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11-26-2004, 02:58 PM
  #1
UltimoRoger
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Hab's top six situation

Hey guys,

I just wanted to get a feel of what you guys think the Habs top six forwards will look like. I know there are the obvious ones - Koivu, Zednik, Ryder, Ribeiro and possibly Bonk. But beyond that, who fills in the holes if Kovalev doesn't return? Is Dagenais a legitamite top six forward? Are Perreault's chances finished, and where does he fit in now?

Thanks in advance.

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11-26-2004, 03:00 PM
  #2
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Quote:
Originally Posted by UltimoRoger
Hey guys,

I just wanted to get a feel of what you guys think the Habs top six forwards will look like. I know there are the obvious ones - Koivu, Zednik, Ryder, Ribeiro and possibly Bonk. But beyond that, who fills in the holes if Kovalev doesn't return? Is Dagenais a legitamite top six forward? Are Perreault's chances finished, and where does he fit in now?

Thanks in advance.
Koivu, Zednik, Ryder and Ribeiro are surely part of our top 6. For now, we can fill the holes with Dagenais and Bulis. Say what you want, but Dagenais is useful to put the puck in the back of the net. In a near future, Perezhogin, Kostitsyn, Higgins and Plekane could become "top 6 forwards".

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11-26-2004, 03:27 PM
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Joey
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Bulis can fill the occasional 1st line role. And I agree that Dagenais has a nose for the net at times, maybe because he shoots 15 times for every 1 pass. Also, if Marcel Hossa can play with the fire he's been showing overseas [although I think it's died down in the last few games] he can surely make a stab for the 2nd line. Bonk is also a left-wing, so I think there will be experiments with him on the first line in the first 25 games of the season. In my opinion Yanic Perreault is done with Montreal, although I really like him. In two years from now, I think Kostitsyn or Perezhogin will man the first line with Koivu. Maybe both if Zednik doesn't last more than 3 years, which I don't think he will. And I also agree that Ryder, Zednik, Koivu, and Ribeiro are dead locks for the top 6 positions.

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11-26-2004, 04:08 PM
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Obviously Ryder, Zedder, Ribs and Saks are in.

For the other two spots, I see perez probably taking a spot. Whether he'll hold it or not is up in the air, but I bet he gets a good long look for it. If the team is still looking to sign Kovalev or a different UFA, that would be the other spot. If not, I expect Hossa and Dagenais to split the majority of the time, with Higgins and Bonk maybe getting a look too. Bonk less likely than Higgins IMO.

I expect Kostitsyn to start next year in the AHL, and be there for at least half a season.

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11-26-2004, 04:53 PM
  #5
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What I think we'll see

Bulis-Koivu-Zednik
Dagenais-Ribeiro-Ryder
Bonk


Thats the way I see it, Gainey has said multiple times Bonk is playing 3rd line center so I dont see why we should think about him as a LW. He's better at center now anyways. I like Bulis but he doesent have the scoring for the 1st line. Ilike that second line though, if Dags could hit that is. IMO Dags could be a hell of a player, he just needs to find a mean streak and maybe speed up to slightly above average.



What i'd like to see in the habs line-up

Hossa(Ward)-Koivu-Zednik
Dags-Ribs-Ryder
Bulis-Bonk-Ward
Sundstrom-Bégin-Ivanans (probably a free agent or waiver guy though)

Problems:
1. Hossa may not produce immediately on 1st line. (media goes nuts etc)
2. Dags and Ribeiro on a line, I love it on offense but on D? ewww. Either way I like this line, if Dags could hit once in a while i'd love this line.
3. If Hossa doesent work hard enough, i'd like for Ward to get another chance on the top line.
4. With Ivanans in MTL we'd need to call up Kostitsyn (I might call Kost up anyways if Hossa/Ward dont work out)

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11-26-2004, 04:56 PM
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Plekanek will be the only prospect graduating for sure. Add Hossa and you have two young wingers that should be able to at least split time on the second line.

As for Kovalev, I really expect him to come back for now (if he really wants to come back to montreal as he said before de lock-out).

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11-26-2004, 04:58 PM
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I think throwing Pleks onto the second line is a little crasy. I'd much rather have Bulis or even Dags at that position. He's a good player but jumping right into a 2nd line spot from the AHL is a huge hop.

IMO he'd need to be seasoned on the 3-4line for at least 50 games.

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11-26-2004, 05:42 PM
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No way is Bulis back in a top-6 role. Bulis is a checker, and we've got lots of scorers in the system now(Zednik, Ryder, Perezhogin, Dagenais, Hossa, Higgins, possibly Kovalev/UFA), so why would we play him on a scoring line? First you've got to try the young guys, and see if any of them are ready. After that, I think Dags ought to get the nod first anyways.

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11-26-2004, 06:03 PM
  #9
Masao
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If Kovalev doesn't come back...

Zednik - Koivu - Bonk
Ryder - Ribeiro - Dagenais

I know Dagenais is... well, Dagenais, but he fitted well with Ribeiro and Ryder last year I think

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11-26-2004, 06:05 PM
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Why talking about a top 6 when you will have 3 lines that can produce offensively with regularity?

Higgins, Perezhogin, Plekanec and Hossa should all have a solid chance to make the team... I would be highly surprised if ever Dagenais can make a spot for himself considering the high quality of the rookies I just named.

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11-26-2004, 07:21 PM
  #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bileur
I think throwing Pleks onto the second line is a little crasy. I'd much rather have Bulis or even Dags at that position. He's a good player but jumping right into a 2nd line spot from the AHL is a huge hop.

IMO he'd need to be seasoned on the 3-4line for at least 50 games.
He don't jump from the AHL, he jump from a europeen league that is better than the AHL (for this year) with all the NHL player in there league.

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11-26-2004, 07:23 PM
  #12
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I'm sure that Ward could be a good 2nd line winger.

Zednik - Koivu - Kovalev (Let's hope)
Ryder - Ribeiro - Ward
Bulis - Bonk - Hossa
Sundstorm - Begin - Perez

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11-26-2004, 11:56 PM
  #13
Habs4Life
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Taupy
I'm sure that Ward could be a good 2nd line winger.

Zednik - Koivu - Kovalev (Let's hope)
Ryder - Ribeiro - Ward
Bulis - Bonk - Hossa
Sundstorm - Begin - Perez
I like this lineup!

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11-27-2004, 01:04 AM
  #14
Squeaky
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You're all selling Perezhogin too short. He's our most NHL ready prospect (in my opinion, obviously) and especially when you're talking about a scoring line.

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11-27-2004, 03:32 AM
  #15
Bileur
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Squeaky
No way is Bulis back in a top-6 role. Bulis is a checker, and we've got lots of scorers in the system now(Zednik, Ryder, Perezhogin, Dagenais, Hossa, Higgins, possibly Kovalev/UFA)
I made 2 lists, the first is the one I think will probably happen the second is the one that i'd rather see (as a tryout for 10-15 games for example). I just dont think its likely that the second one sticks. Of course Kovalev/UFA is also fun/good to add in but the fact is that Kovalev or another top 6 UFA havent been signed so I dont see any logic to add them into potential line-ups, especially since the only FA montreal seems to get are lower line guys. I put in a possible FA at 4 line RW but I also put Ivanans as the first possiblity, so until we get someone else i'll think he's more likely. Hope for the best, prepare for the worst.

Hossa hasnt shown much in his stints in terms of fire and consistency. I really like this guy but I think there has been a ton of pressure put on him (having people say you will be better than a proven 30 goal guy after just a few games is crasy) and maybe he's having trouble with it, I dont know but I hope he gets a full shot this year at least the third line with some offensive lee-way.

Pleks, Higgins. I really dont see how you can put any of these guys ahead of Bulis. Jan may not have the hands so hit the side of a barn with his shot but I think he can be very useful if he plays as best he can. Putting two guys who have not played 10 games combined into your top 6 ahead of him is foolish IMO. Especially if you consider that 2 players on second line many people (including me) have written in (Dags-Ribs-Ryder) are only one year off from playing in the AHL themselves. They still have some proving to do (Ribs has to prove himself too). (I think they can do it BTW) I have no problem with Pleks or Higgins going in 3rd-4th line, even getting good minutes beside Bonk or other good players, but I think they need to prove they can play in the NHL before they are handed a scoring role. Oh, and Bulis's size is also something to consider. I'd like to see young guns in the top 2 lines as much as anyone else but thats not very realistic IMO.

Perez, well I still dont know what his status will be once hockey resumes so I try to leave him out of these line-ups kind of like an unsigned free-agent.


Last edited by Bileur: 11-27-2004 at 04:20 AM.
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11-27-2004, 03:38 AM
  #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by komisakick ass
He don't jump from the AHL, he jump from a europeen league that is better than the AHL (for this year) with all the NHL player in there league.
well he's leading the bulldogs in scoring pretty nice for a guy playing in europe, thats got to be some wicked jet-lag .

http://www.theahl.com/AHLStatistics0405/hamilton.html

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11-27-2004, 12:05 PM
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Squeaky
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I don't see any reason why Perez won't be allowed to play next season. He's serving his year out of the AHL, so it looks to me like he ought to be allowed to play anywhere next year.

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11-27-2004, 01:33 PM
  #18
Bileur
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Squeaky
I don't see any reason why Perez won't be allowed to play next season. He's serving his year out of the AHL, so it looks to me like he ought to be allowed to play anywhere next year.
I'm still hoping for a late season hockey comeback.

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11-27-2004, 02:03 PM
  #19
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As of right now, its

Koivu
Ribs
Zednik
Ryder
Dags
Bulis


Get replacements for Dags (Kovalev) and Bulis and weve got our selves a solid top 6. That is if Ribs and Ryder can extend their amazing performances from last season.........

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11-27-2004, 02:09 PM
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Kirk Muller
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Squeaky
I don't see any reason why Perez won't be allowed to play next season. He's serving his year out of the AHL, so it looks to me like he ought to be allowed to play anywhere next year.
Unless the NHL is looking for a major lawsuit which they would likely be torn apart in, Perezhogin will be allowed to play in the NHL. The AHL might make a case but highly unlikely as well.

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11-27-2004, 04:40 PM
  #21
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Originally Posted by Joey
And I agree that Dagenais has a nose for the net at times, maybe because he shoots 15 times for every 1 pass. .

And there's nothing wrong with that. Dagenais knows his best asset is his shot so why not use it?

I think he's 25 or 26 years old and I remember the habs tried to get Dagenais in the souray deal but eneded up with Josh Dewolfe.

If his hockey sense improves.... would it be stupid to say that he can become a poor man's dave andreychuk?

I know thats a bit of a reach but he has the tools to do it. He's got a tremendous reach and a devasting shot.... he skates like andreychuk.

I'm talking about the offensive minded andreychuk... not the andreychuk we see today.

I dont think he will become that type of player but it is a little frustrating to watch because he could be that type of player.

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11-28-2004, 01:03 PM
  #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bileur
well he's leading the bulldogs in scoring pretty nice for a guy playing in europe, thats got to be some wicked jet-lag .

http://www.theahl.com/AHLStatistics0405/hamilton.html
Sorry, I don't know why but Iwas thinking you talk about Perez

you know he's fast

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11-28-2004, 01:31 PM
  #23
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Bonk may be the 3rd line centre, but he'll see time on both the PP and PK, so I'd have to think that'd make him a "top 6" forward in terms of icetime. Koivu, Zednik, Ribeiro, Ryder, Bonk and then a young guy like Perezhogin, Hossa or Dagenais. Higgins and Plekanec will likely be broken in a checking role.

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11-28-2004, 01:57 PM
  #24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by saskhab
Bonk may be the 3rd line centre, but he'll see time on both the PP and PK, so I'd have to think that'd make him a "top 6" forward in terms of icetime. Koivu, Zednik, Ribeiro, Ryder, Bonk and then a young guy like Perezhogin, Hossa or Dagenais. Higgins and Plekanec will likely be broken in a checking role.
Or Kovalev or another FA signing. It's not time to rule them out. Failing that, one would assume Bulis (per your Bonk example) would round out the "top 6" ahead of the young guys, on the basis of icetime?

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11-28-2004, 04:18 PM
  #25
El Wama
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Squeaky
No way is Bulis back in a top-6 role. Bulis is a checker, and we've got lots of scorers in the system now(Zednik, Ryder, Perezhogin, Dagenais, Hossa, Higgins, possibly Kovalev/UFA), so why would we play him on a scoring line? First you've got to try the young guys, and see if any of them are ready. After that, I think Dags ought to get the nod first anyways.
No Way..?? He's only 26.. Blazing speed and good puck control... But he needs to score more, like in Czech Rep, right now. I'll repeat myself : Bulis is a 20 goals 35 assists players, he can provide each year 3-4 goals in PK. Julien gave him some chances last year, he couldn't score like he's capable of...
Ryder Saku and Bulis formed the best line in December and January. I can see him play with Ribeiro and Ryder... And yes, I would see Koivu with Zednik and Dagenais.. Dagenais, if he wants to, can let some space to Zednik, more flexibily to Saku.. And Bonk: Put Hossa/Higgins/Plekanec or Perez with him, and sign an UFA LIKE... LIKE Anson Carter (Gritt, Experience, Can Score)... And we can have a good young lineup... If Not... Sign a good UFA, and put a rookie with Bonk and Bulis... But I still believe that Dagenais and Koivu could rack up some points, adding Zed to the mixt

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