He doesn't play that much. Nilstorp was the starter and recently Bachman has played all the games as he gets into shape. There is a window of opportunity now for him to play with Bachman called up and Nilstorp hurt.
He may not be a bust, but he was a bad value of a pick.
Even if he turns out to be really good, the Stars have a logjam ahead of him. If they go to trade him, could they even get back a pick of equal value? Goalies don't bring much in trades.
He may not be a bust, but he was a bad value of a pick.
Even if he turns out to be really good, the Stars have a logjam ahead of him. If they go to trade him, could they even get back a pick of equal value? Goalies don't bring much in trades.
You have 6 years before you even have to start legitimately worrying about losing him as an UFA, and Kari Lehtonen only signed for 5 years.
Yes you could have had some instant gratification with a D or F, and yes drafting a goalie in the first round is a huge risk, but you're also in a pretty good position if you just keep being patient. Worst case scenario, your 1st round pick doesn't work out which happens. Best case scenario, in a few years you have the same situation that Vancouver is facing right now, but you don't have a veteran signed to a god awful contract. Then no it won't be that difficult to recoup the value of that pick.
Bottom line is, he has talent and more importantly a pretty outstanding work ethic. If you have a guy who is willing to work for his dream of being an NHL player, you're in a pretty good spot. Just think, he could always have Glennie's attitude.
At some point everyone has to chill out and get over the fact Dallas burned a 1st on a goalie. It happened. The guy responsible is gone. Now give the guy a chance. We know the team has a good reputation developing goalies, and they've got a hell of a goalie coach who is respected around the league.
Seriously ... we ***** less about Glennie, and that was a monumental mistake. We can hardly blame their talent evaluation on that guy because they didn't even put much effort into scouting him. They essentially drew a name out of a hat. That's absurd.
EDIT: ... and Bob Sturm is the worst on this topic. I'd love to have some of those defenders too, but we are beating a dead horse at this point.
I guess the main thing that makes it easy for me to move on and just get to a place why I'm just rooting for Campbell to succeed is the guy that ran the 2009 and 2010 drafts is gone. There were mistakes made that we thought we saw, and the team clearly felt the same way by moving on from a long time employee.
You can't ever fix what was done .... so move along.
You have 6 years before you even have to start legitimately worrying about losing him as an UFA, and Kari Lehtonen only signed for 5 years.
I'm not talking about when he's a UFA. I'm talking about over the next couple of seasons. If they see their organizational goalie depth and decide to flip Campbell to fill holes elsewhere, do they even get back value equal to that high of a pick?
I was actually pretty okay with the Campbell pick at the time, was more pissed when Glennie was picked. At the current time I am still more upset with the Glennie pick. As much as I would have liked a Dman to be picked in one of those two years Campbell gives us a potential franchise goalie, and with the Stars history with goaltenders he seems like he's got a legit chance to be a nhl player which is really all you can ask for out of a draft pick. The Glennie pick was a stretch I thought and ever since I am always scared to draft a player who plays with a legit top prospect like Glennie did with Brayden Schenn.
2009 was the first draft I really followed, msotly because of how high we were picking, and I remember saying really loudly, "Who the hell is Scott Glennie?" when we picked him.
Glennie is easily the worst pick this organization has made post lockout. Campbell at least has a shot at still being an impact player.
I'm not talking about when he's a UFA. I'm talking about over the next couple of seasons. If they see their organizational goalie depth and decide to flip Campbell to fill holes elsewhere, do they even get back value equal to that high of a pick?
You are talking like there is a logjam in goaltending depth, when there isn't. Well this year, sure, but that's only because of Nilstorp being signed.
I'm not talking about when he's a UFA. I'm talking about over the next couple of seasons. If they see their organizational goalie depth and decide to flip Campbell to fill holes elsewhere, do they even get back value equal to that high of a pick?
I'm with LT ... why are we even talking about that? You do realize he can play backup to Kari Lehtonen in the NHL? They're not just going to give in after a couple of seasons (When the freaking dude wouldn't even 24 years old) and dump him. Schneider was just breaking into the NHL at that age.
It's pretty clear they think he can develop into a starter, and that means a slow path to the NHL. Look at Cory Schneider, and that's essentially the perfect scenario Dallas would want.
Schneider went pro a year after Campbell, and he wasn't in the NHL until he was 24 years old. He backed up Luongo two years ... and well ... he's sorta backing him up again but that's another conversation.
We all agree and realize that the developmental path of a goalie is entirely different than skaters, right? There's nothing shocking or wrong with a goalie not breaking into the NHL until his mid-20's. In fact, that's usually the prefect time. You have to have some patience.
Anyone expecting him to be like Price and be a top 10 goalie 3 years after his draft year needs a reality check. Seems like that's what some people here are expecting.
Hell, it's not just Campbell. Everyone on these boards needs to realize that prospects and picks are not all that valuable outside of the few surefire guys there are. 6 or 7-15th overall picks have like, a 40% success rate. And the lower you get, the lower the success rates. Not every prospect we have or pick is going to make an impact. I don't get why that's so hard to understand (even I struggle with it sometimes, to be fair).
I think it's also important to point out none of us are saying he's a sure fire starter or even quality NHL backup. There's just a pretty obvious developmental plan for goalies in the NHL, and Dallas in particular has a pretty predictable template.
That's why the idea of trading him in a couple years to try and recoup the value of his pick seems so strange. There isn't any legitimate way to know what you have in just a couple years. That's why the fact he's 6 years from being an UFA is important.
Hes doing just fine. And he just turne 21 three weeks ago. Unless you can see the future I dont think its fair to call him a bust at all. Makes no sense. People need a little patience.
I think with Campbell you have to take what he did in juniors and compare it to the other goalies on his team to get a true indication of his value.
Windsor 2011-12
Player Name GP Min GA GAA W L T Svs Pct EN SO
Jack Campbell 12 729 38 3.13 6 3 2 368 0.906 0 1
Jaroslav Pavelka 34 1783 103 3.47 12 14 4 981 0.905 5 3
John Cullen 29 1451 94 3.89 11 14 1 779 0.892 3 2
Jordan DeKort 3 145 13 5.39 0 1 0 76 0.854 0 0
Sault Ste. Marie 2011-12
Player Name GP Min GA GAA W L T Svs Pct EN SO
Jack Campbell 34 1945 116 3.58 15 12 5 956 0.892 3 1
Michael Nishi 3 179 12 4.03 1 2 0 96 0.889 0 0
Matt Murray 36 1912 130 4.08 13 19 1 916 0.876 1 0
Charlie Millen 2 69 6 5.22 34 0.85 0 0
Sorry about the jumble of stats but it's clear that on both Windsor and Sault Ste Marie he was the strongest goalie on his team and outplayed his teammates. Taking into account that the team would on average, play relatively the same with or without Campbell in net, it's clear he was pretty valuable.
I posted about him on the Texas AHL thread wondering how he was doing. I had huge expectations for him in the OHL (admittedly in part because of his WJC performances) and he didn't quite meet those but he seems to have been improving in Texas since the start of the year.
The compete level is the most impressive thing about this kid. He wants to be the best and the special ones have this mindset. Everything I've heard is that he has an incredible work ethic and absolutely hates being scored on. You can't teach those things, you either have it or you don't.
I know the head scout who made the pick lost his job but I still think it was a great one for Dallas. Time will tell and it might be a few years but I think he will be a good one.
to everyone, on behalf of blink, pensfan, and the keeper league we 3 participate in, i apologize for their infiltration of our board here. those gosh darn annoying fantasy hockey nerds... heheheh.
Having said that, great points. Now onto Florida and Anaheim's forum... hehe
Haha already been to the Ducks boards about Gibson. Even been on the prospects board about Lee! Have to raise their trade values somehow
Quote:
Originally Posted by ginblossoms
to everyone, on behalf of blink, pensfan, and the keeper league we 3 participate in, i apologize for their infiltration of our board here. those gosh darn annoying fantasy hockey nerds... heheheh.
Infiltration? Hehe...from the looks of all the activity around here I think this board could use a few more
