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Team that can't make the playoffs vs. Team that can still make them

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Old
03-15-2012, 06:27 AM
  #76
Columbus Mike
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Why is it that every time we play in Edmonton, the picture is awesome. Are the cameras closer to the ice, the lighting better? the HD truly is spectacular.

That's about the only positive of the night. Oh, and being so much closer to clinching the #2 pick.

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03-15-2012, 07:03 AM
  #77
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Ryan Nugent Hopkins goal & an assist
Taylor Hall - goal

Let's definitely trade our number one pick

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Old
03-15-2012, 07:45 AM
  #78
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The Wave?
Heh, I thought I was back in 1984 for a moment when I saw that.

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03-15-2012, 08:49 AM
  #79
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Originally Posted by Crede777 View Post
We have the least talented group of forwards in the NHL.
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And that's WITH Rick Nash.
Didn't see a minute of the game, but I've read the reports and this thread. What this says to me, Crede and lee, is that those who think we're a tweek away from contention are mistaken. I'm as firm as anyone in the wish that Nash play his entire career with the CBJ, but games like this prove that to be unwise. There is not enough talent here, and just bringing in a goalie and a top defender is not enough. Other than the captain, there's nothing here that will garner useful talent in trade and the mess on the ice will do nothing to attract free agents with any self-respect. Nash has to bring a significant package back, the first round pick must either be an immediate star or be traded for more significant improvements, and a whole lot of chaff (fan favorites among them) have to be cut loose. This team was dominated by the #29 team in the league. We deserve to be in the basement and it's a long climb out. There is a daunting Lack Of Talent, no matter how some hate to hear that said! A major turnover and infusion of quality talent is needed.

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03-15-2012, 08:53 AM
  #80
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Gawd that was AWFUL. The CBJ looked like an AHL team or a team tanking for the #1 draft pick. Stink Stank Stunk.

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03-15-2012, 09:37 AM
  #81
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Originally Posted by IBleedUnionBlue View Post
Gawd that was AWFUL. The CBJ looked like an AHL team or a team tanking for the #1 draft pick. Stink Stank Stunk.
I couldn't bear to watch the 3rd period. The 29th and 30th place teams in the league lived up to the billing

We haven't played that bad in a long time.

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03-15-2012, 09:38 AM
  #82
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Originally Posted by Columbus Mike View Post
Why is it that every time we play in Edmonton, the picture is awesome. Are the cameras closer to the ice, the lighting better? the HD truly is spectacular.

That's about the only positive of the night. Oh, and being so much closer to clinching the #2 pick.
Personally I do not like games in EDM on tv because the cameras are on the bench side of the ice which completely screws my head up.

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03-15-2012, 09:48 AM
  #83
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Originally Posted by pete goegan View Post
Didn't see a minute of the game, but I've read the reports and this thread. What this says to me, Crede and lee, is that those who think we're a tweek away from contention are mistaken. I'm as firm as anyone in the wish that Nash play his entire career with the CBJ, but games like this prove that to be unwise. There is not enough talent here, and just bringing in a goalie and a top defender is not enough. Other than the captain, there's nothing here that will garner useful talent in trade and the mess on the ice will do nothing to attract free agents with any self-respect. Nash has to bring a significant package back, the first round pick must either be an immediate star or be traded for more significant improvements, and a whole lot of chaff (fan favorites among them) have to be cut loose. This team was dominated by the #29 team in the league. We deserve to be in the basement and it's a long climb out. There is a daunting Lack Of Talent, no matter how some hate to hear that said! A major turnover and infusion of quality talent is needed.
You got it, Pete.

Like I said in another thread, when you are playing guys that were not good enough for other teams; waiver wire pick-ups, and our waived players that cleared, you know that you are a terrible team with absolutely no organizational depth.

With this team, where the hell do you even start?

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03-15-2012, 10:41 AM
  #84
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Wow, when even Pete the Optimist declares we stink, we really do stink. But at least we still have Mike and Scott firmly in charge to lead us out of the darkness. Why i heard that Priest replayed his Game Boy NHL 2012 for three hours last nite looking for new combinations to improve the team.

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03-15-2012, 11:15 AM
  #85
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Originally Posted by pete goegan View Post
Didn't see a minute of the game, but I've read the reports and this thread. What this says to me, Crede and lee, is that those who think we're a tweek away from contention are mistaken. I'm as firm as anyone in the wish that Nash play his entire career with the CBJ, but games like this prove that to be unwise. There is not enough talent here, and just bringing in a goalie and a top defender is not enough. Other than the captain, there's nothing here that will garner useful talent in trade and the mess on the ice will do nothing to attract free agents with any self-respect. Nash has to bring a significant package back, the first round pick must either be an immediate star or be traded for more significant improvements, and a whole lot of chaff (fan favorites among them) have to be cut loose. This team was dominated by the #29 team in the league. We deserve to be in the basement and it's a long climb out. There is a daunting Lack Of Talent, no matter how some hate to hear that said! A major turnover and infusion of quality talent is needed.
In the last 12 games, this team has...
- lost in overtime to the top team in the league (NY Rangers)
- beaten San Jose quite easily
- lost to Colorado
- went toe-to-toe with Pittsburgh for most of a game
- went toe-to-toe with Detroit for most of a game
- beat Colorado
- beat Phoenix
- beat Phoenix again
- beat Los Angeles
- went toe-to-toe with St. Louis
- went toe-to-toe with St. Louis
- looked out of sorts against Edmonton

And for what it's worth, the losses against Colorado, Pittsburgh, Detroit, and the first St. Louis game featured one of those classic "three goals on four shots in 3:00" spurts, with plenty of the "he'd like to have that one back" goals against. A soft goal is still a soft goal, but it seems that Columbus has been plagued with them for years and the opponents never seem to be. Last night was the first time in a month where the team has actually looked disjointed for most of the time, as opposed to being in it all the way and seeing the deciding goals against being floaters from 40 feet.

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Old
03-15-2012, 11:29 AM
  #86
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mayor Bee View Post
In the last 12 games, this team has...
- lost in overtime to the top team in the league (NY Rangers)
- beaten San Jose quite easily
- lost to Colorado
- went toe-to-toe with Pittsburgh for most of a game
- went toe-to-toe with Detroit for most of a game
- beat Colorado
- beat Phoenix
- beat Phoenix again
- beat Los Angeles
- went toe-to-toe with St. Louis
- went toe-to-toe with St. Louis
- looked out of sorts against Edmonton

And for what it's worth, the losses against Colorado, Pittsburgh, Detroit, and the first St. Louis game featured one of those classic "three goals on four shots in 3:00" spurts, with plenty of the "he'd like to have that one back" goals against. A soft goal is still a soft goal, but it seems that Columbus has been plagued with them for years and the opponents never seem to be. Last night was the first time in a month where the team has actually looked disjointed for most of the time, as opposed to being in it all the way and seeing the deciding goals against being floaters from 40 feet.
At the risk of un-piling on (piling off?), I was thinking this too but didn't have the energy to work up a reply. So good on ya, but not sure there's much benefit, as I'm sure there's lots of room for nitpicking.

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Old
03-15-2012, 12:12 PM
  #87
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Quote:
Originally Posted by EDM View Post
Wow, when even Pete the Optimist declares we stink, we really do stink. But at least we still have Mike and Scott firmly in charge to lead us out of the darkness. Why i heard that Priest replayed his Game Boy NHL 2012 for three hours last nite looking for new combinations to improve the team.
It's almost as rare for you to be in such a jovial mood...

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03-15-2012, 01:04 PM
  #88
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mayor Bee View Post
In the last 12 games, this team has...
- lost in overtime to the top team in the league (NY Rangers)
- beaten San Jose quite easily
- lost to Colorado
- went toe-to-toe with Pittsburgh for most of a game
- went toe-to-toe with Detroit for most of a game
- beat Colorado
- beat Phoenix
- beat Phoenix again
- beat Los Angeles
- went toe-to-toe with St. Louis
- went toe-to-toe with St. Louis
- looked out of sorts against Edmonton

And for what it's worth, the losses against Colorado, Pittsburgh, Detroit, and the first St. Louis game featured one of those classic "three goals on four shots in 3:00" spurts, with plenty of the "he'd like to have that one back" goals against. A soft goal is still a soft goal, but it seems that Columbus has been plagued with them for years and the opponents never seem to be. Last night was the first time in a month where the team has actually looked disjointed for most of the time, as opposed to being in it all the way and seeing the deciding goals against being floaters from 40 feet.
Great post and absolutely true. Since the JJ acquisition I feel this team has played at a very competitive level. Last night was just ugly for both teams (at least thats what periods 1 and 2 looked like). Like I said above, we haven't played this bad in a long time. If I didn't know better I'd say the players were told to tank.

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03-15-2012, 01:12 PM
  #89
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Originally Posted by Nordique View Post
Great post and absolutely true. Since the JJ acquisition I feel this team has played at a very competitive level. Last night was just ugly for both teams (at least thats what periods 1 and 2 looked like). Like I said above, we haven't played this bad in a long time. If I didn't know better I'd say the players were told to tank.
Not only that, but the only other non-competitive game in there (the loss to Colorado) was without both Carter (out the door) and Johnson (not yet arrived).

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03-15-2012, 02:02 PM
  #90
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Originally Posted by pete goegan View Post
Didn't see a minute of the game, but I've read the reports and this thread. What this says to me, Crede and lee, is that those who think we're a tweek away from contention are mistaken. I'm as firm as anyone in the wish that Nash play his entire career with the CBJ, but games like this prove that to be unwise. There is not enough talent here, and just bringing in a goalie and a top defender is not enough.
There are only so many scoring opportunities that can be created from Wisniewski or Johnson bombing it from the point.

Our top-6 (I know you guys know but I'm just reiterating) is:
Umberger - Brassard - Nash
Prospal - Letestu - Atkinson

At this point, it is imperative that we keep Nash if only for the fact that we can't stand to lose another top-6 player. Also, we need to draft Yakupov or get another gamebreaking forward in a trade.

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03-15-2012, 02:08 PM
  #91
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I appreciate the optimism, but what was it that Hitch said about teams out of the play-offs playing well late in the season?

I am not going to be swayed by some of these "competitive" games that we are playing now.

That mentality at this point will just bring more heartache in the future.

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03-15-2012, 02:12 PM
  #92
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It's games like that that make me understand why Howson/Patrick want to trade Nash for a top 6 forward (rather than goalie, dmen)

I wonder if it's just linemates or if Nash just takes games off and that just makes everyone else worse in the process. It's not like the Oilers really can shut them down. The Jackets forwards are their own worst enemy.

At this point, I just want to see them respond well in the next game. I still believe that effort can trump lack of talent.

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03-15-2012, 02:17 PM
  #93
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Originally Posted by Dr. Fire View Post
I appreciate the optimism, but what was it that Hitch said about teams out of the play-offs playing well late in the season?

I am not going to be swayed by some of these "competitive" games that we are playing now.

That mentality at this point will just bring more heartache in the future.
Fair enough but if late-season play is not applicable to how well the team is playing, then it's not applicable to how bad the team is either.

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03-15-2012, 02:32 PM
  #94
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Originally Posted by Crede777 View Post
There are only so many scoring opportunities that can be created from Wisniewski or Johnson bombing it from the point.

Our top-6 (I know you guys know but I'm just reiterating) is:
Umberger - Brassard - Nash
Prospal - Letestu - Atkinson

At this point, it is imperative that we keep Nash if only for the fact that we can't stand to lose another top-6 player. Also, we need to draft Yakupov or get another gamebreaking forward in a trade.
Thanks for posting the top six, Crede, that's a big reason why I'm not optimistic for next year, though I draw a different conclusion regarding Nash. Hitch warned about putting too much emphasis on he last twenty games, and remember his comment after the last game: if it had been a good team, they would have beaten us. At most, there are three players in our top six who legitimately belong there - Nash, Brassard, and (generously) Atkinson - and only Nash is a top liner. Brass and Cam are at least potentially effective second liners, the other three might make a serviceable third line. LOFT!

A Nash trade must effect an enormous change in this team. That, plus either a true star first rounder or a major return for that pick in another trade may start us on the climb to respectability. A team does not perform as this one has for all but two seasons of existence without being truly bad. This year is the depths, and no fine tuning or minor tweaks are going to make much difference. The few legitimate NHL players, mostly now on defense, need more help than can be gained from a nip here and a tuck there. I don't care whose hand is at the controls, blow the mother ****er up!

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03-15-2012, 02:45 PM
  #95
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Fair enough but if late-season play is not applicable to how well the team is playing, then it's not applicable to how bad the team is either.
Depends. How has the team played earlier? A team that's played pretty well for much of the year and, for one reason or another drops out of playoff contention, might play poorly from lack of motivation. We're not in that situation, though, this team has been out of contention since Halloween. The record throughout the year stinks. Even this brief spurt of relative competence has not raised us to within 10 points of #29! I just don't believe that the addition of JJ, no matter how much we like him, turns this team from garbage to contention. Again, look at that top six, does the addition of Yakupov really make that much difference? As much as I hate it, a successful Nash trade is the only move I can see that would bring in enough to have any significant effect. That and/or trading the first pick in the draft.

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03-15-2012, 02:57 PM
  #96
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Depends.
I got no problem with context, pete, goodness knows. But in the same way you can't cherry-pick stats or seasons to prove a point, you can't limit context. I';m not comfortable with waiting for a certain kind of outcome and then saying "See? That's what this team is."

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03-15-2012, 03:03 PM
  #97
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Originally Posted by pete goegan View Post
Depends. How has the team played earlier? A team that's played pretty well for much of the year and, for one reason or another drops out of playoff contention, might play poorly from lack of motivation. We're not in that situation, though, this team has been out of contention since Halloween. The record throughout the year stinks. Even this brief spurt of relative competence has not raised us to within 10 points of #29! I just don't believe that the addition of JJ, no matter how much we like him, turns this team from garbage to contention. Again, look at that top six, does the addition of Yakupov really make that much difference? As much as I hate it, a successful Nash trade is the only move I can see that would bring in enough to have any significant effect. That and/or trading the first pick in the draft.
Agree.. JJ has been a good addition but the defense still needs at least one defensive defensman added to the group. Nash, Nail and Brass are a good start for a top six but not enough and I don't think RJ, Letestu and Atkinson are the answers to fill out that group if winning a playoff series is the goal.

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03-15-2012, 03:20 PM
  #98
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Originally Posted by Double-Shift Lassť View Post
I got no problem with context, pete, goodness knows. But in the same way you can't cherry-pick stats or seasons to prove a point, you can't limit context. I';m not comfortable with waiting for a certain kind of outcome and then saying "See? That's what this team is."
I'm not really as optimistic as EDM might suggest, but I do consider myself a "positive realist" (TM). I resisted the conclusion I've recently drawn for as long as I thought prudent; but even what many are considering encouraging play, recently, has resulted in four wins in the past ten and one win in the past five games. This season has been dreadful, no matter in what context it is placed. I can only conclude that massive change is needed.

If, in fact, that major roster revision does not happen and the minor adjustments proposed by Howson result in a competetive hockey team, next season, no one will be happier than I...and no one will be more surprised.

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03-15-2012, 03:21 PM
  #99
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I watched American Idol and went to bed.
Did I miss anything?

hahaha

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03-15-2012, 03:35 PM
  #100
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Originally Posted by pete goegan View Post
I'm not really as optimistic as EDM might suggest, but I do consider myself a "positive realist" (TM). I resisted the conclusion I've recently drawn for as long as I thought prudent; but even what many are considering encouraging play, recently, has resulted in four wins in the past ten and one win in the past five games. This season has been dreadful, no matter in what context it is placed. I can only conclude that massive change is needed.

If, in fact, that major roster revision does not happen and the minor adjustments proposed by Howson result in a competetive hockey team, next season, no one will be happier than I...and no one will be more surprised.
What I am saying and, I believe, you might be too, is that using last night's game as some kind of determinant to what kind of offseason needs to happen is as foolish as taking the previous however-many games for the same purpose.

My very specific point is this - I've been told ad infinitum that how this team has played of late doesn't mean anything. I'm assuming that also means last night.

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