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04-04-2012, 12:25 PM
  #26
Christ
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Stephen View Post
Orr is okay but not really that important to get worked up over.
Pretty much my feelings towards the guy as well. He is a fighter and a darn good one but that is about it. Aside from fighting, he has next to no impact on the ice and at the time he was sent down he rarely played and when he did, he almost never fought. I would not get my shorts in a knot over him.

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04-04-2012, 12:28 PM
  #27
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Originally Posted by Leafsman View Post
I am sorry to add 2 threads in one day but have noticed a very disturbing and troubling trend lately.



It is no secret that Burke has had a few very smelly signings that plague the cap to this day.


I am starting to see the signing of Colton Orr as a criticism for Burke and a point used by those anti-Burke campaigners. Even in articles the point has been made.


For what Orr was paid he fulfilled his duties game in and game out. He was a soldier out there every time he played. He was never the best player on the ice but he was always one of the best people on the ice.

He did exactly what we wanted him to here in Toronto and I think it is selfish and disrespectful to use him because your upset with Burke or the team.

There are enough contracts and thinsg to criticize Burke for without dishonouring a great guy and a great Leaf!
So Burke/Leafs should have kept him then?

If so you are criticizing Burke about Orr.

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04-04-2012, 12:30 PM
  #28
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Originally Posted by Leafsman View Post
No but if he plays admirably in 133 games and performs well for what is expected of him I will!

So quick to forget the past? Not - what have you done? But what have you done for me lately?
How dare he forget about Orr's nine points in three seasons.

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04-04-2012, 12:30 PM
  #29
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Originally Posted by Hawaiinleaf View Post
The coach Wilson felt a softy cream puff speedy tiny team of collective zero heart was the way to go..

If your going to ice a soft team you need Orr end of story and were the softest team in the NHL nad the smallest line up of forwards as well

So exactly given our current great record why was it a good idea to not play Orr???

I suggest ice capades or ladies hockey for you fready cats..
ya we should totally replace our roster with big tough rugby players!!!1!

hrraaaarrrggghhh *crushes beer can on forehead*

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Old
04-04-2012, 12:32 PM
  #30
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Originally Posted by Mess View Post
Colton Orr makes $1 million dollars a year salary and he dressed and played in 5 NHL games for the Leafs this entire season.

That's $200k per game to play ATOI of 4:29 per game.

Now he is getting paid his $$ to not play in the NHL, while a Marlie replacement Rosehill fills his roster spot. NO NHL team claimed him when on waivers when they could have had him for free. Thus all 30 NHL teams saw no need for his limited skillset.

How is this not a bad signing?
It was a signing that didn't really have a positive or negative effect. Don't see how it can be termed bad, only cost money and didn't prevent the Team from any other moves.

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04-04-2012, 12:35 PM
  #31
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Leafsman View Post
No but if he plays admirably in 133 games and performs well for what is expected of him I will!

So quick to forget the past? Not - what have you done? But what have you done for me lately?
So are saying that you're expecting Orr to be back doing his thing with the big club next year and will be an integral part of Leafs playoff drive?

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04-04-2012, 12:43 PM
  #32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ACC1224 View Post
It was a signing that didn't really have a positive or negative effect. Don't see how it can be termed bad, only cost money and didn't prevent the Team from any other moves.
So the same criteria and effect that the Jeff Finger signing had, only money and didn't prevent the team from any other moves?

By your definition any UFA signing that can be shipped to the AHL is considered neither positive nor negative, as long as it can be swept under the rug and magically disappear.

Ownership that still have to flip the bill for their guaranteed contracts, while no longer playing for the team, probably would disagree with your definition that the signing was irrelevant.

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04-04-2012, 12:45 PM
  #33
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You cant fill a team with small non physical players period

Orr is not a great hockey player agreed..

But our team is spineless....because it was filled with small non physical players that other teams beat up on the boards and intimidate...

We need big players with heart and grit, until we have a lineup like that there is a place for an Orr to tip the scales..

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04-04-2012, 12:50 PM
  #34
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hawaiinleaf View Post
You cant fill a team with small non physical players period

Orr is not a great hockey player agreed..

But our team is spineless....because it was filled with small non physical players that other teams beat up on the boards and intimidate...

We need big players with heart and grit, until we have a lineup like that there is a place for an Orr to tip the scales..
I don't think you fill a team with big, slow, uncoordinated goons like Colton Orr either, though. A 12 man forward corps is just too few to give up a roster spot to someone like him, in today's NHL.

I wouldn't call the signing itself an outright mistake; he makes $1 million which represents a small drop in the bucket in terms of capspace (2%).

I'd say the real damage done by his signing was playing him in all those games last year and the year prior when there were way better options available for the fourth line.

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Old
04-04-2012, 12:51 PM
  #35
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mess View Post
So the same criteria and effect that the Jeff Finger signing had, only money and didn't prevent the team from any other moves?

By your definition any UFA signing that can be shipped to the AHL is considered neither positive nor negative, as long as it can be swept under the rug and magically disappear.

Ownership that still have to flip the bill for their guaranteed contracts, while no longer playing for the team, probably would disagree with your definition that the signing was irrelevant.
Orr was pretty much market value for that type of Player while Fingers value was determined by a crazy old man. Fingers contract could have an affect is used as a comparble by Agents.

I have no idea what Ownership thinks nor do you.

Pro tip - every Team has signings that don't work out.

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04-04-2012, 12:53 PM
  #36
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hawaiinleaf View Post
You cant fill a team with small non physical players period

Orr is not a great hockey player agreed..

But our team is spineless....because it was filled with small non physical players that other teams beat up on the boards and intimidate...

We need big players with heart and grit, until we have a lineup like that there is a place for an Orr to tip the scales..
Replace "heart and grit" with talent. Orr doesn't provide anything except five minutes of ice-time and some staged fights. He doesn't "tip the scales" (whatever that means) because he's nowhere near the ****ing scale. He's not Lucic--he's not even 35-year-old Shawn Thornton.

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04-04-2012, 12:58 PM
  #37
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He played 5 games this year, it's pretty melodramatic to say we were a playoff team with him, and collapsed when he demoted.

He was demoted because he was no longer of any use to this team. Plain and simple.

There is nothing Orr does that Rosehill doesn't do. And Most of it better.

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04-04-2012, 12:59 PM
  #38
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Originally Posted by Sypher04 View Post
He played 5 games this year, it's pretty melodramatic to say we were a playoff team with him, and collapsed when he demoted.
It's also a flat out lie that contradicts the chronology of events.

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04-04-2012, 01:02 PM
  #39
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hawaiinleaf View Post
You cant fill a team with small non physical players period

Orr is not a great hockey player agreed..

But our team is spineless....because it was filled with small non physical players that other teams beat up on the boards and intimidate...

We need big players with heart and grit, until we have a lineup like that there is a place for an Orr to tip the scales..
Two wrongs don't make a right !!!

Just because the GM assembled a small, soft, easily intimidated team, that gets embarrassed many nights doesn't mean you need a skill-less goon like Orr to compensate for its shortcomings.

A player getting 5 shifts and playing 4 minutes a game does not make you a better hockey team by throwing punches. Orr tossed haymakers a couple year back in a limited role and the Leafs finished 29th overall in the standings.

Perhaps start moving out some of these butter soft players, for bigger, stronger, more physically imposing ones that aren't so easily pushed around, might be a better place to start addressing the real issue in question here.

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Old
04-04-2012, 01:04 PM
  #40
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Quote:
Originally Posted by diceman934 View Post
So Burke/Leafs should have kept him then?

If so you are criticizing Burke about Orr.
I personally feel he should've been kept but understand why he wasn't and why others feel that way. I hold Wilson responsoble for it but understand the reason for it even if I don't agree.

Quote:
Originally Posted by dirk41 View Post
How dare he forget about Orr's nine points in three seasons.
Yes because Orr was brought here to put points on the board!! Orr was brought here to play the enforcer role which he did and did it as good as or better than anyone in the league.

Why does every person have to be a 40 goal scorer to get respect. There are other roles required and Orr filled one. HE did it well and because he didn;t score you now turn on him!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mess View Post
So are saying that you're expecting Orr to be back doing his thing with the big club next year and will be an integral part of Leafs playoff drive?
I'd like him to be but don't exepct it! I believe he could be a partof the playoff drive, not the playoffs! His presence on the ice may persuade a few opponents to not take a cheap shot at Kessel or save Phanuef from having to do a fight.

HE's not going to ever play an integral or major part but I feel he is a good presence to have next year and maybe another year while we roll some younger players in.



As for the 133 games, that was the amount of games he has played for the Leafs where he was asked and paid to do one of the toughest dirtiest jobs in hockey and he did it evrey night. He played with as much character as anyone in hockey.

Wether he plays again or not is irrelevant! What he has brought to this team in his time here to date has been deserving of our praise not a scapegoat for your frustrations!

He may never be a part of our playoff drive in teh future but he sure as hell wasn't a part in missing the playoffs to date!

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Old
04-04-2012, 01:09 PM
  #41
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Originally Posted by Leafsman View Post
He may never be a part of our playoff drive in teh future but he sure as hell wasn't a part in missing the playoffs to date!
Agreed. He wasn't even good enough to be part of missing the playoffs.

It's pretty telling IMO that when Carlyle took over his first move was to recall Jay Rosehill. NOT Colton Orr.

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Old
04-04-2012, 01:12 PM
  #42
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Has Orr played for the Marlies?

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Old
04-04-2012, 01:15 PM
  #43
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Originally Posted by Sypher04 View Post
Agreed. He wasn't even good enough to be part of missing the playoffs.

It's pretty telling IMO that when Carlyle took over his first move was to recall Jay Rosehill. NOT Colton Orr.
Maybe cause he'd have to clear re-entry waivers?????? Maybe someone woudl grab him!

How could he have fulfilled his role better then??

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04-04-2012, 01:20 PM
  #44
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Originally Posted by Leafsman View Post
Yes because Orr was brought here to put points on the board!! Orr was brought here to play the enforcer role which he did and did it as good as or better than anyone in the league.

Why does every person have to be a 40 goal scorer to get respect. There are other roles required and Orr filled one. HE did it well and because he didn;t score you now turn on him!
A position players only has two jobs: create goals and prevent goals. Orr doesn't do either.

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Old
04-04-2012, 01:27 PM
  #45
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Originally Posted by dirk41 View Post
A position players only has two jobs: create goals and prevent goals. Orr doesn't do either.
Well, who knew hockey was so easy!!

There's far more complexities than that! Dumbed down to it's simplest form yes that's true.

If Orr's presence allows players to play a little harder does that not create goals occasionally or prevent goals. If another team is taking liberties with Kessel and Orr prevents them from taking it to far and injuring Kessel does that not create goals.

Not every player has to create the goals themself, they have to contribute to the overall play of the team so that members of that team can score goals.

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04-04-2012, 01:41 PM
  #46
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Originally Posted by Tapcondition View Post
Is this thread and all the replies in it some kind of time-delayed april fools joke?
this!

i'm soooo tired of leaf nation falling in love with 'grinders' ...orr, crabb, shane corson!, darcy tucker (yeah i went there!), mike peca, etc (i'll stop there, there's so many). all heavily overated by leaf nation.

yes i'm aware that tucker was a 20+ goal scorer and one of the most beloved leafs of our generation...he was still supremely overrated here.

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04-04-2012, 01:42 PM
  #47
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Originally Posted by Leafsman View Post
Maybe cause he'd have to clear re-entry waivers?????? Maybe someone woudl grab him!
What a shame that would've been.

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Originally Posted by Leafsman View Post
How could he have fulfilled his role better then??
Rosehill fights pretty damn well, but is a little less useless as a hockey player.

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04-04-2012, 01:44 PM
  #48
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> Poster defends Orr contract based on performance in previous seasons of the contract (citing reasons).
> Other posters malign original poster for this stance based on Orr's "performance" this season.

Played out pretty much as expected.

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Old
04-04-2012, 01:46 PM
  #49
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Originally Posted by Sypher04 View Post
What a shame that would've been.



Rosehill fights pretty damn well, but is a little less useless as a hockey player.
What does that have to do with teh 133 games Orr played for this team?? Rosehill is a great character guy and a very good replacement for Orr.

What does that have to do with what Orr did here in the past??

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04-04-2012, 01:49 PM
  #50
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Originally Posted by SHoot85 View Post
this!

i'm soooo tired of leaf nation falling in love with 'grinders' ...orr, crabb, shane corson!, darcy tucker (yeah i went there!), mike peca, etc (i'll stop there, there's so many). all heavily overated by leaf nation.

yes i'm aware that tucker was a 20+ goal scorer and one of the most beloved leafs of our generation...he was still supremely overrated here.
Who the hell are you to tell Leafs fans who they should like on their team??? I'm gonna cheer for whoever I want and in no way give the slightest **** of who you think I shoudl or shoudl not cheer for!


These "grinders" are a big part of hockey and have played major roles in Stanley Cup championship teams.

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