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05-11-2014, 06:10 PM
  #1
MettleMcOiler
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Goalie Coach Questions

How important is the goalie coach to the development of a NHL goalie?
Does it matter if the goalie coach history was playing as a backup or played as a starter with an elite level game to pass along to the goalies that he is teaching?

Curious because L.A and Anahiem both have Ranford and Roloson as Goalie coaches, and it does seem the goalies that come out of there are pretty solid.
Also I wonder what roll Patrick Roy had on Varlymov, cause he played stellar during the season then in the past.
Do you think Fred Chabot can bring out the best out of Scrivens and Fasth, or is it time for the oilers to make a change?


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05-11-2014, 06:33 PM
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McDNicks17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MettleOiler View Post
How important is the goalie coach to the development of a NHL goalie?
Does it matter if the goalie coach history was playing as a backup or played as a starter with an elite level game to pass along to the goalies that he is teaching?
Playing at a high level isn't necessarily a requirement. Arguably the best goalie coach in the league, Mitch Korn(Nashville), only played at a small hockey college(Kent State).

Francois and Benoit Allaire didn't play at a high level either. They're two of the best goalie coaches in NHL history, probably.

Another example is Michael Lehner(Robin's father). He coached Henrik Lundqvist back in Sweden and he has never even played the position.

Quote:
Curious because L.A and Anahiem both have Ranford and Roloson as Goalie coaches, and it does seem the goalies that come out of there are pretty solid.
Also I wonder what roll Patrick Roy had Varlymov, cause he played stellar during the season then in the past.
Do you think Fred Chabot can bring out the best out of Scrivens and Fasth, or is it time for the oilers to make a change?
Francois Allaire was probably more important to Varlamov's success. It was his first season as a goalie coach there. He was actually Roy's goalie coach back in the day.


It's tough to say if they should replace Chabot.

We don't really know if he's just ineffective or if the talent he's been given is unable to get better.

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05-11-2014, 07:32 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dnicks17 View Post
Playing at a high level isn't necessarily a requirement. Arguably the best goalie coach in the league, Mitch Korn(Nashville), only played at a small hockey college(Kent State).

Francois and Benoit Allaire didn't play at a high level either. They're two of the best goalie coaches in NHL history, probably.

Another example is Michael Lehner(Robin's father). He coached Henrik Lundqvist back in Sweden and he has never even played the position.



Francois Allaire was probably more important to Varlamov's success. It was his first season as a goalie coach there. He was actually Roy's goalie coach back in the day.


It's tough to say if they should replace Chabot.

We don't really know if he's just ineffective or if the talent he's been given is unable to get better.

Really appreciate you shedding more light on that Dnicks, thanks! Has chabot develop any goalies that are starters in the league currently?
because I'm also worried since the fall of Dubnyk, that Scrivens and Fasth may develop the "bad habits" that Nashville uncovered.
I noticed that their play seem a little off at the final home games, compared when they first made their starts.
I've always wanted some fresh blood in the net, and I really like what we have as a Tandem atm, and would hate to go through the goalie crisis that we had again.
I believe we have goalies to really cheer for now and would hate to lose them.

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05-11-2014, 07:51 PM
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Chabot has only been employed as a goalie coach since '08/'09. One year in Germany. The rest with the Oilers. He hasn't really developed any NHLers let alone starters in that time, unfortunately.

I think those bad habits are more player dependent. Dubnyk maybe developed bad habits because of some of his shortcomings(tracking the puck, lateral movement, etc.) and Chabot couldn't coach it out of him or Chabot wasn't able to identify them to coach them out of him.

I feel like Scrivens and Fasth already have strong bases, so we shouldn't have to worry about larger problems. It'll just be small adjustments that would be lacking if the problem is Chabot.

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05-11-2014, 08:59 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MettleOiler View Post
How important is the goalie coach to the development of a NHL goalie?
Does it matter if the goalie coach history was playing as a backup or played as a starter with an elite level game to pass along to the goalies that he is teaching?

Curious because L.A and Anahiem both have Ranford and Roloson as Goalie coaches, and it does seem the goalies that come out of there are pretty solid.
Also I wonder what roll Patrick Roy had on Varlymov, cause he played stellar during the season then in the past.
Do you think Fred Chabot can bring out the best out of Scrivens and Fasth, or is it time for the oilers to make a change?
The biggest thing is not to change a guy. Allaire practically ruined Scrivens and Reimer single handed. Most of the good goalie coaches never really played in the NHL. They're all nuts to begin with so if you find a good one, I guess you should keep him around. I'd also stress anyone with kids, if you're kid wants to play in net, take him in the basement and shoot as many pucks to his head as possible. If he still wants to do it, you have a nutbag on your hands. So when looking for a coach, find the nuttiest one.

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05-11-2014, 09:00 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dnicks17 View Post
Chabot has only been employed as a goalie coach since '08/'09. One year in Germany. The rest with the Oilers. He hasn't really developed any NHLers let alone starters in that time, unfortunately.

I think those bad habits are more player dependent. Dubnyk maybe developed bad habits because of some of his shortcomings(tracking the puck, lateral movement, etc.) and Chabot couldn't coach it out of him or Chabot wasn't able to identify them to coach them out of him.

I feel like Scrivens and Fasth already have strong bases, so we shouldn't have to worry about larger problems. It'll just be small adjustments that would be lacking if the problem is Chabot.



That makes plenty of sense, and I agree both Fasth and Scivens have a more solid foundation to work on then what we had before. Thank Dnicks for giving a better perspective on the goalie developlment

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05-11-2014, 09:01 PM
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Originally Posted by Petes2424 View Post
The biggest thing is not to change a guy. Allaire practically ruined Scrivens and Reimer single handed. Most of the good goalie coaches never really played in the NHL. They're all nuts to begin with so if you find a good one, I guess you should keep him around. I'd also stress anyone with kids, if you're kid wants to play in net, take him in the basement and shoot as many pucks to his head as possible. If he still wants to do it, you have a nutbag on your hands. So when looking for a coach, find the nuttiest one.
So if he retires in a few years......Bryzgalov for goalie coach?

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05-12-2014, 03:06 AM
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A good goalie coach can be huge. Both Eddie Belfour and Dominik Hasek credited their games to working with Tretiak (when he was the goalie 'consultant' for the 'Hawks), and the Allaire brothers are responsible for the games of quite a few NHLers.

That being said, as others have noted, how good a player the goalie coach was seems to have little bearing on how well they coach. Some good goalie coaches were stars (Tretiak, Ranford); others never played in the NHL (the Allaires, Korn).

One constant? The Oilers seem to hire crap ones (Peeters, Chabot) - or management has no eye for goalie talent, considering the last good starters that came from the Oilers system were Fuhr and Moog (Ranford, Cujo, Salo et. al were all acquired from other teams).

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05-13-2014, 01:09 PM
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Pete Peeters did nothing for us, yet for Fasth it was the reason he come around at the NHL level.

Sometimes you need something to work with.

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05-13-2014, 03:36 PM
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Are there any respectable free agent goalie coaches that the oilers should be looking at his off-season? Wasn't there a famous finnish goalie coach that wanted to try is craft in the nhl? Can't remember his name...

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05-13-2014, 08:36 PM
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I've been very vocal in my dislike of Chabot. With how pathetic Dubnyk became, and how obviously his flaws were (who the **** butterflys with their pads parallel?), there's no reason for him to have a job next year. Bring in anyone else

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05-14-2014, 02:43 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dnicks17 View Post
Playing at a high level isn't necessarily a requirement. Arguably the best goalie coach in the league, Mitch Korn(Nashville), only played at a small hockey college(Kent State).

Francois and Benoit Allaire didn't play at a high level either. They're two of the best goalie coaches in NHL history, probably.

Another example is Michael Lehner(Robin's father). He coached Henrik Lundqvist back in Sweden and he has never even played the position.



Francois Allaire was probably more important to Varlamov's success. It was his first season as a goalie coach there. He was actually Roy's goalie coach back in the day.


It's tough to say if they should replace Chabot.

We don't really know if he's just ineffective or if the talent he's been given is unable to get better.
Their style has also made goalies complacent. Allaire's style of "positional blocking" made their goalies lazy and less focus on reflex and appendage use and more on positioning. If the latter wasn't strong, hello sieve

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05-14-2014, 03:21 AM
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Let's just hire Cujo, grab a pint, and wait for it all to blow over.

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05-14-2014, 09:26 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MettleOiler View Post
[/B]

That makes plenty of sense, and I agree both Fasth and Scivens have a more solid foundation to work on then what we had before. Thank Dnicks for giving a better perspective on the goalie developlment
scrivens and fasth are different types of goalies then dubnyk. They get by on reactionary speed and athleticism. Dubnyk had neither. I played against dubnyk over a decade ago and the book was always to make him move side to side and look 5 hole. he is a big positional goalie, his whole game is covering 90% of the net when in his butterfly. make him move and you win. Scrivens and Fasth are quicker and able to react accordingly. the also battle harder for 2-3-4 shot rebounds.

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05-14-2014, 11:40 PM
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Originally Posted by joestevens29 View Post
Pete Peeters did nothing for us, yet for Fasth it was the reason he come around at the NHL level.

Sometimes you need something to work with.
Hardly enough time for Pete Peeters to ruin him.
"Well when I played the kung fu kick was an effective way of stopping a shot along the ice".


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