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Van-CBJ: 1st overall for Schneider+

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Old
03-31-2012, 02:14 AM
  #51
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Originally Posted by Falconator View Post
If Columbus "WANTS" a top notch goaltender like Schneider, it'll simply be him and the Canucks 1st. Vancouver doesn't need the first overall pick, what they need is to build depth for the future. If Tampa Bay offers a 1st and a 2nd, same as Colorado paid for Varlomov, Gillis would be much better off accepting that!

The 8th overall and an early 2nd rounder would give the Canucks three picks in the top forty selections, thats what they need. Gillis was offered, allegedly, the 11th overall last year and turned it down. I don't see him being any different this year at all now that Schneider is much more established! People who say he's unproven are out to lunch, NHL people are saying he's got nothing left to prove to anyone. Schneider continually impresses with each game and he's played four less games than Brian Elliot who's getting consideration for the Vezina. (although Quick or Lundqvist will win) They are 1-2 in save %, Elliot and Schneider.

FYI - Tampa has two first round picks and FOUR second round picks, they are and will make an offer for Schneider that Columbus won't be able to match.
Tampa can also take Vasilevski or Subban or possibly even both. I don't see why they trade for Schneider. They need youth on D and getting Trouba, Ceci or Reinhart can really help them. No reason to trade for Schneider especially with some serviceable goaltenders hitting the market. Wiht guys like Gustavsson, Harding, Montoya, Emery, Vokoun, Hedberg and Turco all going to free agency (most likely) they can get a stopgap option and wait for Tokarski or Vasilevski/Subban. Getting a potential top pairing guy to play alongside Hedman for his career, then selecting one of the two in the later rounds would benefit Tampa more then getting an unproven goaltender.

Ohlund is gassed, Brewer is alright, MA Bergeron is decent last time I watched him, Aulie and Lee could be mainstays, but its still a big problem back there. Get the 2-3 option with Trouba/Rielly/Reinhart/Ceci and then suddnely that group looks a lot better. Or trade for Schneider and still have an abysmal defense. The better option for Tampa is going for quantity.

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03-31-2012, 02:22 AM
  #52
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Originally Posted by Edgeworth View Post
Tampa can also take Vasilevski or Subban or possibly even both. I don't see why they trade for Schneider. They need youth on D and getting Trouba, Ceci or Reinhart can really help them. No reason to trade for Schneider especially with some serviceable goaltenders hitting the market. Wiht guys like Gustavsson, Harding, Montoya, Emery, Vokoun, Hedberg and Turco all going to free agency (most likely) they can get a stopgap option and wait for Tokarski or Vasilevski/Subban. Getting a potential top pairing guy to play alongside Hedman for his career, then selecting one of the two in the later rounds would benefit Tampa more then getting an unproven goaltender.

Ohlund is gassed, Brewer is alright, MA Bergeron is decent last time I watched him, Aulie and Lee could be mainstays, but its still a big problem back there. Get the 2-3 option with Trouba/Rielly/Reinhart/Ceci and then suddnely that group looks a lot better. Or trade for Schneider and still have an abysmal defense. The better option for Tampa is going for quantity.
the problem with taking a goalie in this years draft is that u have to wait 4-5 years for them to develop and even then its a crap shoot to whether they turn out or not. should use those assets to trade for a NHL ready goalie while marty st louis is still a top tier talent. by the time subban is ready marty will be retired

schneider can help u win now and in the future

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03-31-2012, 02:25 AM
  #53
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Originally Posted by Edgeworth View Post
Schneider doesn't get you the #1 pick.

It'd have to be: Schneider + 1st + Top four defensive shutdown guy + 1st next year + 2nd this year and even then I seriously doubt CBJ takes it.

They don't need points from the blueline, they already have Wiz and JJ.


And seriously Schneider has yet to play an entire NHL season as a starter. He just looks good, but then again look at Reimer LAST year. Toronto fans were hailing him as a starting goaltender and the next CuJo. All Schneider has is some pretty stats from 25GP behind one of the best teams in the league. He can stay in Vancouver because no one is taking Vancouver's asking price.
Schneider is highly regarded and scouts and NHL insiders are VERY high on him as a proven #1 guy and teams have him on the top of their list, Canucks have had significant offers already for him. Canucks don't have a shut down guy but the best offer we can do is this


Schneider, Raymond, Schroeder, Sauve, 2012 1st for CBJ 1st and Jenner

that's a heavy price there are 3 1st rounders and a 2nd there and Schneider is an elite skilled proven player at the NHL level, something that pick hasn't done yet. I'm not sure I really want to do that deal we're giving up our best young player(Schneider) who has an elite skill set and our best prospect(Schroeder) who is ready for the NHL, Sauve played well in the NHL last year when he was called up. We can't afford to lose Schroeder after trading Hodgson he's our only skilled centre so we'll need a guy like Jenner coming back if Schroeder is going there or drop Schroeder and Jenner and put in Rodin.

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03-31-2012, 02:27 AM
  #54
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Edgeworth View Post
Tampa can also take Vasilevski or Subban or possibly even both. I don't see why they trade for Schneider. They need youth on D and getting Trouba, Ceci or Reinhart can really help them. No reason to trade for Schneider especially with some serviceable goaltenders hitting the market. Wiht guys like Gustavsson, Harding, Montoya, Emery, Vokoun, Hedberg and Turco all going to free agency (most likely) they can get a stopgap option and wait for Tokarski or Vasilevski/Subban. Getting a potential top pairing guy to play alongside Hedman for his career, then selecting one of the two in the later rounds would benefit Tampa more then getting an unproven goaltender.

Ohlund is gassed, Brewer is alright, MA Bergeron is decent last time I watched him, Aulie and Lee could be mainstays, but its still a big problem back there. Get the 2-3 option with Trouba/Rielly/Reinhart/Ceci and then suddnely that group looks a lot better. Or trade for Schneider and still have an abysmal defense. The better option for Tampa is going for quantity.
Tampa Bay is the second oldest team in the NHL, they have a need to win now. Yes they are thin on defense, but they've struggled with goaltending since Khabibulin left. The guys you mentioned are no better than what they had this year, and that didn't work so well for them did it! It's no secret they are going to take a run at Schneider.

But hopefully they take Luongo!

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03-31-2012, 02:30 AM
  #55
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Originally Posted by Falconator View Post
Tampa Bay is the second oldest team in the NHL, they have a need to win now. Yes they are thin on defense, but they've struggled with goaltending since Khabibulin left. The guys you mentioned are no better than what they had this year, and that didn't work so well for them did it! It's no secret they are going to take a run at Schneider.

But hopefully they take Luongo!
I like how he adds in the Monster in the goalie list, the Leafs sure could use him oh wait

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03-31-2012, 03:05 AM
  #56
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God, this is going to be a terrible off season. I'm loving all of these awful proposals for the #1 pick. Seriously a untested goalie and a 25-30 pick for the #1 overall? There are only maybe 2 goalies in the entire league I'd consider trading the #1 for and Schneider isn't even close to one of them.
Isnt the #1 an untested player as well? and those 2 goalies would command more than the 1st overall pick because he's unproven.

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03-31-2012, 03:07 AM
  #57
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Schnider, Booth and Ballard.

Yakupov with the Sedins or Kesler would be so damn sick that there's no way Vancouver could turn it down.

Columbus, on the other hand will see a significant improvement with Ballard in their top 4, Booth in their top 6 and a damn good starting goalie.

Vancouver fans might say they're giving up too much, but this gives them the cap space they need to sign Weber and still have more than enough cap space to sign another top 6 forward. Heck, with how much the cap is going up, they could probably sign both Parise and Sutter in the off season if they wanted.
Problem with ALL of that is that Weber is a RFA and I doubt that the 2 Americans mentioned sign in a Canadian city.

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03-31-2012, 04:03 AM
  #58
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Originally Posted by Lonny Bohonos View Post
I like how Schneider is "unproven" but the pick is somehow "proven".

Lol

For all we know the pick could be Stefan/daigle/svitov/brendl/faloon.

At worst where ever he ends up playing Schneider is an unbelievable "back up" who can play 1/2 the games with another decent tender.
A top 2 pick is pretty much guaranteed to be a good player these days. Since 2001, the weakest top 2 pick so far has probably been Van Riemsdyk, and he's already a decent player with upside.

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03-31-2012, 04:05 AM
  #59
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A top 2 pick is pretty much guaranteed to be a good player these days. Since 2001, the weakest top 2 pick so far has probably been Van Riemsdyk, and he's already a decent player with upside.
Well people who matter like NHL scouts and GMs of NHL teams are sold on Schneider as a #1 guy now.

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03-31-2012, 04:14 AM
  #60
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schneider for hedman is what will most likely happen

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03-31-2012, 04:16 AM
  #61
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schneider for hedman is what will most likely happen
No it want, TBL can't afford to give that up.

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03-31-2012, 04:29 AM
  #62
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Lol at nucks fans thinking they can get the first overall from columbus in a deal centered around schneider.KEEP DREAMING PEOPLE! It would take schneider + significant piece(s) going back the other way for columbus to even listen... And these significant pieces are those that many will not be willing to part with or simply do not possess. Adding that schneider is still largely unproven, has only played a handful of games at the NHL level, has only played for one team and is a backup behind one of the best teams in the league...the thought of this proposal becomes even more laughable
/thread

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03-31-2012, 04:36 AM
  #63
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Originally Posted by stavs View Post
Lol at nucks fans thinking they can get the first overall from columbus in a deal centered around schneider.KEEP DREAMING PEOPLE! It would take schneider + significant piece(s) going back the other way for columbus to even listen... And these significant pieces are those that many will not be willing to part with or simply do not possess. Adding that schneider is still largely unproven, has only played a handful of games at the NHL level, has only played for one team and is a backup behind one of the best teams in the league...the thought of this proposal becomes even more laughable
/thread
is it more laughable than Leaf fans telling the world how awesome they are and will make the playoffs?

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03-31-2012, 04:52 AM
  #64
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Originally Posted by stavs View Post
Lol at nucks fans thinking they can get the first overall from columbus in a deal centered around schneider.KEEP DREAMING PEOPLE! It would take schneider + significant piece(s) going back the other way for columbus to even listen... And these significant pieces are those that many will not be willing to part with or simply do not possess. Adding that schneider is still largely unproven, has only played a handful of games at the NHL level, has only played for one team and is a backup behind one of the best teams in the league...the thought of this proposal becomes even more laughable
/thread
If only we had Kadri and Gardiner, we'd be set to land a franchise player. Nothing like a bust and a overrated Dman to shop.

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03-31-2012, 05:14 AM
  #65
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Originally Posted by Zarpan View Post
A top 2 pick is pretty much guaranteed to be a good player these days. Since 2001, the weakest top 2 pick so far has probably been Van Riemsdyk, and he's already a decent player with upside.
I'm well aware of the odds. Chances are a guy like Yakupov will be a star. In fact there is a website I've come across that highlights the percentage chance of player picked in the top three picks being in the NHL and the chance they are a "star". It also highlights the chances for the rest of the first round and later rounds.

There is always the chance that a guy like Yakupov doesn't translate his game to the NHL level plus with Russians they have the KHL as a serious option which further increases the risk.

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03-31-2012, 06:01 AM
  #66
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Originally Posted by stavs View Post
Lol at nucks fans thinking they can get the first overall from columbus in a deal centered around schneider.KEEP DREAMING PEOPLE! It would take schneider + significant piece(s) going back the other way for columbus to even listen... And these significant pieces are those that many will not be willing to part with or simply do not possess. Adding that schneider is still largely unproven, has only played a handful of games at the NHL level, has only played for one team and is a backup behind one of the best teams in the league...the thought of this proposal becomes even more laughable
/thread
The Canucks don't want the first overall pick, the assumption here is that the Columbus GM wants Schneider and is willing to use the first overall pick to aquire him. Pipe dream, won't happen!

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03-31-2012, 06:52 AM
  #67
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What about Moore and Mason/second round pick for Schneider?

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03-31-2012, 07:00 AM
  #68
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Originally Posted by BLAME CANADA View Post
Jackets are the ones in need of Schneder and don't have a lot that is attractive to us for Schneider.
There are a lot of goalies that could make Columbus better. Some of them will be available for nothing via free agency. Some of them will be available via trade at a lesser price than #1 overall.

There's only 1 #1 overall pick.

Law of supply and demand. Since there will be more goalies on the market and only 1 #1 overall pick, the value of the pick is greater.

Canucks fans are insane if they think they are getting #1 overall for Schneider.

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03-31-2012, 07:59 AM
  #69
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To Vancouver: 1st or 2nd overall

To Columbus: Cory Schneider + 2012 1st/prospect


Schneider stats
W:18
L:7
Sv% .937 (2nd in the league)
GAA:1.97 (5th in the league)

Howson has said his top priority this off-season is goaltending. Seems like a good fit.

edit: what else would van need to add?
What is it with all the low ball offers for the Jackets 1st?
Try Kesler and the Jackets get interrested. You don't get a potentiol star for a backup goalie and the 25 pick in a draft.

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03-31-2012, 08:06 AM
  #70
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Isnt the #1 an untested player as well? and those 2 goalies would command more than the 1st overall pick because he's unproven.
a 1st round pick are often used as trade currency.

It have been tested over, over and over that a first round pick can bring you a proven player in a trade.


Last edited by palindrom: 03-31-2012 at 08:12 AM.
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03-31-2012, 08:16 AM
  #71
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Originally Posted by BLAME CANADA View Post
Schneider is highly regarded and scouts and NHL insiders are VERY high on him as a proven #1 guy and teams have him on the top of their list, Canucks have had significant offers already for him. Canucks don't have a shut down guy but the best offer we can do is this


Schneider, Raymond, Schroeder, Sauve, 2012 1st for CBJ 1st and Jenner

that's a heavy price there are 3 1st rounders and a 2nd there and Schneider is an elite skilled proven player at the NHL level, something that pick hasn't done yet. I'm not sure I really want to do that deal we're giving up our best young player(Schneider) who has an elite skill set and our best prospect(Schroeder) who is ready for the NHL, Sauve played well in the NHL last year when he was called up. We can't afford to lose Schroeder after trading Hodgson he's our only skilled centre so we'll need a guy like Jenner coming back if Schroeder is going there or drop Schroeder and Jenner and put in Rodin.
Why do Raymond, Schroeder, Sauve, or a pick in the 25 range have value to Columbus in this deal? We're losing a potential franchise player. I like Schneider, but I fondly remember a few years ago when Vesa Toskala, also a proven backup who had played his way to "starter on another team" status, was being shopped. He garnered a first rounder which ended up being Logan Couture. Goalies don't have the right value in comparison to the #1 pick. Anyone with a brain would rather take their chances in FA or via trade.

And just slipping in Jenner there, that was clever. Wouldn't trade Jenner for any of Raymond, Schroeder, Sauve or that pick.

Also, no, it's not three first rounders. Raymond and Schroeder wouldn't get you first round picks, so don't appraise their value as such.

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03-31-2012, 08:25 AM
  #72
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Originally Posted by Falconator View Post
The Canucks don't want the first overall pick, the assumption here is that the Columbus GM wants Schneider and is willing to use the first overall pick to aquire him. Pipe dream, won't happen!
Schneider becomes a UFA in one year. Columbus is rebuilding. It's a poor fit. Columbus isn't exactly a free agent hot spot either right now, so I don't see Schneider signing long term there.

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03-31-2012, 08:25 AM
  #73
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I love how people keep calling him a back up. This kid will be a star in the league for many years to come.

I guess not many people have watched him play. Hence all the comparisons to Reimer and Dubnyk. Those guys wish they had his athleticism and poise.

If traded to a poor team, Schnieder would do much better than Luongo would that much is certain. Cory is better on breakaways and superb on 2 on 1's. Whereas Luongo is outstanding if he has a good defence infront of him allowing him to save the first shot. ( notice how all "elite" goalies play behind stifling defences). Not that Schnieder can't do that as well.

His only flaw right now is playing the puck. Not that he doesn't have control but his decision making is really poor, way too risky.

And to clarify, I don't think Van can trade Cory + for the 1st overall pick. If they still had Hodgson they could have traded Cory, Hodgson and a 1st....but that option is no longer available.

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03-31-2012, 08:29 AM
  #74
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Lol wow I'd love to see what kind of return Vancouver actually gets for Schneider, if hes the one they actually end up trading (cough...Luongo to Toronto)

A 1a/b starter playing some sheltered games is not the centerpiece for a #1 overall pick.

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03-31-2012, 08:29 AM
  #75
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I love how people keep calling him a back up. This kid will be a star in the league for many years to come.
It doesn't change the fact that he is a backup.

What is your definition of a backup?

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