 goals for.

The current 2011-12 team & 3 full season later with Kessel, Lupul & co. has scored 200 goals in 69 games = 238 goals for on a full season.

So it means the current group is weaker offensively than the previous group.

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03-13-2012, 03:20 PM
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Phion Keneuf
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this one is worse ... ainec

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Old
03-13-2012, 03:21 PM
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EazyB97
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First group is better. Finger's the worst player of the bunch on the worst deal, but Hagman, Blake and Kubina were all useful to varying degrees. Connolly is the only regular from that list of players with the Leafs, hopefully Army and Komisarek can turn things around though.

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03-13-2012, 03:25 PM
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ponder
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Matching them up by style:
- Speedy forward: Blake was a bit better than Lombardi
- Big dman: Kubina was way better than Komi
- Skilled but inconsistent forward: Hagman was a bit better than Connolly
- Leftover guys who don't match at all: Finger was wayyyyyyy worse than Armstrong

Overall I'd say the old useless group was a touch better, but not by much. Not sure if including Kubina in such a group is fair though, he was a pretty good dman.

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03-13-2012, 03:41 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by EazyB97 View Post
First group is better. Finger's the worst player of the bunch on the worst deal, but Hagman, Blake and Kubina were all useful to varying degrees. Connolly is the only regular from that list of players with the Leafs, hopefully Army and Komisarek can turn things around though.
2008-09 - Jeff Finger (@$3.5 mil cap) - 66 games 6 goals 17 assists 23 points & 43 Pims & -7
2010-11 - Mike Komisarek - (@$4.5 mil) - 35 games 1 goal 3 assists 4 point & 30 pims & -7

Easy win for Finger bang for buck.

A better comparison to Finger statistically and Cap hit would be JM Liles.

2010-11 John-Michael Liles (@$4.2 mil) - 53 games 5 goals 19 assists 24 points & 18 Pims & -10

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Old
03-13-2012, 03:47 PM
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hockeyfanz
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mess View Post
2008-09 - Jeff Finger (@$3.5 mil cap) - 66 games 6 goals 17 assists 23 points & 43 Pims & -7
2010-11 - Mike Komisarek - (@$4.5 mil) - 35 games 1 goal 3 assists 4 point & 30 pims & -7

Easy win for Finger bang for buck.

A better comparison to Finger statistically and Cap hit would be JM Liles.

2010-11 John-Michael Liles (@$4.2 mil) - 53 games 5 goals 19 assists 24 points & 18 Pims & -10
I love how Finger gets the treatment as this "horrible signing" when there are at least 4 contracts on the current club just as awful or worse.

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03-13-2012, 03:50 PM
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Igy
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LACK is definitely worse...

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03-13-2012, 03:54 PM
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I'd have to say the Hagman/Blake group.

As poor as that group was, they were at least somewhat serviceable and had (limited) trade value.

The guys we have now won't/can't be moved.

That in itself, is very, very depressing

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03-13-2012, 03:59 PM
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Terrence
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Originally Posted by Tak7 View Post
I'd have to say the Hagman/Blake group.

As poor as that group was, they were at least somewhat serviceable and had (limited) trade value.

The guys we have now won't/can't be moved.

That in itself, is very, very depressing
People said the same things about Stajan, Hagman, Mayers, Blake, Toskala, and to an extent Beauch. Although it looks bleak, you never know what Burke could be able to pull off.

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03-13-2012, 04:38 PM
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Mess
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hockeyfanz View Post
I love how Finger gets the treatment as this "horrible signing" when there are at least 4 contracts on the current club just as awful or worse.
Kubina and our captain Phaneuf are comparable.

2008-09 - Pavel Kubina (@$5.0 mil) - 82 games 14 goals 26 assists 40 points, 94 pims
2011-12 - Dion Phaneuf (@$6.5 mil) - 69 games 9 goals 31 assists 40 points, 72 pims

Jason Blake statistically is our Joffrey Lupul comparison.

2008-09 - Jason Blake (@$4.0 mil) --- 78 games 25 goals 38 assists 63 points 40 pims
2011-12 - Joffrey Lupul (@$4.25 mil) - 66 games 25 goals 42 assists 67 points 48 pims

Not sure why Blake and Kubina are being compared to L.A.C.K. when Cap hit verses production of the inherited player is comparative to our best players now Phaneuf and Lupul.

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Old
03-13-2012, 04:44 PM
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Busher Jackson
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Stephen View Post
Which group of players is worse?

Hagman, Blake, Kubina and Finger?

Or

Connolly, Armstrong, Komisarek and Lebda?
The last group is worse by far. Trading Kubina for a bag of pucks then using to the cap space to sign Komisarek was truly stupid. Army has 9 goals for his millions. And Connolly ... uhg. Hagman and Blake had a couple of productive seasons. And Finger is better than Lebda.


Last edited by Busher Jackson: 03-13-2012 at 04:53 PM.
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Old
03-13-2012, 04:46 PM
  #23
Tak7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Terrence View Post
People said the same things about Stajan, Hagman, Mayers, Blake, Toskala, and to an extent Beauch. Although it looks bleak, you never know what Burke could be able to pull off.
That's actually a good point - there were a lot of people that said the same things then, that are being said about Armstrong, Connolly, and Komisarek now pertaining to moving those contracts.

I do feel though, that those players had some trade value, and at the very least could be packaged with other guys on the team (like an Ian White, etc) who had value to move them out of town.

Now though - I don't think many teams are willing to touch those contracts until they start losing some term, and there's not too many valuable assets that I see Burke moving (at least not until he's sorted out a #1C or a #1G).

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03-13-2012, 04:47 PM
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i also think we are in a better cap situation now.

While these contracts are bad and depressing to look at, I do think that the next few years are pretty cap friendly for us pertaining to money coming off the books.

They are bad contracts, but I highly doubt they are hampering us in anyway. It's not like the Leafs had a deal in place for Nash etc., but it got blocked because we didn't have the cap room

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Old
03-13-2012, 05:15 PM
  #25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mess View Post
You could take your question of which group is better to the higher level..

The 2008-09 team Burke inherited with Blake, Pony, Stajan and Antropov and company scored 250 goals for.

The current 2011-12 team & 3 full season later with Kessel, Lupul & co. has scored 200 goals in 69 games = 238 goals for on a full season.

So it means the current group is weaker offensively than the previous group.
Or maybe it's tougher to score in the league now. But anyways we are a ****** team and its surprising how this team can't make the playoffs and have been worse than when JFJ was here. If anything the kessel trade seemed to kick off this ****** play. How do we go from being a 9th place team the year burke came late in the season to 2nd last in burke's first full season when all we did was add kessel who didn't cost us any roster players. I'm not blaming kessel as he is a gifted player but I'd rather undo that trade.

We could have had him for kaberle + 1st (just make sure it wasn't the 2009 first and we'd still be able to tank)

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