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Burke Stay The Course

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Old
03-28-2012, 11:53 AM
  #101
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Originally Posted by mcleex View Post
The sad part is other GMs know Burke is desperate to make a change and make the playoffs next year so they will ask for more in trade negotiations.
Negotiation 101 don't be surprised if we give up a lot next year in a trade
So it's a bad idea to let a bunch of the fans run the team.

Burke has had plenty of anchors tossed his way already, I am sure.

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03-28-2012, 11:53 AM
  #102
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Originally Posted by John-Eric Iannicello View Post
My point exactly. The team has finished at the bottom numerous times because it's stunk (for the most part), I find it highly unlikely he wouldn't dump any player if he felt it would make the team better. Crazy to think his ego would have him thinking 'I signed Armstrong, therefore I'm not dealing him'.
Would look great in a Blue Jackets uniform

he had his opportunity, time for a younger cheaper guy to step in.

There are solutions for some of this team's issues to come from within, it's just a matter of who has the gall to step up at training camp really.

Hope it's Brad Ross

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03-28-2012, 11:58 AM
  #103
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Originally Posted by bobbyflex View Post
Burkie doesn't need to do too much this offseason. Leafs were a playoff team for 90% of the season. So the 2nd youngest team in the NHL collapsed in a market with the highest pressure? Big surprise.

All he needs to do is solidify his goaltending. Get rid of as many members of LACK as he can. and add some toughness to the forward group.

We'll be fine.
This. A couple prospects will make the team imo, like kadri frattin and bump out a couple players out of the top 6, next year squeek into the playoffs and get experience and the year after that a lot of contracts are up, such as lombardi and connolly. I don't see Burke making a lot of big moves but maybe a move to solidify the goaltending. This plummit was worth it if we can draft galchenyuk

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03-28-2012, 12:03 PM
  #104
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Originally Posted by Culture Vulture View Post
Would look great in a Blue Jackets uniform

he had his opportunity, time for a younger cheaper guy to step in.

There are solutions for some of this team's issues to come from within, it's just a matter of who has the gall to step up at training camp really.

Hope it's Brad Ross
People complain about not enough leadership, but want to take out armstrong and put in a younger player

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03-28-2012, 12:12 PM
  #105
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Originally Posted by pooleboy View Post
People complain about not enough leadership, but want to take out armstrong and put in a younger player

Yeah. If your implying that Colby Armstrong has proven to be a leader on this team then I await the evidence.

There is a leadership void in the dressing room & on the ice & it's no accident that he is in the proverbial Chateau Bow Wow that is the press box.

Get rid & let his open roster spot be an opportunity for a younger, cheaper player to step up & show some hunger.

PArt of the solution to the current dilemma has to come from within & we may have may someone who can do that.

Colby has had ample opportunity to do so in my opinion with no results.

Leadership is not the exclusive domain of veteran players.

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03-28-2012, 12:17 PM
  #106
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Originally Posted by mcleex View Post
The sad part is other GMs know Burke is desperate to make a change and make the playoffs next year so they will ask for more in trade negotiations.
Negotiation 101 don't be surprised if we give up a lot next year in a trade
agreed

look at the Rask for Raycroft trade, pure leverage

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03-28-2012, 12:20 PM
  #107
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Originally Posted by mcleex View Post
The sad part is other GMs know Burke is desperate to make a change and make the playoffs next year so they will ask for more in trade negotiations.
Negotiation 101 don't be surprised if we give up a lot next year in a trade
Burke has shown before that no matter what the pressure he will choose to not make deals. The fans are desperate, don't incinuate that Burke is!

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03-28-2012, 12:58 PM
  #108
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Originally Posted by thebluemachine View Post
Maybe his real agenda was to tell everyone we are going to make the playoffs (like all GM's do) and this was really a plan to get a bunch of lottery picks and high 1st's since we are going through a rebuild.
he didn't acquire kessel, phaneuf, komisarek, armstrong, steckel, liles, beauchemin, etc. to get lottery picks.

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He could have easily signed/traded for a veteran goalie or retained Giguere and finished in the middle of the pack again but opted to ride on two young unproven goalies instead, seems fishy.
clearly, he truly thought gustavsson was good enough. burke furiously pursued the monster and did every he could possibly do to get him signed. in fact, he said he had never worked so hard before in his life to acquire one player.

he didn't do that in 2009 so he could get a lottery pick in 2012. lets not pretend this is all part of a master plan. this is simply a combination of many mistakes.

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03-28-2012, 01:08 PM
  #109
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Originally Posted by Frankie View Post
he didn't acquire kessel, phaneuf, komisarek, armstrong, steckel, liles, beauchemin, etc. to get lottery picks.


clearly, he truly thought gustavsson was good enough. burke furiously pursued the monster and did every he could possibly do to get him signed. in fact, he said he had never worked so hard before in his life to acquire one player.

he didn't do that in 2009 so he could get a lottery pick in 2012. lets not pretend this is all part of a master plan. this is simply a combination of many mistakes.
Your opinion.

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03-28-2012, 01:09 PM
  #110
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I think Burke is learning on the job right now. He had no idea how harad this was going to be. Our team had nothing for prospects and nothing for talent. We now have some prospects but still no talent. I'm sure if he could he would take that Kessel deal back. He's just to pigheaded to admit it. Now he knows the importance of a 1st round pick. Let's hope we still have one come this years draft.

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03-28-2012, 01:31 PM
  #111
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Originally Posted by catgoldfish View Post
I think Burke is learning on the job right now. He had no idea how harad this was going to be. Our team had nothing for prospects and nothing for talent. We now have some prospects but still no talent. I'm sure if he could he would take that Kessel deal back. He's just to pigheaded to admit it. Now he knows the importance of a 1st round pick. Let's hope we still have one come this years draft.
The reason he's not going to admit to regretting the Kessel trade is not pride, he's supporting his player in Kessel.

While I agree with many points, Cox is apologizing for BB with the same energy he was attacking RW. You know what that means.. agenda.

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03-28-2012, 01:35 PM
  #112
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Originally Posted by catgoldfish View Post
I think Burke is learning on the job right now. He had no idea how harad this was going to be. Our team had nothing for prospects and nothing for talent. We now have some prospects but still no talent. I'm sure if he could he would take that Kessel deal back. He's just to pigheaded to admit it. Now he knows the importance of a 1st round pick. Let's hope we still have one come this years draft.
Schenn, Gunnarsson, Kulemin, Grabovski, Stalberg, Reimer, and Tlusty were all in the system when Burke took over.

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03-28-2012, 02:26 PM
  #113
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Originally Posted by Joseppi View Post
Schenn, Gunnarsson, Kulemin, Grabovski, Stalberg, Reimer, and Tlusty were all in the system when Burke took over.
+1

People forget this. If Burke was fired today and another GM took over, we'd be blessed if that many NHL-calibre players could be produced from Burke's collection of prospects.

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03-28-2012, 02:36 PM
  #114
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Originally Posted by birddog View Post
The problem with staying the course is that Burke never set course for a rebuild. That's why most fans including myself are confused as to what the actual course is. I'm all for the tank but you don't trade your first round picks if you are. Burke strayed from the course almost immediately when he made the Kessel deal. Now four years later he's going to get back on course?
Just because you can't seem to figure it out, doesn't mean he didn't set a course. Burke used trades to get some good pieces he thought he'd need (Kessel, Phaneuf, Lupul, Gardiner, Colborne, Franson), drafted the type of players teams just aren't giving up these days (Biggs, Ross), and used FA as more of a stopgap to allow the kids to develop with the Marlies. Sure, he's made some questionable FA signings, but for the grand scheme of things, they're irrelevant, as they'll be off the books at the end of this season or next.

One of Burke's big mistakes was making the don't need 5 years for contending statement, which dumb fans all over seem to be clinging to these days. Given what the trade and the FA market has been looking over the past few years, it was an unrealistic goal. That, of course, is an easy observation to make with 20/20 hindsight.

The next two seasons will be fairly important, as it's when the team will truely take shape. With most of the contracts (save Grabo's and Schenn's) coming off the books, it'll be interesting to see who's kept and who's flipped.

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03-28-2012, 02:37 PM
  #115
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Originally Posted by Joseppi View Post
Schenn, Gunnarsson, Kulemin, Grabovski, Stalberg, Reimer, and Tlusty were all in the system when Burke took over.
Tlusty blows!

Grabs and Schenn were brought in under Fletcher who is a part of current mgmt.

Which leaves Gunnie, Kule, Stalberg and Reimer!

I am positive out of the cuurent prospect pool we can at least find a Gunnie, Kule, Reimer and Stalberg!

It was also Burke who got rid of all the garbage (Not Stalberg as I alwasy liked that kid) and kept the useful players that have really worked out!

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03-28-2012, 02:45 PM
  #116
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Originally Posted by Leafsman View Post
Tlusty blows!

Grabs and Schenn were brought in under Fletcher who is a part of current mgmt.

Which leaves Gunnie, Kule, Stalberg and Reimer!

I am positive out of the cuurent prospect pool we can at least find a Gunnie, Kule, Reimer and Stalberg!

It was also Burke who got rid of all the garbage (Not Stalberg as I alwasy liked that kid) and kept the useful players that have really worked out!
Tlusty has twice the amount of goals Kulemin has this season...

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03-28-2012, 02:46 PM
  #117
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Originally Posted by daveleaf View Post
Burke is a blow hard idiot. All bark but no bite just like this team. I get a kick knowing the other GM's getting a good laugh on old Burkey.
And Cox is a simple minded when it comes to hockey, but has been a big booster of
Burke's since he got here and predicted almost instant success. We're still waiting Coxey.

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03-28-2012, 02:49 PM
  #118
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Tlusty has twice the amount of goals Kulemin has this season...
Well!! Then kodo's to him for beating a guy enduring his worst slump ever!! I stand by my notion that he blow's!!!

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03-28-2012, 02:51 PM
  #119
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Tlusty has twice the amount of goals Kulemin has this season...
He's also riding Staal's coattails.

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03-28-2012, 03:14 PM
  #120
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He Can't trade the pick we all know that but he also can't get a #1 Center and Goalie either.

The leafs are going to have to tanks a couple more years and then hope they can come along enough to attract some UFAs like st.louis did

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03-28-2012, 03:15 PM
  #121
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Most Journalists wont say a bad word about Burke because if they do he cuts them off from Leafs related interviews.

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03-28-2012, 03:23 PM
  #122
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Most Journalists wont say a bad word about Burke because if they do he cuts them off from Leafs related interviews.
You quite obviously don't read any Toronto media!!

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03-28-2012, 03:36 PM
  #123
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Originally Posted by duckyjets View Post
He Can't trade the pick we all know that but he also can't get a #1 Center and Goalie either.

The leafs are going to have to tanks a couple more years and then hope they can come along enough to attract some UFAs like st.louis did
Unfortunately for Burke, a total rebuild like St Lous isn't an option anymore since he's on borrowed time (or contracted time, whatever, the point is that tanking for 1-2 more years to do that will cost him his job)

so I'm worried about what moves he could make from here on out, outside of just standing pat, because he's dug himself a hole and desperation yields poor results

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03-28-2012, 03:41 PM
  #124
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Originally Posted by thebluemachine View Post
Your opinion.
You would be a great defense attorney

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03-28-2012, 05:26 PM
  #125
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Originally Posted by Leafsman View Post
The 7 year thing is has to be forgotten! Only half that time is attributed to Burke so bringing it up is pointless!

Burke's job is in no way in jeoprady and noone of any substance is questioning him. The only one;s questioning him are some clueless people here and some irrelevant rating-****** in the media! No oneof any say-so or intelligence believes his job is being questioned or in jeoprady!
No, it's far from 'pointless' when a) the city is starved for playoff attention and b) you've made it your intention, as a GM, to not engage in a 5 year rebuild, and instead be competitive for the playoffs. You make the mistake of thinking I am attributing the 7 year absence from the playoffs to Burke; instead, I am mentioning how it factors into 'staying the course', which it does. Simple proof: think of how different Burke's job would be if the Leafs had made the playoffs before he was hired (assuming he does get hired). To say that this would not factor in, would be absurd.

His job may not be in jeopardy but that does not mean he's safe in the long-term. This is irrelevant anyway since, I am not discussing Burke's future -- though you seem to be.

To your other points:

1) I could care less what the media says. It does not "paint" 'objective reality' and it effects one's leadership; I generally disagree with the majority of it anyway. Though, I have realized the majority of 'news' that I actually do read is from this site.

2) Again, I am not discussing Burke's future but am merely questioning a) what the course is and b) how will it be achieved so that I can judge if management is indeed 'staying the course'. Since you have not answered these questions or as it appears, anything that I had originally posted, I don't know why you quoted me at all, and consequently refer to things such as 'intelligence' or 'clueless people'.

On a final note: exclamation marks for the sake of exclamation marks are childish.

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