HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > General Hockey Discussion > The History of Hockey
Mobile Hockey's Future Become a Sponsor Site Rules Support Forum vBookie Page 2
The History of Hockey Relive great moments in hockey history and discuss how the game has changed over time.

FINAL RESULTS: Greatest Leader

View Poll Results: The Greatest Leader??
Mark Messier 29 37.66%
Joe Sakic 0 0%
Ray Bourque 2 2.60%
Mario Lemieux 2 2.60%
Brian Trottier 0 0%
Wayne Gretzky 8 10.39%
Steve Yzerman 22 28.57%
Scott Stevens 7 9.09%
Bobby Clarke 2 2.60%
Mike Modano 0 0%
Ron Francis 1 1.30%
Lanny McDonald 2 2.60%
Darryl Sittler 1 1.30%
Chris Chelios 0 0%
Daniel Alfredsson 1 1.30%
Voters: 77. You may not vote on this poll

Closed Thread
 
Thread Tools
Old
11-19-2004, 06:14 PM
  #1
Bring Back Bucky
Registered User
 
Bring Back Bucky's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Delicieux!
Country: Heard and McDonald Islands
Posts: 7,824
vCash: 50
FINAL RESULTS: Greatest Leader

This weekend's question, who was the greatest leader of our generation. Since I'm submitting the names, I will use guys that I have seen play myself... This is the guy you want addressing the troops and leading them on the ice in game 7. Let's have your write ins, too.


Last edited by Bring Back Bucky: 11-24-2004 at 07:05 PM.
Bring Back Bucky is offline  
Old
11-19-2004, 06:42 PM
  #2
VanIslander
17/07/2014 ATD RIP
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Posts: 18,039
vCash: 500
Modano is no more deserving of a poll entry than Peca.

(Except for Hull's foot in the crease of a non-goal in OT of Game 6.)

I vote OTHER.

VanIslander is offline  
Old
11-19-2004, 06:55 PM
  #3
Bring Back Bucky
Registered User
 
Bring Back Bucky's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Delicieux!
Country: Heard and McDonald Islands
Posts: 7,824
vCash: 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by VanIslander
Modano is no more deserving of a poll entry than Peca.

(Except for Hull's foot in the crease of a non-goal in OT of Game 6.)

I vote OTHER.

I agree with that, I was trying to be a big boy by posting the name of my LEAST FAVORITE player. I am, however a big fan of his fantastic giant poodle Anastasia Priscilla, the $400 doggie food consumer.

Bring Back Bucky is offline  
Old
11-19-2004, 06:56 PM
  #4
Big McLargehuge
Global Moderator
Buff Drinklots
 
Big McLargehuge's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2002
Location: Los Angeles
Country: Germany
Posts: 54,234
vCash: 422
Ron "Saint" Francis

Yzerman a close second.

__________________
“The most terrifying fact about the universe is not that it is hostile, but that it is indifferent. If we can come to terms with this indifference and accept the challenges of life within the boundaries of death, our existence as a species can have genuine meaning and fulfillment. However vast the darkness, we must supply our own light.” - Stanley Kubrick
http://sprites.pokecheck.org/i/054.gif
Big McLargehuge is offline  
Old
11-19-2004, 06:58 PM
  #5
Crosbyfan
Registered User
 
Crosbyfan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Posts: 7,651
vCash: 500
Torn between Yzerman and Sakic. Both Beliveau type leaders. Honourable mention to Messier who has a somewhat different style.

Crosbyfan is online now  
Old
11-19-2004, 07:08 PM
  #6
DownFromNJ
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Posts: 2,536
vCash: 500
Scott Stevens.

DownFromNJ is offline  
Old
11-19-2004, 07:51 PM
  #7
jaywills1020
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Posts: 246
vCash: 500
alfredsson? are you kidding me? what has he done to be mentioned with names like messier and yzerman? the guy hasnt won anything in his life and didnt LEAD his team to anything either. mess has 5 or 6 cups and yzerman playing with a broken knee in the playoffs proves that it goes to one of them. alfredsson? ha ha !!!

jaywills1020 is offline  
Old
11-19-2004, 08:22 PM
  #8
John Flyers Fan
Registered User
 
John Flyers Fan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Country: United States
Posts: 22,345
vCash: 500
Am I the only one that thinks Messier is overrated as a leader ???

John Flyers Fan is offline  
Old
11-19-2004, 08:27 PM
  #9
Bring Back Bucky
Registered User
 
Bring Back Bucky's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Delicieux!
Country: Heard and McDonald Islands
Posts: 7,824
vCash: 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by John Flyers Fan
Am I the only one that thinks Messier is overrated as a leader ???
In my own little world, Mark Messier retired in 1991, having accomplished everything possible as a leader and lives there as an Oiler forever. To me, all that guaranteed win in 94 stuff has been so overdone that it has cast a shadow over the rest of his career by overdoing the legend. But Mark Messier from 84 to 91, that was a leader.

Bring Back Bucky is offline  
Old
11-19-2004, 08:30 PM
  #10
Big McLargehuge
Global Moderator
Buff Drinklots
 
Big McLargehuge's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2002
Location: Los Angeles
Country: Germany
Posts: 54,234
vCash: 422
Quote:
Originally Posted by John Flyers Fan
Am I the only one that thinks Messier is overrated as a leader ???
Hell no.

I see him more as a senile old fool than a great leader anymore.

In the 80s he was legendary as a leader, but today...hardly.

Big McLargehuge is offline  
Old
11-19-2004, 08:52 PM
  #11
windowlicker
Registered User
 
windowlicker's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: Murky Wisconsin
Country: United States
Posts: 2,181
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Handsome B. Wonderful
Hell no.

I see him more as a senile old fool than a great leader anymore.

In the 80s he was legendary as a leader, but today...hardly.
Hence the poll asks for "overall" leadership, best individual leader of the past 15-20 years, not "current" leadership.

windowlicker is offline  
Old
11-19-2004, 09:02 PM
  #12
BM67
Registered User
 
BM67's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: In "The System"
Country: Canada
Posts: 4,578
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by John Flyers Fan
Am I the only one that thinks Messier is overrated as a leader ???
Messier has suffered through a bad decade that has hurt his image for a lot of people. His missing the playoffs over the last seven years reflects badly on him, but wouldn't enter anyone's thoughts if it had happened early in his career. Messier has missed the playoffs 8 times in his 25 year career. In his 17 playoff appearances, his team has lost in the first round only 3 times, and only 1 of them was an upset.

Yzerman on the other hand has missed the playoffs twice in 21 years, but his teams have lost 7 times in the first round, and 4 of those were upsets.

Which reflects worse on their leadership?

BM67 is offline  
Old
11-19-2004, 09:08 PM
  #13
John Flyers Fan
Registered User
 
John Flyers Fan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Country: United States
Posts: 22,345
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by BM67
Messier has suffered through a bad decade that has hurt his image for a lot of people. His missing the playoffs over the last seven years reflects badly on him, but wouldn't enter anyone's thoughts if it had happened early in his career. Messier has missed the playoffs 8 times in his 25 year career. In his 17 playoff appearances, his team has lost in the first round only 3 times, and only 1 of them was an upset.

Yzerman on the other hand has missed the playoffs twice in 21 years, but his teams have lost 7 times in the first round, and 4 of those were upsets.

Which reflects worse on their leadership?
I'm not saying that Messier was a bad leader, but his guarantee and the NY media have made him out to be the best leader in the history of sports, which I think is greatly overstated.

IMO Messier is certainly no better than Stevens, Yzerman, Clarke, Gretzky and Potvin (the Isles captain, not Trottier)

John Flyers Fan is offline  
Old
11-19-2004, 09:29 PM
  #14
BM67
Registered User
 
BM67's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: In "The System"
Country: Canada
Posts: 4,578
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by John Flyers Fan
I'm not saying that Messier was a bad leader, but his guarantee and the NY media have made him out to be the best leader in the history of sports, which I think is greatly overstated.

IMO Messier is certainly no better than Stevens, Yzerman, Clarke, Gretzky and Potvin (the Isles captain, not Trottier)
Messier was a "great" leader before going to NY, so the over-rating of his guarantee isn't all he's highly rated for. Messier is hardly the only player who's had exploits overblown.

BM67 is offline  
Old
11-19-2004, 09:31 PM
  #15
John Flyers Fan
Registered User
 
John Flyers Fan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Country: United States
Posts: 22,345
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by BM67
Messier was a "great" leader before going to NY, so the over-rating of his guarantee isn't all he's highly rated for. Messier is hardly the only player who's had exploits overblown.
I agree that Mess isn't the only overrated player.

Mess was a big time leader in Edmonton; although I think he gets too much credit for the time while Gretzky was there.

Just because Gretzky wasn't the rah, rah guy that Mess is, doesn't mean that he wasn't the leader of the team.

John Flyers Fan is offline  
Old
11-19-2004, 09:52 PM
  #16
Nifty=HHOF
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Depressed Yankee Land
Country: United States
Posts: 1,551
vCash: 500
I'll agree that Messier is overrated as a leader, so my vote goes to Ray Bourque for his years of consistent leadership in Boston.

Nifty=HHOF is offline  
Old
11-19-2004, 09:54 PM
  #17
Habsfan 32
Registered User
 
Habsfan 32's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Way up north...
Country: Canada
Posts: 6,319
vCash: 500
Send a message via ICQ to Habsfan 32 Send a message via MSN to Habsfan 32
Jean Beliveau

Habsfan 32 is offline  
Old
11-20-2004, 12:30 PM
  #18
jiggs 10
Registered User
 
jiggs 10's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Hockeytown, ND
Country: United States
Posts: 3,541
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by John Flyers Fan
Am I the only one that thinks Messier is overrated as a leader ???
No, you are not. I've never been convinced he's done much as a "leader". Gretzky was EASILY the backbone and leader of the Oilers teams when Mess won 4 of his 6 Cups, and what has he done since 1994? Nothing, except NOT get his teams to the playoffs! Some leader!

Yzerman is the best one here. Fiery when he has to be, outstanding team man, hardest working player on the list, at one time the 3rd best player in the NHL (1988-1994), did what was best for the team and quit scoring at a ridiculous rate, learned to win faceoffs and play better defense, and won 3 Cups in 6 years! There you go.

I like Ron Francis, but never thought of him as a "leader". Just a very good player for a long time.

jiggs 10 is offline  
Old
11-20-2004, 03:53 PM
  #19
Crosbyfan
Registered User
 
Crosbyfan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Posts: 7,651
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Habsfan 32
Jean Beliveau
Beliveau would be my pick but I don't think he's in Bring Back Bucky's "generation" as stated in the first post. I voted for Yzerman.

Crosbyfan is online now  
Old
11-20-2004, 04:27 PM
  #20
Bloody Sabbath
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Toronto, Canada
Country: Canada
Posts: 2,263
vCash: 500
Send a message via MSN to Bloody Sabbath
Alfredsson

Bloody Sabbath is offline  
Old
11-20-2004, 04:29 PM
  #21
Jacques Plante
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Montreal--Downtown
Country: Canada
Posts: 516
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by jiggs 10
No, you are not. I've never been convinced he's done much as a "leader". Gretzky was EASILY the backbone and leader of the Oilers teams when Mess won 4 of his 6 Cups, and what has he done since 1994? Nothing, except NOT get his teams to the playoffs! Some leader!

Yzerman is the best one here. Fiery when he has to be, outstanding team man, hardest working player on the list, at one time the 3rd best player in the NHL (1988-1994), did what was best for the team and quit scoring at a ridiculous rate, learned to win faceoffs and play better defense, and won 3 Cups in 6 years! There you go.

I like Ron Francis, but never thought of him as a "leader". Just a very good player for a long time.
A post in which I agree on all 3 points

As you said Messier was always 2nd to Gretzky. In 1994, Leetch was the true leader on the ice along with Richter. Messier finishes a distant 3rd there, despite his game 6 heroics against NJ.

Yzerman, a proven winner. I'll always remember him playing with that bad knee. No, he wasn't a scoring machine like in the old days but he still chipped in. His faceoff work was great and he was solid in his own end. Remember him being knocked down and grimacing when he got up? That's a leader.

I wonder if in 5-10 years we'll be talking about Jarome Iginla like this. I sort of see him as a young Stevie Y. He scores, hits, fights, plays good D and is a good face in the community.

Jacques Plante is offline  
Old
11-20-2004, 04:44 PM
  #22
Charge_Seven
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Country: Canada
Posts: 4,631
vCash: 500
Was Daniel Alfredsson included in this class as a sick joke, or what? lol

Charge_Seven is offline  
Old
11-20-2004, 04:46 PM
  #23
Bruins4Ever
Registered User
 
Bruins4Ever's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Caledonia, Ontario
Country: Canada
Posts: 5,236
vCash: 500
Send a message via MSN to Bruins4Ever
Bourque. He consistently showed that he was the best leader in many years. He never won a Cup in Boston, but being a leader has nothing to do with the championships, but it has to do with how you work with your teammates, and how you inspire them. A leader can't be the one responsible for not winning a Cup, that's up to the whole team. That's what happened in Boston, but Bourque was the leader for so many years, and he was respected by everyone in the league.

He never let his anger take control of him, he never bad mouthed other players, but he showed everyone on the Bruins that someone in every group is a true leader, and Bourque was the true leader of the Bruins for 20 years.

Bruins4Ever is offline  
Old
11-20-2004, 04:46 PM
  #24
Crosbyfan
Registered User
 
Crosbyfan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Posts: 7,651
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by rick_tml89
Alfredsson
How about Jagr?

Crosbyfan is online now  
Old
11-20-2004, 09:46 PM
  #25
Big McLargehuge
Global Moderator
Buff Drinklots
 
Big McLargehuge's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2002
Location: Los Angeles
Country: Germany
Posts: 54,234
vCash: 422
Quote:
Originally Posted by jiggs 10
I like Ron Francis, but never thought of him as a "leader". Just a very good player for a long time.
Ronny was a good enough leader to push Mario to an alternate.

That should speak volumes right there.

But, like basically everything that Ronny did, it seems only Penguins, Whalers, and Hurricane fans will understand just how good he really was.

I do agree that Stevey Y is, at worst, the second best captain in the game though. I have Yzerman and Francis as 1a and 1b, but I voted for Francis to give him so love in the poll.

Big McLargehuge is offline  
Closed Thread

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 08:30 PM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"
Contact Us - HFBoards - Archive - Privacy Statement - Terms of Use - Advertise - Top - AdChoices

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. ©2014 All Rights Reserved.