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By The Numbers Hockey Analytics... the Final Frontier. Explore strange new worlds, to seek out new algorithms, to boldly go where no one has gone before.

Advanced Stats: Corsi, QoC, etc

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Old
01-04-2010, 02:18 AM
  #26
19nazzy
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If there's going to be new stats, we need some goalie ones. Their stats are far too team dependent.

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01-04-2010, 02:55 AM
  #27
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SayNoToStim View Post
players destroyed as in body checks (ala Kronwall on anyone), careers destroyed (ala Lidstrom on Cloutier), or BOOM-HEADSHOT (ala McSorely on Donald Brashear) ?
Why not all three with different colours for them?

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01-04-2010, 02:59 AM
  #28
tarlinian
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I sometimes wonder why so many people are so hostile to the idea of coming up with new statistics. No one is forcing you to use them and in the end, better designed hockey statistics only enhances the game, whether it be in market efficiency, scouting, etc. It seems to me like nearly every attempt at a serious discussion of hockey stats on here gets derailed into a joke thread or people complaining about how we don't need new stats.

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01-04-2010, 03:41 AM
  #29
Crumblin Erb Brooks
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One I want to see is how much time on a power play per power play goal.

If a team goes on the power play, and one second after it starts, they get a penalty, it still goes down as a power play even though they werent really on the power play for any meaningful length of time.


Last edited by Crumblin Erb Brooks: 01-04-2010 at 03:51 AM.
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Old
01-04-2010, 04:04 AM
  #30
Nicklas Lidstrom
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"Statistics are like bikinis. What they reveal is suggestive, but what they conceal is vital."

There isn't any need to keep track of things like that. Watch the game and notice things on your own. It's what makes the game enjoyable.

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01-04-2010, 04:28 AM
  #31
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Hockey needs to go the way of football (soccer) and have puck possesion stat (example Red Wings - 55 % Blackhawks 45 %) and distance traveled by a player stat. Something like top speed achieved or average speed would be pretty cool too. We'd finally know for sure if Gaborik or whoever else really is the fastest player in the game.

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Old
01-04-2010, 04:31 AM
  #32
Dogkota
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The only statistic I would love to have a look at is "Assists Via Screen." These would be in the hundreds for a guy like Smyth or Holmstrom.

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Old
01-04-2010, 04:33 AM
  #33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SayNoToStim View Post
players destroyed as in body checks (ala Kronwall on anyone), careers destroyed (ala Lidstrom on Cloutier), or BOOM-HEADSHOT (ala McSorely on Donald Brashear) ?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fedz View Post
Why not all three with different colours for them?
Three colors or maybe the colors plus different stamps.

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Old
01-04-2010, 04:53 AM
  #34
Blades of Glory
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Goals created is already a statistic. Not surprisingly, the stat itself is heavily skewed towards goal-scoring over playmaking, and does not take into account quality of team or linemates.

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01-04-2010, 06:41 AM
  #35
Arselona
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IMO stats are like throphys, there's too many in NHL as it is already. A bit gimmicky, if you don't mind.

Need to simplify things so people watch hockey and appreciate the game itself as it is.

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Old
01-04-2010, 11:51 AM
  #36
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If something is highly subjective, as a Goals Created etc. would be, it isn't really a statistic in the true sense of the word. A lot of the stats brought up are available if you really dig for them, but it would be nice to have more info readily available, especially on things like puck possession, time in zone, power play stats taking into account the amount of time spent on PP, and individual Penalties Drawn.

I am very into this sort of analysis, so if anybody has something interesting they want me to look into, I would be interested in spending some time on it and hopefully coming up with some interesting data if possible.

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Old
01-04-2010, 12:46 PM
  #37
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01-04-2010, 12:49 PM
  #38
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I want to see the team stat of "time of possession" back so you can have physical evidence of which team control's the play during the game.

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Old
01-15-2011, 01:46 PM
  #39
ampersand5
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are there advanced statistics for hockey (eg PER?)

is there anything similar to basketballs PER or baseballs Sabremetrics that can be used in hockey?

looking for something a bit more telling than the normal ones used for hockey.

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Old
01-15-2011, 01:49 PM
  #40
hatterson
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http://www.puckprospectus.com/ and http://www.behindthenethockey.com/ have a bunch of stuff.

There's debate about their worth, but they have solid mathematical backing. Just don't know if that will always translate to the ice or not

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Old
01-15-2011, 01:50 PM
  #41
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Don't forget this:

http://hockeyanalytics.com/

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Old
01-15-2011, 02:07 PM
  #42
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It sounds like you're looking for something like GVT, which basically attempts to capture the same thing as PER does for basketball.

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Old
01-15-2011, 02:27 PM
  #43
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thanks for the link.

im not sure what currents things are accounted for, but id love to (with all of yours guys help) try and come up with a formula to make a hockey PER.

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Old
01-15-2011, 02:33 PM
  #44
ampersand5
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im trying to think of some things that would be included:

points
assists
+/-
qualcomp
qual of linemates
penalties taken/drawn
penalties taken/drawn of the line
zone starts/ends

what else?

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Old
08-09-2011, 01:32 AM
  #45
IBleedNYRBlue
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Are there any "advanced" stats in hockey?

In the NBA we have PER, TS%, In MLB we have WAR, xFIP, etc..

Are there any for the NHL? Not +/-....things to determine a players true value to his team besides points like WAR in baseball? I guess not since i've never heard of them but do you think there should be such stats?

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Old
08-09-2011, 01:34 AM
  #46
eklunds source
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Stats FAQ

Best place to start, imo..

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Old
08-09-2011, 01:39 AM
  #47
The Bored Man
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A ton, but their usefulness is debatable. http://www.behindthenet.ca/nhl_stati...20&ds=8&f5=EDM

And been debated to death among Oiler fans over the years. Starting a thread about Corsi is the best way to start a ****storm on our board.

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Old
08-09-2011, 01:40 AM
  #48
Kaner Coffee
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I am a huge proponent of Sabremetrics, and find advanced statistical analysis for baseball very helpful. This is because every act in baseball is 1. individual 2. repeated in the same manner over and over and 3. closely recorded. However, these principals do not/cannot be applied to hockey and basketball, so I really don't see how useful advanced statistics can be in these sports.

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Old
08-09-2011, 01:46 AM
  #49
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There are, they are useless though.

Have a read.......

http://www.tsn.ca/story/?id=357614

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Old
08-09-2011, 01:58 AM
  #50
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BoredMan View Post
A ton, but their usefulness is debatable. http://www.behindthenet.ca/nhl_stati...20&ds=8&f5=EDM

And been debated to death among Oiler fans over the years. Starting a thread about Corsi is the best way to start a ****storm on our board.
Agreed.

Things like Corsi are actually the opposite of advanced, they are so flawed they actually hinder understanding of performance.

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