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To Gui, or not to Gui? UPD: Unlikely to re-sign

View Poll Results: Should the Wild re-sign Guillaume Latendresse?
Yes, they should qualify him as an RFA (~$2.5M) 63 63.00%
Yes, but only if they can negotiate him down to a lower salary as a UFA 28 28.00%
No, they should let him walk 9 9.00%
Voters: 100. You may not vote on this poll

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Old
03-22-2012, 01:23 PM
  #51
Dr Jan Itor
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Did he sleep with your wife or kick your dog or something?
Did he save your life or something?

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03-22-2012, 01:29 PM
  #52
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I really really really really really hope Gui comes back. Hell I have half a mind to send a letter to GMCF begging him to resign Big Bear.

I feel like he's so close to breaking out, and if he just stays healthy for a season we'll see him develop into a top line mainstay. I fear he'll be the Wild's equivalent of David Ortiz if we let him go now.

Big Bear going for the honey is my favorite running bit on this board.

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03-22-2012, 01:43 PM
  #53
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I agree with you that you can't hold the concussion against a player. But on the other hand, as an organization, how long can you continue to have faith in guys like Gui and PMB? At what point do you say, "We have to look elsewhere, because having 2 of our top-6 forwards out for 2+ seasons kills our chances, and we can't keep doing that".
Even though PMB and Gui are out with concussions, I don't think their situations are really comparable.

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03-22-2012, 01:59 PM
  #54
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Did he save your life or something?
No, I just recognize that the dude is flat out more offensively skilled than Latindress. You put them 1v1 on the ice and Christensen skates circles around GLat, Christensen has proven to be more durable as well and lets face it someone on the ice is far more valuable than someone who may or may not play even half a season.

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03-22-2012, 02:05 PM
  #55
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No, I just recognize that the dude is flat out more offensively skilled than Latindress. You put them 1v1 on the ice and Christensen skates circles around GLat, Christensen has proven to be more durable as well and lets face it someone on the ice is far more valuable than someone who may or may not play even half a season.
1v1 that may be true. But Lats has a much bigger impact on the ice 5v5 than EC. Lats throws his body around and is one of the few players on our team that consistently drives to the net without the puck. Lats is more valuable to our offense than EC.

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03-22-2012, 02:13 PM
  #56
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No, I just recognize that the dude is flat out more offensively skilled than Latindress. You put them 1v1 on the ice and Christensen skates circles around GLat, Christensen has proven to be more durable as well and lets face it someone on the ice is far more valuable than someone who may or may not play even half a season.
Latendresse, in his 16 games this season, has the exact same points stat line (5-4-9) as EC does in his 39 games this season. Skill is great and important, but at some point in time, you have to use it. In Latendresse's partial season with the Wild in 09-10, he put up more points than EC has in the past 2 full seasons. Since 09-10, Latendresse has 55 points (35-20) in 105 games while EC has 62 points (24-38) in 160 games. Since 2007-2008, Latendresse has appeared in 234 NHL games while EC has appeared in 224 NHL games (not counting playoffs).

In summary, regardless of skill, Latendresse puts up more points per game and has played in more games over the past 4 seasons than EC. He also has a running total of +7 over the past 4 seasons while EC is -17 over the same span.

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03-22-2012, 02:32 PM
  #57
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Originally Posted by roon View Post
No, I just recognize that the dude is flat out more offensively skilled than Latindress. You put them 1v1 on the ice and Christensen skates circles around GLat, Christensen has proven to be more durable as well and lets face it someone on the ice is far more valuable than someone who may or may not play even half a season.
Too bad hockey games are 5 on 5. Nobody is really arguing his raw skill, which is why he excels in the shootout. It's putting that skill on display during an actual game situation, which is something he has never done consistently.

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03-22-2012, 02:33 PM
  #58
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No, I just recognize that the dude is flat out more offensively skilled than Latindress. You put them 1v1 on the ice and Christensen skates circles around GLat, Christensen has proven to be more durable as well and lets face it someone on the ice is far more valuable than someone who may or may not play even half a season.
How the hell do you even get to that point? Hes had 4 or 5 good games since coming here from the Rangers. That is a dangerously small sample size to be basing a comparison on.

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03-22-2012, 05:01 PM
  #59
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How the hell do you even get to that point? Hes had 4 or 5 good games since coming here from the Rangers. That is a dangerously small sample size to be basing a comparison on.
I have watched them both play, and would love to hear the argument that GLat has more raw skill than EC.

I understand what everyone is saying, "If he is so good, why don't the numbers show it?". I wish I had an answer for you, and while I readily admit that GLat goes to the net and creates offense...he has cost us 5 million in two years and played 27 games. EC came into a new system and apparently had some issues with the mental side of his game...if he can get that figured out and produce at the pace he currently is going forward he is far and away better for this team than GLat. That is my point.

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03-22-2012, 05:06 PM
  #60
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I really don't understand the hard on Wild fans have for this guy.

He has played 82 games for us in 3 seasons and put up .62 PPG in that 3 season span. He hasn't been able to stay healthy and quite frankly a .62 PPG player is not all that phenominal. Not saying EC is the answer, but if you give me the choice between the two I take EC everyday of the week.

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03-22-2012, 05:10 PM
  #61
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I have watched them both play, and would love to hear the argument that GLat has more raw skill than EC.

I understand what everyone is saying, "If he is so good, why don't the numbers show it?". I wish I had an answer for you, and while I readily admit that GLat goes to the net and creates offense...he has cost us 5 million in two years and played 27 games. EC came into a new system and apparently had some issues with the mental side of his game...if he can get that figured out and produce at the pace he currently is going forward he is far and away better for this team than GLat. That is my point.
Nobody is saying that Lats has more raw skill than EC. Raw skill wins shootouts, not hockey games.

My point is that losing Lats on the gamble that EC figures it out, isn't a bet I'm willing to make. I don't care we bring him back, but if we bring him back to fill Lats' spot on the roster, I'm going to be very disappointed.

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03-22-2012, 05:12 PM
  #62
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I really don't understand the hard on Wild fans have for this guy.

He has played 82 games for us in 3 seasons and put up .62 PPG in that 3 season span. He hasn't been able to stay healthy and quite frankly a .62 PPG player is not all that phenominal. Not saying EC is the answer, but if you give me the choice between the two I take EC everyday of the week.
Because when he plays, he is a force on the ice. Physically and on the scoresheet. I really think you've just fallen in love with Christiansen's shootout accumen and his recent 4 game streak. That's just not enough for the rest of us.

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03-22-2012, 05:12 PM
  #63
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Nobody is saying that Lats has more raw skill than EC. Raw skill wins shootouts, not hockey games.

My point is that losing Lats on the gamble that EC figures it out, isn't a bet I'm willing to make. I don't care we bring him back, but if we bring him back to fill Lats' spot on the roster, I'm going to be very disappointed.
Who is suggesting EC takes his spot...I am just saying I like EC and Lats is a liability to this Franchise. I was joking around when I brought EC up and then it kind of snowballed into this thing.

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03-22-2012, 05:13 PM
  #64
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Who is suggesting EC takes his spot...I am just saying I like EC and Lats is a liability to this Franchise. I was joking around when I brought EC up and then it kind of snowballed into this thing.
Lats is a liability to the Franchise? Really? A 1 year 2.5 mil deal not working out is in no way a liability.

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03-22-2012, 05:13 PM
  #65
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Who is suggesting EC takes his spot...I am just saying I like EC and Lats is a liability to this Franchise. I was joking around when I brought EC up and then it kind of snowballed into this thing.
He's a liability to CL's wallet, not the franchise.

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03-22-2012, 05:15 PM
  #66
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Because when he plays, he is a force on the ice. Physically and on the scoresheet. I really think you've just fallen in love with Christiansen's shootout accumen and his recent 4 game streak. That's just not enough for the rest of us.
I have liked the potential of EC from the first time I saw him and like everyone have been disappointed with his play until recently as I think he is capable of a lot more. He is one of the only people on the roster capable of carrying the puck over the blue line instead of the dump and chase.

GLat is a physical presence, cant take that away from him. He just isn't a guy that (atleast on this team) has proven he can stay healthy. What good is a physical presence on IR?

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03-22-2012, 05:20 PM
  #67
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I really don't understand the hard on Wild fans have for this guy.

He has played 82 games for us in 3 seasons and put up .62 PPG in that 3 season span. He hasn't been able to stay healthy and quite frankly a .62 PPG player is not all that phenominal. Not saying EC is the answer, but if you give me the choice between the two I take EC everyday of the week.
The "hard on" I have for lats is based on the fact that he plays exciting hockey. Every shift he plays he is out there working his ass off, making stuff happen, throwing hits, taking shots, you name it. He is fun as hell to watch and he has a pretty damned good scoring touch.

Even now that EC is finally scoring it has been hard to see him out there making the big plays the same way lats has. He is not as physical, he is not as energetic. I don't understand the hard on you have for him. Sure that big play stuff might start showing up eventually, but how long do we wait before we know exactly what we have with EC?

The injury issues that everyone keeps citing about lats are not injuries you can fault him for anymore. Sure, last season he came to camp as Fatandresse and he got himself injured, but he obviously learned from that as he came to camp this year in tip top shape, fully conditioned, and ready to work his ass off. What we saw from him this year was a guy who is going to go out every night and work his tail off to score goals and make this team better and considering how this team has played since January I think that that is exactly the kind of player I grab on to and never let go of. The reason he is out now is because he was illegally thrown into the boards. That's not exactly something you can put on a player and call it his fault. Do you give the same treatment to Crosby if he stays concussed and is an RFA at the end of the year? I mean, according to your standards he is pretty injury prone right now, especially considering he's now been concussed twice. Better cut him loose am I right? He's too big a risk! It's the same thing here and it's total nonsense. You don't fault a player for getting concussed and you don't pass on a workhorse because he is out through no fault of his own.

Bring Lats back next year. Don't count on him being on the roster from day one onward, but consider him a mid-season pickup the same way the Penguins looked at Crosby as one.

And give EC a prove it deal, preferrably two-way, and if he makes good on it, awesome. If he does not, down to Houston he goes, and oh well!

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03-22-2012, 05:21 PM
  #68
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Lats is a liability to the Franchise? Really? A 1 year 2.5 mil deal not working out is in no way a liability.
It is when you don't have the depth to recover from top 6 injuries.

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He's a liability to CL's wallet, not the franchise.
Sure he is, both him and PMB are liabilities. Guys getting paid not to do their jobs because they cannot for whatever reason stay healthy. It happens, I get it...and one season does not a trend make...but after 2-3 seasons of them both missing SIGNIFICANT time you really need to look elsewhere, because if you cannot count on your top 6 to stay healthy where does that leave you?

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03-22-2012, 05:25 PM
  #69
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Sign lats for 1 or 2 years, there is no reason not to. He is the best goal scorer we have. If he does not stay healthy we have some better skilled depth to call up next year.

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03-22-2012, 05:25 PM
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It is when you don't have the depth to recover from top 6 injuries



Sure he is, both him and PMB are liabilities. Guys getting paid not to do their jobs because they cannot for whatever reason stay healthy. It happens, I get it...and one season does not a trend make...but after 2-3 seasons of them both missing SIGNIFICANT time you really need to look elsewhere, because if you cannot count on your top 6 to stay healthy where does that leave you?
We didn't this year; we will next year.

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03-22-2012, 05:28 PM
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The "hard on" I have for lats is based on the fact that he plays exciting hockey. Every shift he plays he is out there working his ass off, making stuff happen, throwing hits, taking shots, you name it. He is fun as hell to watch and he has a pretty damned good scoring touch.

Even now that EC is finally scoring it has been hard to see him out there making the big plays the same way lats has. He is not as physical, he is not as energetic. I don't understand the hard on you have for him. Sure that big play stuff might start showing up eventually, but how long do we wait before we know exactly what we have with EC?

The injury issues that everyone keeps citing about lats are not injuries you can fault him for anymore. Sure, last season he came to camp as Fatandresse and he got himself injured, but he obviously learned from that as he came to camp this year in tip top shape, fully conditioned, and ready to work his ass off. What we saw from him this year was a guy who is going to go out every night and work his tail off to score goals and make this team better and considering how this team has played since January I think that that is exactly the kind of player I grab on to and never let go of. The reason he is out now is because he was illegally thrown into the boards. That's not exactly something you can put on a player and call it his fault. Do you give the same treatment to Crosby if he stays concussed and is an RFA at the end of the year? I mean, according to your standards he is pretty injury prone right now, especially considering he's now been concussed twice. Better cut him loose am I right? He's too big a risk! It's the same thing here and it's total nonsense. You don't fault a player for getting concussed and you don't pass on a workhorse because he is out through no fault of his own.

Bring Lats back next year. Don't count on him being on the roster from day one onward, but consider him a mid-season pickup the same way the Penguins looked at Crosby as one.

And give EC a prove it deal, preferrably two-way, and if he makes good on it, awesome. If he does not, down to Houston he goes, and oh well!
I am not faulting Lats for getting concussed, but you cannot expect the Wild to wait around forever on the off chance that he doesn't get concussed again...he is just PMB 2.0 waiting to happen if you ask me. If you have a job and you get some debilitating disease, that employer is not going to hold your job forever...you are going to be let go...its just the facts of life...your work ethic doesn't even come into the decision...you are simply unable to produce and therefore you gotta go.

Some people are just prone to concussions, not their fault..its just life.

As for Crosby, if injuries become an annual thing sure. Anyone will tell you that being injury prone certainly decreases your value.

Look, I agree that GLat's helps the team when he is healthy and works hard...but 82 games in 3 seasons? Come on.

Trade GLat's rights and cut your losses if you ask me, but then again I am not GMCF.

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03-22-2012, 05:28 PM
  #72
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I really don't understand the hard on Wild fans have for this guy.

He has played 82 games for us in 3 seasons and put up .62 PPG in that 3 season span. He hasn't been able to stay healthy and quite frankly a .62 PPG player is not all that phenominal. Not saying EC is the answer, but if you give me the choice between the two I take EC everyday of the week.
PPG isn't a particularly useful metric for a player whose job is to pot goals. He's been a .40 GPG in his time here, and in his healthy season, he led the team in goals.

As a point of reference, let's look at other Wild players in the post-Lemaire era:

D. Setoguchi - 2011-2012 - .31 GPG
D. Heatley - 2011-2012 - .28 GPG
M. Havlat - 2009-2011 - .26 GPG
M. Koivu - 2009-2012 - .25 GPG
P.M. Bouchard - 2010-2012 - .22 GPG
O. Nolan - 2009-2010 - .22 GPG
M. Cullen - 2010-2012 - .17 GPG

Nobody is even close to .40 GPG.

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03-22-2012, 05:29 PM
  #73
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We didn't this year; we will next year.
I Hope so, but who else is out there that you can sign for 2.5 million? I would gladly take another Brodziak who will give you 82 games over GLat's.

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03-22-2012, 05:30 PM
  #74
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It is when you don't have the depth to recover from top 6 injuries.



Sure he is, both him and PMB are liabilities. Guys getting paid not to do their jobs because they cannot for whatever reason stay healthy. It happens, I get it...and one season does not a trend make...but after 2-3 seasons of them both missing SIGNIFICANT time you really need to look elsewhere, because if you cannot count on your top 6 to stay healthy where does that leave you?
We have at least Granlund, Zucker, Coyle, Phillips, Larsson as young guys coming over next year whose playing style can fit into a top-6 role. Next year's depth will be much greater than this year, Lats not playing will not be a liability.

Lats staying healthy is more likely than EC playing consistently IMO. And If EC isn't on a top line he's been worthless, so many times earlier when he was getting less minutes he was awful in the D zone. He's like Pouliot.

Quote:
I Hope so, but who else is out there that you can sign for 2.5 million? I would gladly take another Brodziak who will give you 82 games over GLat's.
You're not going to be getting anyone close to Brodz for 2.5 mil this FA.

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03-22-2012, 05:32 PM
  #75
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You're not going to be getting anyone close to Brodz for 2.5 mil this FA.
Bingo. Seriously, here's the list, and remember that many of these guys are going to get considerable raises.

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