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Old
04-01-2012, 07:54 PM
  #51
CREW99AW
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Originally Posted by TheGleninator View Post
I wonder if there is a way we could get Nino as well? I think Sven could be what Nino needs to break out.
A yr in the AHL, is what 19 yr old Nino needs.

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04-01-2012, 07:58 PM
  #52
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Originally Posted by CREW99AW View Post
A yr in the AHL, is what 19 yr old Nino needs.
He has lost an entire year of development I don't think he has the ceiling that he was project to have.

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04-01-2012, 08:01 PM
  #53
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Originally Posted by HighLifeMan View Post
My turn. Three big trades to retool the franchise. (Boring day...Sunday.)

To
Dmitri Orlov
Cody Eakin
1st Round 2012 (WSH or COL)

To
Jarome Iginla

---------------------

To
Michael Grabner
Calvin Dehaan
2nd round pick 2012

To
Jay Bouwmeester
Mitch Wahl
4th round pick 2013

---------------------

To
Derek Roy

To
Matt Stajan
1st Round Pick 2012 (WSH or COL)

---------------------

Re-Sign Mikael Backlund - 3 years / 1.3M Per Season
Re-Sign Blair Jones - 2 years / 900k Per Season
Re-Sign Leland Irving - 3 years / 1.2M Per Season
Re-Sign Blake Comeau - 1 year / 1.2M Per Season

Sign Nicklas Grossman - 4 years / 3.75M Per Season
Sign Jason Garrison - 3 years / 2.75M Per Season
Sign Paul Gaustad - 3 years / 2.8M Per Season

---------------------

2012 Roster

Sven Baertschi - Derek Roy - Michael Cammalleri(A)
Alex Tanguay - Mikael Backlund - Michael Grabner
Curtis Glencross - Paul Gaustad(A) - Cody Eakin
Lance Bouma - Blair Jones - Blake Comeau

Mark Giordano(C) - Nicklas Grossman
Jason Garrison - Dmitri Orlov
Chris Butler - T.J Brodie

Miikka Kiprusoff
Leland Irving

-----------------

Make a huge play for Ryan Suter on July 1st, but I dont expect him to sign here.
Move Miikka Kiprusoff at the deadline if we happen to be outside of a playoff spot.
Very interesting moves. I like the looks of the lineup but it could use some physical presence in the top 6. But I really like that D core.

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04-01-2012, 08:08 PM
  #54
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We get completely ass ***** in this deal. I know Bouwmeester is everyone's favorite whipping boy right now, but he is worth much more than this despite the popular HF opinion.

Why so many Flames fans want Grabner is unfathomable to me. The guy is overpaid and just not that good. The thought of Grabner on the Flames for 4 more years makes me want to punch a baby. He is a 1 dimensional play who's one dimension is extremely inconsistent and quite frankly mediocre. His flop in his sophomore season just illustrates this as his shooting percentage fell down to more realistic levels.

I do like De Haan but his stock has fallen recently and him and a 2nd just isn't enough of a return. I would want another top end prospect instead of Grabner as well as someone like Reasoner who would address some of our faceoff issues.

Besides its all moot, because there is no way Bouwmeester waives his NTC to go to the Islanders. He signed with us before hitting free agency because he wanted to be close to home.
I like Bouwmeester more than the average Flames fan, but his trade value is extremely limited on the open market. Quitre frankly, Grabner is one dimensional but he is also only 25 years old, and one season removed from 30 goals. At this point, is Jay Bouwmeester really anything more than a one dimensional player in the current makeup of our team?

It is quite obvious we need a rather large culture change in this organization and as good as Bouwmeester can be, he has simply not lived up to expectations. We are not going to get a Ryan Strome, or a Nino Niederreiter at this point in time that much is obvious.

I completely disagree, in my opinion that is fair value for what Bouwmeester has produced in the past three seasons.

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04-01-2012, 08:10 PM
  #55
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Originally Posted by Body Checker View Post
Very interesting moves. I like the looks of the lineup but it could use some physical presence in the top 6. But I really like that D core.
Yeah, that was my main concern. The top six is in fact small and not very physical.

I would entertain the idea of bringing back Jokinen to slot in as the second line center for two or three years.

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04-01-2012, 08:15 PM
  #56
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Originally Posted by CREW99AW View Post
Isles would not want to pay Jaybo $6.6m even if he did not have a NTC.Isles have a tight budget
De Haan is in his rookie yr in Bridgeport.He was named to the all-star team and is expected to push for a spot on next season's NYI roster.Isles would rather pay De Haan $1.4m then pay Jaybo $6.6m

Grabner makes $1m this season.$2m next season.$3m in 2013-2014.He won't make big bucks until yrs 4 and 5.
Thats fine, I don't want your garbage. And the fact that the Isles would rather have De Haan than Bouwmeester is exactly why they are on the brink of moving and a joke around the league. You keep your guys, we keep our and we will see you in Quebec City in a couple years.

Quote:
Originally Posted by HighLifeMan View Post
I like Bouwmeester more than the average Flames fan, but his trade value is extremely limited on the open market. Quitre frankly, Grabner is one dimensional but he is also only 25 years old, and one season removed from 30 goals. At this point, is Jay Bouwmeester really anything more than a one dimensional player in the current makeup of our team?

It is quite obvious we need a rather large culture change in this organization and as good as Bouwmeester can be, he has simply not lived up to expectations. We are not going to get a Ryan Strome, or a Nino Niederreiter at this point in time that much is obvious.

I completely disagree, in my opinion that is fair value for what Bouwmeester has produced in the past three seasons.
Bouwmeester is a top 2 defenseman on almost any team in the NHL, his makes a good first pass, is very good defensively and as everyone knows his skating is second to none.

Grabner is a 30 point player who had a 30 goal season as a blip on his radar because he had a lucky season where his shooting percentage was abnormally high. So he's 25, Bouwmeester is only 29 and has a ton of good hockey left in him.

you think your value is fair, i think its a joke and quite frankly trades like that won't help us much in the future and kill us now.

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04-01-2012, 08:34 PM
  #57
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Originally Posted by Medium Rare View Post
Thats fine, I don't want your garbage. And the fact that the Isles would rather have De Haan than Bouwmeester is exactly why they are on the brink of moving and a joke around the league. You keep your guys, we keep our and we will see you in Quebec City in a couple years.


Bouwmeester is a top 2 defenseman on almost any team in the NHL, his makes a good first pass, is very good defensively and as everyone knows his skating is second to none.

Grabner is a 30 point player who had a 30 goal season as a blip on his radar because he had a lucky season where his shooting percentage was abnormally high. So he's 25, Bouwmeester is only 29 and has a ton of good hockey left in him.

you think your value is fair, i think its a joke and quite frankly trades like that won't help us much in the future and kill us now.
Listen, I am not actively looking to get rid of him as I feel he would be far more effective under a different coach/system. But...should management decide to shop him, I just can't see the market bringing back the return you deem necessary.

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04-01-2012, 08:53 PM
  #58
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Originally Posted by TheGleninator View Post
He has lost an entire year of development I don't think he has the ceiling that he was project to have.
He's 19,not early to mid 20s.

I've seen what a full yr in the AHL has done for De Haan and Ness.Both were very poised during brief call ups this season.

I expect Nino,Nelson and Kabanov to be logging a lot of time on the Sound Tigers top line next season.

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04-01-2012, 08:54 PM
  #59
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Listen, I am not actively looking to get rid of him as I feel he would be far more effective under a different coach/system. But...should management decide to shop him, I just can't see the market bringing back the return you deem necessary.
I think you are wrong. The guy is a top 2 defenseman on any team in the league. He plays 25+ minutes a night and is extremely durable. If he is dealt for unknowns (face it a 2nd, a guy with 1 NHL game and a sophomore with 2 seasons that are polar opposites are unknown) it would have to be for a 1st+ or the Flames are just throwing him away. He is more valuable to keep than trade for a package or 2nd rate pieces

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04-01-2012, 08:55 PM
  #60
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Originally Posted by Medium Rare View Post
Thats fine, I don't want your garbage. And the fact that the Isles would rather have De Haan than Bouwmeester is exactly why they are on the brink of moving and a joke around the league. You keep your guys, we keep our and we will see you in Quebec City in a couple years.


.
I missed the report from a credible source,saying Snow was after Jaybo.

See you in Brooklyn after 2015.

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04-01-2012, 08:56 PM
  #61
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Originally Posted by CREW99AW View Post
He's 19,not early to mid 20s.

I've seen what a full yr in the AHL has done for De Haan and Ness.Both were very poised during brief call ups this season.

I expect Nino,Nelson and Kabanov to be logging a lot of time on the Sound Tigers top line next season.
I am not saying he is going to be terrible or anything I just think his ceiling is a little lower than before.

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04-01-2012, 08:57 PM
  #62
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Originally Posted by CREW99AW View Post
He's 19,not early to mid 20s.

I've seen what a full yr in the AHL has done for De Haan and Ness.Both were very poised during brief call ups this season.

I expect Nino,Nelson and Kabanov to be logging a lot of time on the Sound Tigers top line next season.
thats nice, but when you expect and what wang and snow will do.

if your management had half a brain Nino would have been in Portland playing on a dominant team and fighting for a memorial cup, instead he is floundering at the NHL level just so they can have his cap hit at the NHL level.

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04-01-2012, 08:59 PM
  #63
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Originally Posted by Medium Rare View Post
thats nice, but when you expect and what wang and snow will do.

if your management had half a brain Nino would have been in Portland playing on a dominant team and fighting for a memorial cup, instead he is floundering at the NHL level just so they can have his cap hit at the NHL level.
Can we please stop taking shots at other franchises.

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04-01-2012, 09:22 PM
  #64
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Can we please stop taking shots at other franchises.
i'm just telling the truth. the kid wasn't NHL ready and he was rushed so they could have a cap hit 3x higher than his salary

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04-01-2012, 09:25 PM
  #65
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i'm just telling the truth. the kid wasn't NHL ready and he was rushed so they could have a cap hit 3x higher than his salary
I agree he was rushed but you called the Islanders a circus, there is no need to insult another franchise.

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04-01-2012, 09:36 PM
  #66
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It's not like he dominated in his last junior year either

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Old
04-01-2012, 10:33 PM
  #67
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Originally Posted by Medium Rare View Post
thats nice, but when you expect and what wang and snow will do.

if your management had half a brain Nino would have been in Portland playing on a dominant team and fighting for a memorial cup, instead he is floundering at the NHL level just so they can have his cap hit at the NHL level.
Isles used the excuse that at 19,Nino was too young to be sent to Bridgeport.He turns 20 in Sept.


A few different reports say the isles will push hard to bring 23 yr old Petrov over from the KHL.His development is ahead of Nino's and I expect they want him to take Nino's spot on the Isles,while Nino joins Kabanov and Nelson in Bridgeport.

Regardless of what the isles plan for their prospects,they won't be in the mix for Jaybo.

1.He won't waive his NTC.
2.Snow won't deal his top youngsters for a short term deal:2 yrs of Jaybo
3.Jaybo is overpaid and the isles won't spend much more then the cap floor.They need better bang for their buck then paying Jaybo $6.6m

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04-02-2012, 01:24 AM
  #68
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Flames biggest problem is nt/nm contracts
High priced aging or overpaid talent that will be hard to move even if they waive. I would be surprised if any guys under contract are moved. Some young guys will be brought in or kept Sven Irving Jones etc . I hope the big moves happen but I really doubt it. I think with Iggy Kipper Jbow etc they will let the contracts expire year by year and resign the ones they want at reduced rates. Really what is the market for older or underachieving players on a team that missed the play offs three straight. At the price of these guys I would be shopping elsewhere.

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04-02-2012, 01:52 AM
  #69
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I shall give it a shot.

Trades:


Nino Niederreiter
3rd


Jay Bouwmeester



Spencer Machacek
6th


Matt Stajan




6th


Anton Babchuk



These moves I'd like to see no matter what direction we decide to head. However if we go for a full blow up....



Brendan Smith
Darren Helm


Jarome Iginla



Corey Crawford
Brandon Saad


Miikka Kiprusoff
Greg Nemisz


Scott Hannan is resigned at a similar contract.
Stempniak is also resigned.
Flames Draft Griffin Reinhart (I hope he falls)


Flames next season:

Tanguay- Cammalleri - Glencross
Baertschi - Backlund - Stempniak
Horak - Helm - Comeau
Bouma - Jones - Jackman

Giordano - B. Smith
Brodie - Butler
D. Smith - Hannan


Crawford
Irving

Prospects:

Saad
Niederreiter
Reinhart X2
Gaudreau
Granlund
Byron
Ferland
Leach
Wotherspoon


Lineup eventually becomes:

Tanguay - Cammalleri - Saad
Baertschi - Backlund - Niederreiter
Horak - Helm - Glencross
Ferland - Reinhart - Jones

Giordano - Smith
Brodie - Reinhart
Butler - Hannan, Smith, UFA

Irving
Crawford

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04-02-2012, 02:21 AM
  #70
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I think you are wrong. The guy is a top 2 defenseman on any team in the league. He plays 25+ minutes a night and is extremely durable. If he is dealt for unknowns (face it a 2nd, a guy with 1 NHL game and a sophomore with 2 seasons that are polar opposites are unknown) it would have to be for a 1st+ or the Flames are just throwing him away. He is more valuable to keep than trade for a package or 2nd rate pieces
Right, a soft, turnover prone defenseman with 4 goals, a -22 rating is a hot commodity... Honestly man, think about it. He's not that valuable at 4 million. At 6.6 million he's a flat out liability. Any jackass could play 25 minutes a night and put up JBo numbers. Peca was bang on about his game.

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04-02-2012, 03:10 AM
  #71
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Right, a soft, turnover prone defenseman with 4 goals, a -22 rating is a hot commodity... Honestly man, think about it. He's not that valuable at 4 million. At 6.6 million he's a flat out liability. Any jackass could play 25 minutes a night and put up JBo numbers. Peca was bang on about his game.
If you believe Peca I have some magic beans to sell you

the only reason Peca liked to play against Bouwmeester was because Peca was a ***** who was afraid to be hit.

And just like every other fan that doesn't know spit about the game you bring up goals and +/-. You should actually understand what stats mean before you use them.

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04-02-2012, 03:11 AM
  #72
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Isles used the excuse that at 19,Nino was too young to be sent to Bridgeport.He turns 20 in Sept.


A few different reports say the isles will push hard to bring 23 yr old Petrov over from the KHL.His development is ahead of Nino's and I expect they want him to take Nino's spot on the Isles,while Nino joins Kabanov and Nelson in Bridgeport.

Regardless of what the isles plan for their prospects,they won't be in the mix for Jaybo.

1.He won't waive his NTC.
2.Snow won't deal his top youngsters for a short term deal:2 yrs of Jaybo
3.Jaybo is overpaid and the isles won't spend much more then the cap floor.They need better bang for their buck then paying Jaybo $6.6m
clearly you are missing my point I DON'T WANT TO TRADE BOUWMEESTER, LET ALONE TO THE ISLANDERS

keep your mishandled prospects and we will keep our overpaid but defensively sound top pairing shutdown defenseman.

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04-02-2012, 07:55 AM
  #73
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Originally Posted by Medium Rare View Post
clearly you are missing my point I DON'T WANT TO TRADE BOUWMEESTER, LET ALONE TO THE ISLANDERS

keep your mishandled prospects and we will keep our overpaid but defensively sound top pairing shutdown defenseman.
Clearly you missed the point that we are armchair gms and armchair scoutsur fan trade wishes have no bearing on real life transactions.The Flames and Isles ae not discussing a Jaybo trade and will not be discussing a Jaybo trade,so don't get your little panties in a twist.

Now,before I get an infraction,I'm going to check and see what's going on with my team's mishandled prospects and leave you to your overpaid defensemen.

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Old
04-02-2012, 08:49 AM
  #74
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I missed the report from a credible source,saying Snow was after Jaybo.

See you in Brooklyn after 2015.
What exactly are you implying?

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Old
04-02-2012, 08:51 AM
  #75
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Bailey's been hot as of late, I wonder what the Islanders want to do with him? What's his value?

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