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03-26-2012, 02:10 AM
  #176
5minsforfighting
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Originally Posted by JabbaJabba View Post
Wow, you guys overrate fighting. 5 minute penalties don't get you victories, goals do. Also there's more than one way to play this game.
Yes there is more ways to play games, but abvious SPEED tactics isnt working for his club. We used to be team that punish opponents with hits and aggressive crushing the net.
I'm suprised how fast guys here has forgotten what it took for this club to win The Cup.

P.S. Is that just me, or since BB took over Beauchemin and Belesky stop throwing any hits?

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03-26-2012, 02:19 AM
  #177
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Originally Posted by 5minsforfighting View Post
Yes there is more ways to play games, but abvious SPEED tactics isnt working for his club. We used to be team that punish opponents with hits and aggressive crushing the net.
I'm suprised how fast guys here has forgotten what it took for this club to win The Cup.

P.S. Is that just me, or since BB took over Beauchemin and Belesky stop throwing any hits?
It's you. Beauchemin led the team with 3 vs St Louis and 4 vs the Predators. Beleskey is more inconsistent but usually shows up on the scoresheet as well.

He does appear to be trying to get players to stop trying to throw hits that take them out of position and give up odd man rushes however.

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03-26-2012, 02:25 AM
  #178
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Originally Posted by 5minsforfighting View Post
Yes there is more ways to play games, but abvious SPEED tactics isnt working for his club. We used to be team that punish opponents with hits and aggressive crushing the net.
I'm suprised how fast guys here has forgotten what it took for this club to win The Cup.

P.S. Is that just me, or since BB took over Beauchemin and Belesky stop throwing any hits?
I think I have this correct.

Beauch: 55 hits in first 24 games under RC
Beauch: 41 hits in first 24 games under BB
Beauch: 52 hits in the 28 games since then

Beleskey: 26 hits in first 19 games under RC
Beleskey: 32 hits in first 19 games under BB
Beleskey: 38 hits in the 27 games since then

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03-26-2012, 02:33 AM
  #179
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My bad I guess, cant argue with stats, but still missing those crunching open ice hits by Beauchemin.

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03-26-2012, 02:36 AM
  #180
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I think I have this correct.

Beauch: 55 hits in first 24 games under RC
Beauch: 41 hits in first 24 games under BB
Beauch: 52 hits in the 28 games since then

Beleskey: 26 hits in first 19 games under RC
Beleskey: 32 hits in first 19 games under BB
Beleskey: 38 hits in the 27 games since then
Slow night at work, huh?

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Old
03-26-2012, 02:38 AM
  #181
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Slow night at work, huh?
It's Sunday night afterall. Actually had to do something serious a few minutes ago but pretty much yeah. Thank Tebow for Yahoo game logs.

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Old
03-26-2012, 04:19 AM
  #182
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only because of the eye injury
More like since he got married.

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Old
03-26-2012, 04:44 AM
  #183
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I miss the days of Todd Fedoruk and Brad May, at least they were good enough players to be in the lineup regulary.

The problem isn't purely lack of toughness or too much speed. Those are just a couple of attributes. The problem is the players overall abilities, there's only four top six forwards on this team and a bunch of 3rd liners (Koivu may still be top six material, but not on a good team). You could switch Hagman and Blake with Parros and Bodie, but you'd still wouldn't win more games as neither could fill the two holes in the top six.

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Old
03-26-2012, 12:21 PM
  #184
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Most teams have players who fight and throw hits, when this team had a goon squad they won a cup and had other great playoff runs and when they a assemble a roster of soft small wimps they turn into a lottery team. Anymore "facts" for you
How about entertainment? Fighting brawls big hits = entertainment for 99% of the crowd
You might be that 1% who hate fights. Judging by the empty seats of bored fans I think people would rather have things my way.
Selective amnesia much? Anaheim didn't win the Cup because they gooned it up. They won the Cup because they had two future HOF defenseman playing 30 minutes a night, the best shutdown line in the league, a 4th line that could play hard-nosed hockey and be effective, and a 1st and 2nd line that were equally capable of scoring.

Anaheim wasn't just an intimidating team because they could beat you up. They were intimidating, first and foremost, because they beat you on the scoreboard. If Anaheim had gone into those games and just gooned it up they would have been laughed at.

As for the empty seats... again, very selective. You point at fighting. I'll point at the scoreboard. Winning games is a bigger draw than fighting. If Anaheim were fighting for the playoffs, you can bet there would be more fans in the seats.

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03-26-2012, 12:40 PM
  #185
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As for the empty seats... again, very selective. You point at fighting. I'll point at the scoreboard. Winning games is a bigger draw than fighting. If Anaheim were fighting for the playoffs, you can bet there would be more fans in the seats.
Well as I said earlier, I would rather watch an exciting physical loss than a boring ass win. Unless some changes are made over the summer to make the team tougher and more physical, I'll be taking the money I spend on the season tickets I share, and using to get Center Ice and going Ontario Reign games. If I wanted to watch boring ass Euro-hockey, I'd be a Redwings fan.

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03-26-2012, 12:46 PM
  #186
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Well as I said earlier, I would rather watch an exciting physical loss than a boring ass win. Unless some changes are made over the summer to make the team tougher and more physical, I'll be taking the money I spend on the season tickets I share, and using to get Center Ice and going Ontario Reign games. If I wanted to watch boring ass Euro-hockey, I'd be a Redwings fan.
If you're that fickle a fan, it was going to happen eventually.

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03-26-2012, 12:49 PM
  #187
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On Parros, he needs to work on skating during off-season (everything can be improved given enough repetition) and he needs to forget that he is a classy guy from Princeton and play nasty.

Quote:
Originally Posted by parrosfan16 View Post
Well as I said earlier, I would rather watch an exciting physical loss than a boring ass win. Unless some changes are made over the summer to make the team tougher and more physical, I'll be taking the money I spend on the season tickets I share, and using to get Center Ice and going Ontario Reign games. If I wanted to watch boring ass Euro-hockey, I'd be a Redwings fan.
Huh, what? This doesn't make sense.

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03-26-2012, 01:13 PM
  #188
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On Parros, he needs to work on skating during off-season (everything can be improved given enough repetition) and he needs to forget that he is a classy guy from Princeton and play nasty.
While this is true, there is a steep learning curve, and Parros is past the development age. That doesn't make it impossible, it just means more work needs to be put into it for the same gains.

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03-26-2012, 01:14 PM
  #189
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I would rather see this team play successful, "boring ass" Euro-hockey like Red Wings play than goon hockey from the 90s. Which means more to you, Cups or fights and hits?

Also it seems that most of you haven't seen any Euro-hockey, it's much more interesting game in a bigger rink than in a smaller one. And it's not like there's no hitting or fights, they are just a one part of hockey, why can't you enjoy the rest?

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03-26-2012, 01:17 PM
  #190
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Originally Posted by JabbaJabba View Post
I would rather see this team play successful, "boring ass" Euro-hockey like Red Wings play than goon hockey from the 90s. Which means more to you, Cups or fights and hits?

Also it seems that most of you haven't seen any Euro-hockey, it's much more interesting game in a bigger rink than in a smaller one. And it's not like there's no hitting or fights, they are just a one part of hockey, why can't you enjoy the rest?
Disagree. I don't consider it more interesting at all. It's a noticeably different game, but the extra ice masks mistakes, and it comes across as overall a slower game.

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03-26-2012, 01:21 PM
  #191
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Disagree. I don't consider it more interesting at all. It's a noticeably different game, but the extra ice masks mistakes, and it comes across as overall a slower game.
I don't see how slowness is such a bad thing. It's intense enough.

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03-26-2012, 01:23 PM
  #192
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Originally Posted by Zapp Brannigan View Post
On Parros, he needs to work on skating during off-season (everything can be improved given enough repetition) and he needs to forget that he is a classy guy from Princeton and play nasty.

Huh, what? This doesn't make sense.
Have said this many times, but now feel differently. George has hockey skills, as witnessed during the team's skill competition. What he needs are 2 linemates that are the hardnosed "enforcer-types". We started this season with those kinds of players in JF Jacques, and Brian McGrattan. One waived, and another has decision issues, and so was sent down. Georgie's role has changed, like it or not.
He is an identifiable face of the Franchise. He is constantly doing meet and greets, and other outreach fan interaction events. His Nonprofit work, his volunteer work, his "environmental" Honda connection, etc. His "goonishness" would hamper this part of his popularity with the "casual" fan. BUT as the elder statesman of a 3 man wrecking line, allowing the bloodlusting youngbucks to wade into someone fists a-blazing, only to be the voice of reason he is very valuable. Brad May played that role in '07.

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03-26-2012, 01:27 PM
  #193
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I don't see how slowness is such a bad thing. It's intense enough.
The speed of the game is one of the things that makes the NHL great. As is the grittiness of North American hockey. It isn't enough to be a talented player. You need to be tough. It's the best league in the world for a reason.

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03-26-2012, 01:48 PM
  #194
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As for the empty seats... again, very selective. You point at fighting. I'll point at the scoreboard. Winning games is a bigger draw than fighting. If Anaheim were fighting for the playoffs, you can bet there would be more fans in the seats.
I'm almost certian the attendace woes are due to the horrible starts. People hear that the Ducks are doing awful and never bother to check up on us again.

Quote:
I would rather see this team play successful, "boring ass" Euro-hockey like Red Wings play than goon hockey from the 90s. Which means more to you, Cups or fights and hits?

Also it seems that most of you haven't seen any Euro-hockey, it's much more interesting game in a bigger rink than in a smaller one. And it's not like there's no hitting or fights, they are just a one part of hockey, why can't you enjoy the rest?
This team isn't coming anywhere near winning a cup without some substantial new pieces.

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03-26-2012, 01:56 PM
  #195
JabbaJabba
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The speed of the game is one of the things that makes the NHL great. As is the grittiness of North American hockey. It isn't enough to be a talented player. You need to be tough. It's the best league in the world for a reason.
"Best" is relative. If the rules would change against tough playing, those now good players wouldn't be considered good anymore. Also I still don't see how violence makes stuff better.

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03-26-2012, 02:00 PM
  #196
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This team isn't coming anywhere near winning a cup without some substantial new pieces.
I agree. I never said that this team is perfect. This whole overrating toughness just started annoying.

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03-26-2012, 02:02 PM
  #197
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Punishing hitting was the cherry on top

You can hit, and lose. You can not hit, and win.
However, hitting doesn't mean winning.

When the Ducks won the cup, the team was clicking, comfortable with coverage, skating, scoring, and really competitive in every game, then hitting was that 'over the top/in your face' attitude that the Ducks had.

The most punishing aspect of the hitting happened when the Ducks were up on the scoreboard, and then continued to punish physically. Its kind of like, "ok, we've beat you on the score sheet... now we have to find another way to beat you and destroy your moral".

Teams/fans didn't hate the Ducks because they hit dirty, its because they won on the score sheet and THEN continued to beat teams physically.

Fast forward to today's Ducks:

We aren't winning on the score sheet. We aren't winning in the effort, the skating, or even in the confidence department. I don't think throwing an extra hit every game or two is going to change that.

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03-26-2012, 02:12 PM
  #198
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"Best" is relative. If the rules would change against tough playing, those now good players wouldn't be considered good anymore. Also I still don't see how violence makes stuff better.
Let me be specific then.

It has the highest competition level, and it draws the best players in the world.

Being more physical is not the same as being violent. I couldn't care less about the fighting, but North American hockey is definitely more physical, and I think the on-ice product is better as a result.

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03-26-2012, 02:13 PM
  #199
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Are people really not going to go to games because it's not gooning it up every game? Come on now.

If this team is winning the fans will come. Not because some oompa loompa with a moustache is out there skating and being a general liability.

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03-26-2012, 02:20 PM
  #200
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Are people really not going to go to games because it's not gooning it up every game? Come on now.

If this team is winning the fans will come. Not because some oompa loompa with a moustache is out there skating and being a general liability.
Pretty much. I agree that the Ducks were an exciting team when they were intimidating physically and on the scoreboard, but most of that(for me) was because the Ducks were just successful everywhere on the ice. Some nights they just looked like they were too good for the league, and they had a cocky swagger that made it seem like they knew it.

Resorting to gooning it up when they aren't winning just seems sad to me. Like being a bully who works at a grocery store, who was held back a year, with no future ahead of him.

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