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Jets lose 8-4, eat **** Mike Johnson

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Old
03-21-2012, 01:57 AM
  #101
Holden Caulfield
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Originally Posted by Jet View Post
I think the Jets are showing ATM that their young players are not mature enough to handle the pressure of a playoff race, and our older players aren't quite good enough to put the team on their shoulders often enough to carry us there.

Burmi, Kane, and Bogosian are hopefully learning a lot about what it takes to win and I hope that with a year of maturity they will be that much more equipped to handle the games down the stretch next year.

Enstrom has been good, but he hasn't been the superstar we expected him to be.

Byfuglien when he wants to be can be the most dominant player in the game. Problem is he doesn't want to be often enough it seems.

Wheeler and Pavelec for me have been the guys who have seemed like they are the most able to be difference makers game in and out. Pavs looked a little shell shocked tonight, but I think he might be a tad worn out. Mason should have played at least 10+ more games this season.

Guys like Glass, Slater, Thorburn, and Stuart have been great soldiers for us this year. You can't blame them for where we are at because they bring what they bring very consistently. Unfortunately what they bring is only an element of what a winning team needs and won't often win you games on it's own.

Little, Antropov and Wellwood have been too inconsistent for the team this year. I can accept that from Antro and Welly, because they are secondary scorers on the team (though I know Antro gets paid a little too much to do it). Again I can't complain too much about them, though I wish Antro was around 20 goals at this point.


Hainsey just does what he does. He is extremely consistent, has the odd off game (almost everyone does). I think he's paid too much for what he does, but we know why the contract was given to him, and really, dollars aren't a big deal for this team atm anyway.

Trying to look at this team in an unbiased way, when you look at the guys who are young and learning to play under pressure, and the guys who we have who are inconsistent, you can see why this team is frustrating to watch. When they put it together, they look like a very dangerous hockey team. When they suffer from their immaturity or inconsistency, you get a team that we watched tonight and Sunday.

Hopefully some maturity, and a tweak here or there will get us into the playoffs next year. It's not over this year but realistically our chances are very slim.
Great post. I know we are all frusterated at this, but realistically this is the first time many of these players have faced this situation. They have responded in big games, but they have failed to show it consistantly, to me this is a sign of inexperience. I'm glad this roster is at least competing, it is a huge experience for them. We need some help next year, but this year is a HUGE experience for young guys like Little/Kane/Burmistrov/Bogosian/Pavelec and for veterans Ladd/Wheeler/Byfuglien/Enstrom as core players. I think we make some nice additions next year in the forward corps and this is a 5-7 team and we will have learned the consistency needed to compete in the NHL next year.

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03-21-2012, 02:24 AM
  #102
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The situation with Enstrom scares me. I know this hasn't been his best season (for whatever reason), but I still want to lock him up long term ASAP. But he's probably going to want until next year when he's having a better season before starting negotiations - which leaves the door open for him walking away a UFA at season's end.

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03-21-2012, 02:28 AM
  #103
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jet View Post
I think the Jets are showing ATM that their young players are not mature enough to handle the pressure of a playoff race, and our older players aren't quite good enough to put the team on their shoulders often enough to carry us there.
.
the reason they will miss the playoffs is not because they folded under the pressure of the race....they wont make the playoffs because they havent won on the road since day 1....january is the reason they will not make the playoffs, not march.

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03-21-2012, 03:58 AM
  #104
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On the bright side, both our farm teams will make playoffs

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03-21-2012, 07:31 AM
  #105
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The Pens are a scary scary team now that they are healthy.

Anyone still think it was a good idea to dress Clitsome over Jones?
Absolutely not. Clitsome did not do the job everyone was hoping he would do. If he was suppose to take care of Crosby or Malkin, that did not happen. Crosby with 4 assists and Malkin with 2 goals and 3 assists. 3 goals against. When you go and always try and make that big hit a lot of times that puts you out of position. Looking flashy doesn't always get the defensive job done, especially if you're a defenceman. He didn't have a good game tonight.

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03-21-2012, 08:20 AM
  #106
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Outcome of this game was what I expected.

Two observations:

1. Pittsburgh is a very, very good team with Crosby and Malkin in the lineup.
2. The Jets are roadkill - have been pretty well all year and don't see that changing anytime soon.

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03-21-2012, 09:38 AM
  #107
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Was anybody expecting a different outcome? The Jets do not have the talent to play firewagon hockey with the Penguins, period. The Penguins are absolutely dominant up front, with secondary and tertiary scoring that is arguably better than the Jets top 6.

Where the Pens are suspect is on D and in goal. I'm not convinced that Fleury is a legitimate #1, even now. Had the Jets attempted to play a measure of containment in the neutral zone, and played from the net out in the defensive zone, they might have had a chance to keep this game close enough to win a squeaker, possibly in OT or a shoot-out. The Jets needed an entire team commitment to play defense first, which did not happen. Allowing the Pens to carry the puck into the zone rather than forcing them to dump, not clogging up the neutral zone and standing up at the blueline, and collapsing quickly between the dots and giving the Pens the entire perimeter of the zone was a recipe for disaster.

I'm not sure whether the Jets allowed the Pens to play their game, or whether the Pens just forced their style on the Jets, but the end result is still the same - the Jets are not good enough to compete with the elite teams, and are not good enough to win on the road against a better opponent. This is not a basis for a successful play-off team.

On a brighter note - when I was in Las Vegas earlier in the month, I bet beaucoup bux on the Penguins (9-2 odds) Rangers (4-1 odds) Blues (8-1 odds) and Predators (9-1 odds) to win the Stanley Cup. I'm quite confident that I'm at least going to win back the amount of the bet, as the Penguins and Blues look good for at least a finals appearance.

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Old
03-21-2012, 09:38 AM
  #108
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Kane Little Wheeler
Ladd Burmi Wellwood

I just think Ladd and Wellwood have better chemistry together.


And while I cant wait for Scheifele, i will. Besides he needs to bulk up a little if hes gonna be parking himself in front on NHL nets.

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03-21-2012, 09:58 AM
  #109
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It's baffling how the Jets get into pond hockey mode against the Pens. It was also hard to watch the Jets coverage in their own zone.

Stuart and Clitsome looked exactly like a pair that has never played together. Multiple missed assignments in picking up open Penguins.

Our forwards were not much better in our own zone. The Penguins were doing a really good job at moving around. It seemed like the Jets were doing a poor job at maintaining their assignments.

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03-21-2012, 10:32 AM
  #110
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Originally Posted by sipowicz View Post
Love the thread title, I hate Mike Johnson and it's pretty obvious he hates the Jets.

Thought Maxwell and Machacek played well, in fact a lot better than Kane, Burmi and Wellwood who quite frankly have looked lost the past 4-5 games. Really don't get what Burmi is trying to do out there and don't really think he has a clue either. Can't say Burmi has improved as the season has gone along.

Thought Hainsey looked shaky and has for some time, I actually think Clitsome plays better, and the coaching staff is not afraid to play Clitsome against any line.

Jets forwards really have a bad habit of waiting too long to shoot and miss out on numerous scoring chances because of it.

Pavs and Mason both not real sharp.
I agree about Clitsome, he adds a lot to the team imo.

One of my biggest criticisms of the Jets' forwards is their reluctance to just shoot sometimes. The Pens picked up two or three goals last night by simply shooting everything at the net. Sometimes they go in and sometimes they cause a scrum in front of the net which can result in a goal.

Otherwise, I wasn't expecting a win and the Pens are amazingly good right now.

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Old
03-21-2012, 10:43 AM
  #111
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Originally Posted by teucer View Post
On the bright side, both our farm teams will make playoffs
SHHHHH don't say this, it will just bring out the crowd that calls for Zinger's head. You know the guy who say "He wanted the Moose name, FIRE HIM", or "He only cares about the Ice Caps and the AHL, FIRE HIM".

Really, one bad loss and this crowd comes out to play every time, this time it's on the back of a draft pick that hasn't played since what.... the fifth or sixth game of the year? Wow, just wow!

Not that it's any different on any of the other teams boards, everyone can be a GM!

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Old
03-21-2012, 10:47 AM
  #112
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Originally Posted by DarthMonty View Post
Was anybody expecting a different outcome? The Jets do not have the talent to play firewagon hockey with the Penguins, period. The Penguins are absolutely dominant up front, with secondary and tertiary scoring that is arguably better than the Jets top 6.

Where the Pens are suspect is on D and in goal. I'm not convinced that Fleury is a legitimate #1, even now. Had the Jets attempted to play a measure of containment in the neutral zone, and played from the net out in the defensive zone, they might have had a chance to keep this game close enough to win a squeaker, possibly in OT or a shoot-out. The Jets needed an entire team commitment to play defense first, which did not happen. Allowing the Pens to carry the puck into the zone rather than forcing them to dump, not clogging up the neutral zone and standing up at the blueline, and collapsing quickly between the dots and giving the Pens the entire perimeter of the zone was a recipe for disaster.

I'm not sure whether the Jets allowed the Pens to play their game, or whether the Pens just forced their style on the Jets, but the end result is still the same - the Jets are not good enough to compete with the elite teams, and are not good enough to win on the road against a better opponent. This is not a basis for a successful play-off team.

On a brighter note - when I was in Las Vegas earlier in the month, I bet beaucoup bux on the Penguins (9-2 odds) Rangers (4-1 odds) Blues (8-1 odds) and Predators (9-1 odds) to win the Stanley Cup. I'm quite confident that I'm at least going to win back the amount of the bet, as the Penguins and Blues look good for at least a finals appearance.


Fleury didn't play. The pens AHL starter did, that's probably why he looked like a questionable #1, because he was.

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Old
03-21-2012, 11:05 AM
  #113
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Originally Posted by Huffer View Post
It's baffling how the Jets get into pond hockey mode against the Pens. It was also hard to watch the Jets coverage in their own zone.

Stuart and Clitsome looked exactly like a pair that has never played together. Multiple missed assignments in picking up open Penguins.

Our forwards were not much better in our own zone. The Penguins were doing a really good job at moving around. It seemed like the Jets were doing a poor job at maintaining their assignments.
I thought we looked good at times and gave it our all. Pens just much stronger team. Our D have to learn they can't play the same way against all teams! Can't pinch and get caught against the Pens! I do agree however with another post that the forwards have to shoot more. If the shot is there, take it! A few of Neal's goals came from ridiculous spots which never should've gone in, why don't we try this sometime.?? Would be nice if we could have 2 or 3 lines clicking at the same time instead of just one most of the time. Miss Antro's big body and also Thorburn's. Missing the T of the GST

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03-21-2012, 12:12 PM
  #114
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Ugly, ugly game for the Jets last night. If they ever become known as the Road Warriors they will be a Stanley Cup contender. Until then the dream has become a nightmare.

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Old
03-21-2012, 12:20 PM
  #115
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Originally Posted by Huffer View Post
It's baffling how the Jets get into pond hockey mode against the Pens. It was also hard to watch the Jets coverage in their own zone.

Stuart and Clitsome looked exactly like a pair that has never played together. Multiple missed assignments in picking up open Penguins.

Our forwards were not much better in our own zone. The Penguins were doing a really good job at moving around. It seemed like the Jets were doing a poor job at maintaining their assignments.
So you are saying Jones over Clitsome might have been a good idea?


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03-21-2012, 12:34 PM
  #116
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So you are saying Jones over Clitsome might have been a good idea?

Ha, maybe. If we could be sure that Clitsome waited until the coaching staff was out of the room and then said, "F that defensive gameplan, let's run and gun with these guys!"

I don't think the problem was entirely on one guy, and I don't think having Jones in for Clitsome would have made a difference. I did see a couple of communication errors if you will between Clitsome and Stuart on the behind the net goals.

I think Jones has been playing pretty good for what is expected of him lately (Simple, physical, PK), but in the few games that I have watched Clitsome, I think Clitsome brings more to the table (physical, better passer, better skater, better shooter).

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03-21-2012, 12:36 PM
  #117
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Ha, maybe. If we could be sure that Clitsome waited until the coaching staff was out of the room and then said, "F that defensive gameplan, let's run and gun with these guys!"

I don't think the problem was entirely on one guy, and I don't think having Jones in for Clitsome would have made a difference. I did see a couple of communication errors if you will between Clitsome and Stuart on the behind the net goals.

I think Jones has been playing pretty good for what is expected of him lately (Simple, physical, PK), but in the few games that I have watched Clitsome, I think Clitsome brings more to the table (physical, better passer, better skater, better shooter).
Oh no, I'm not at all blaming the loss on Clitsome. I'm just suggesting that maybe the reason they had Jones in over Clitsome in the Carolina game is because that pair has played pretty well together as a unit.

I really like Grant so far and am excited to see what he will bring to this team next year.

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03-21-2012, 12:39 PM
  #118
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Please feel free to carry on with the Mark Scheifele debate here.

http://hfboards.hockeysfuture.com/sh....php?t=1141107

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03-21-2012, 12:44 PM
  #119
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Originally Posted by Jet View Post
Oh no, I'm not at all blaming the loss on Clitsome. I'm just suggesting that maybe the reason they had Jones in over Clitsome in the Carolina game is because that pair has played pretty well together as a unit.

I really like Grant so far and am excited to see what he will bring to this team next year.
Agree on both counts.

Maybe Noel just didn't want to have Clitsome sit a second game in a row right after Clitsome's very good game against Washington.

Sort of dammed if you do, dammed if you don't thing. Do you leave Jones and Stuart together as they played decent together, or do you put Clitsome in the game because he played very well against Washington?

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03-21-2012, 12:54 PM
  #120
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Fleury didn't play. The pens AHL starter did, that's probably why he looked like a questionable #1, because he was.
I'm well aware that the Pens started Thiessen - I was referring to Fleury not being a legitimate #1, as part of my assertion that the Pens are suspect on the back end. Sorry if my post was confusing.

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03-21-2012, 12:58 PM
  #121
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Originally Posted by DarthMonty View Post
I'm well aware that the Pens started Thiessen - I was referring to Fleury not being a legitimate #1, as part of my assertion that the Pens are suspect on the back end. Sorry if my post was confusing.
I agree
Fleury is not legit

I am sorry... but anyone could win 35 games with the talent in front of him

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03-21-2012, 01:01 PM
  #122
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I'm well aware that the Pens started Thiessen - I was referring to Fleury not being a legitimate #1, as part of my assertion that the Pens are suspect on the back end. Sorry if my post was confusing.
Fleury's top 10 in the NHL without a doubt.

Stanley cup winner, been to the finals twice, 5 35+ win seasons, he knows how to win and step up and play well in big games.

Ask Pens fans how he was last season without Crosby + Malkin, he carried that team to the playoffs. Even earlier this season he was carrying them. Not a legitimate #1...

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03-21-2012, 01:08 PM
  #123
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Originally Posted by JetsWillFly4Ever View Post
Fleury's top 10 in the NHL without a doubt.

Stanley cup winner, been to the finals twice, 5 35+ win seasons, he knows how to win and step up and play well in big games.

Ask Pens fans how he was last season without Crosby + Malkin, he carried that team to the playoffs. Even earlier this season he was carrying them. Not a legitimate #1...
Let me rephrase - I can understand the confusion. I shouldn't be posting whilst I'm occupied by something like work.

I don't consider M. A. Fleury to be a legitimate "elite" goalie, a la Lundqvist or Brodeur (in his prime). I will concede he is the #1 for the Penguins, though.

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03-21-2012, 01:43 PM
  #124
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Pittsburg is a pretty ridiculous team and they are firing on all cylinders right now. Frankly, the way they moved the puck around at times last night was just crazy. I don't think the Jets had much of a chance to "shut them down." I mean you can say thats the game plan all you want but in the end they might just decide not to LET you shut them down. you just aren't going to completely stop them from getting chances and they don't miss much when they do get a chance...

Oh well, I'm lookin forward to next season...

go jets go!

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03-21-2012, 01:45 PM
  #125
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Originally Posted by DarthMonty View Post
Let me rephrase - I can understand the confusion. I shouldn't be posting whilst I'm occupied by something like work.

I don't consider M. A. Fleury to be a legitimate "elite" goalie, a la Lundqvist or Brodeur (in his prime). I will concede he is the #1 for the Penguins, though.
What does this mean? Not trying to troll, I'm just curious what you mean by not "elite" but then saying he is the #1 for the Penguins. What is your definition of "elite"? If you are saying Lundqvist and prime Brodeur is your definition, then there's currently 25+ teams without "elite" or legitimate #1 goalies.

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