Trade Rumors and Free Agent TalkTrade rumors, transactions, and free agent talk. Rumors must contain the word RUMOR in post title. Proposals must contain the word PROPOSAL in post title.
'Several people have said' that situations like this are unpredictable, however is it THAT far fetched to think that Iginla MAY want to play for a Stanley Cup before he retires? It's safe to assume he won't get that opportunity in Calgary.
When it is including Iginla himself than yes it is.
The Blues don't have the money for Iginla and they're not selling the farm for a 35 year old winger.
The Blues biggest need is scoring. Iggy can provide that in spades. Not to mention he would probably fit into the system pretty well.
If they make it past the first round, I could totally see them going after Iggy. Making it past the first round gives them revenue that won't get cut by player salaries and likely shows that they can make it to the playoffs again. A one year rental to give them a great shot at a cup would be a calculated risk.
Plus they have the assets. They won't sell Schwartz or Tarasenko so selling the farm won't be an issue. A first or other prospects shouldn't be a huge loss for them.
And salary shouldn't even be that big an issue. Trade Stewart (who isn't exactly doing much anyways) and choose only one of Arnott, Lagenbrunner to bring back (Iggy replaces the lost leadership of the one dropped anyways so that wouldn't be a huge concern) and the extra cap hit is only 1.375 million dollars. Not a huge addition at all and not nearly the cash trouble that many make it out to be.
Several people have said he would not leave the city after how well he has been treated the only way he leaves is if he is traded. It sucks that he may never win the Cup but he is loyal to a fault to the Flames.
History has shown us time and time again that all the talk leading up to situations like this is just that when it actually comes down to it. I understand what you're saying about loyalty and if there were a player who would blow their chances at ever winning a cup for a team's sake it would probably be Iggy, but as someone else pointed out, Ray Bourque was the super-Bruin and I'm certain these same talks were happening back then too.
It's not as though Jarome or anyone else in the Flames organization doesn't understand the situation that the team and that he is in. They've made all the right PR moves thus far, but it's not as though the city is going to turn their back on him for going to a contender, and I think with all Iginla hs done for the city of Calgary, he'd absolutely have all the right in the world to try somewhere else. The Bruins fans were basically the Avs' Fan Annex during the 2001 cup run, if there's no chance the Flames can make a run next year I don't think that the Flames fans would treat the situation any differently were Iggy to leave.
'Several people have said' that situations like this are unpredictable, however is it THAT far fetched to think that Iginla MAY want to play for a Stanley Cup before he retires? It's safe to assume he won't get that opportunity in Calgary.
It's not safe to say that, because Iginla will likely play into his 40s - and that's a long ways out.
Also, multiple people (Keenan, Millions) have said that Iginla does not want to leave and win a Stanley Cup elsewhere. He wants to give it his all to win one in Calgary. Much like Alfredsson and Sundin.
When dealing with a person with the character that Jarome Iginla has - you take him at his freaking word. He has even said that if the organization believes that they'd be better off trading him, he has said he will waive his NTC - but ONLY if the organization comes to him.
Iginla wants to succeed in Calgary. It's not about speculating "well geez, he may want to go elsewhere to compete for a cup". Iginla wants to play his entire career in Calgary, and Flames management wants him to play his entire career in Calgary. That is unlikely to change.
It's not safe to say that, because Iginla will likely play into his 40s - and that's a long ways out.
Also, multiple people (Keenan, Millions) have said that Iginla does not want to leave and win a Stanley Cup elsewhere. He wants to give it his all to win one in Calgary. Much like Alfredsson and Sundin.
When dealing with a person with the character that Jarome Iginla has - you take him at his freaking word. He has even said that if the organization believes that they'd be better off trading him, he has said he will waive his NTC - but ONLY if the organization comes to him.
Iginla wants to succeed in Calgary. It's not about speculating "well geez, he may want to go elsewhere to compete for a cup". Iginla wants to play his entire career in Calgary, and Flames management wants him to play his entire career in Calgary. That is unlikely to change.
It is safe to say that if ownership continues to refuse to believe that the current team has any chance at being a playoff team. This team desperately needs change and without its not going anywhere but 9th, 10th, 11th in the West.
So based on the assertion that it's the Flames' FO that would have to get the wheels moving on trade talks, is there really no point where most Flames fans would rather see him win a cup, even on a different team? I think that if Hejduk had never won a cup, being here at the fringe of retirement, and on a team that was unlikely to hit the second round before the end of his career, I'd be upset if the Avalanche offices were clutching to whatever straws the Flames' offices are. That's not even considering the difference between the Avalanche and Flames' farm systems, and the relative help each would get by trading these players away.
There IS going to be life-after-Iginla from the Flames, it's just a matter of time... you'd like to hope they won't just ride him as the face of the franchise for as long as they can and let him retire like Sundin or Alfredsson, to speak nothing of losing out on what they could get for him by moving him at the right time rather than letting his value continue to depreciate.
It's not safe to say that, because Iginla will likely play into his 40s - and that's a long ways out.
Also, multiple people (Keenan, Millions) have said that Iginla does not want to leave and win a Stanley Cup elsewhere. He wants to give it his all to win one in Calgary. Much like Alfredsson and Sundin.
When dealing with a person with the character that Jarome Iginla has - you take him at his freaking word. He has even said that if the organization believes that they'd be better off trading him, he has said he will waive his NTC - but ONLY if the organization comes to him.
Iginla wants to succeed in Calgary. It's not about speculating "well geez, he may want to go elsewhere to compete for a cup". Iginla wants to play his entire career in Calgary, and Flames management wants him to play his entire career in Calgary. That is unlikely to change.
Play well into his 40's??? You are assuming?
What does Keenan know about Iginla's true desires?
Alfredsson & Sundin , not great examples. Sundin stuck it to Toronto by not waivinh his NTC when it was clear the team needed to rebuild & had solid offers on the table. He DID end up playing in Vancouver you recall?
Alfredsson is actually playing on a playoff team, Im not following how he relates to Iginla? IF Calgary was indeed a playoff team, I would guess that Iginla would likely finish his career there. BUT it's clear to almost every hockey fan that the Calgary Flames Organization is run by nitwits. They need a rebuild in the worst way. Poor fans suffering year after year of mediocracy and heartbreak. The fans of Calgary deserve a winning tradition, and trading Jarome Iginla for picks/ prospects is the best way to start.
I never said it, but can verify it. He's stated as much multiple times. Anyone in Calgary can tell you that. He's also said, if the team ever wants to move him and go in a different direction that he would do that. So really, he's left it open to the team.
I think if Iginla to St. Louis came to fruition it would look similar to the proposal I discussed with a Blues fan about a Giordano deal, plus a 1st.
In that deal we agreed on Rattie + Cole for Giordano, I think if Iginla is substituted in for Giordano then a 1st would have to be added from the Blues side. I would also want a conditional pick base don a combination of playoff success and him re-signing.
Basically something like this
to STL
- J. Iginla
to CGY
- T. Rattie
- I. Cole
- 1st in 2012
- 1st in 2014 (if Blues reach 2013 finals or re-sign Iginla)
I am not sure the Blues would go for it, but if they balk I would rather keep Iginla
No way. I like the Rattie + Cole for Giordano deal. That seems like a win-win. But you're significantly overvaluing Iginla's value to the Blues. Let me put it this way, I think Blues fans would pay more for Giordano than Iginla. I would.
The Blues biggest need is scoring. Iggy can provide that in spades. Not to mention he would probably fit into the system pretty well.
If they make it past the first round, I could totally see them going after Iggy. Making it past the first round gives them revenue that won't get cut by player salaries and likely shows that they can make it to the playoffs again. A one year rental to give them a great shot at a cup would be a calculated risk.
Plus they have the assets. They won't sell Schwartz or Tarasenko so selling the farm won't be an issue. A first or other prospects shouldn't be a huge loss for them.
And salary shouldn't even be that big an issue. Trade Stewart (who isn't exactly doing much anyways) and choose only one of Arnott, Lagenbrunner to bring back (Iggy replaces the lost leadership of the one dropped anyways so that wouldn't be a huge concern) and the extra cap hit is only 1.375 million dollars. Not a huge addition at all and not nearly the cash trouble that many make it out to be.
The Blues biggest need was scoring this year, but mostly for health reasons. Right now, and for this coming offseason when 3 of them are free to walk as UFAs, the biggest concern is the left side of the defense.
The financial situation is tighter than you're making it out to be. The Blues have $13.675 million coming off the books in UFAs. Make that $16.55 if you toss on Stewart's contract. Assuming that Schwartz and Tarasenko make the team, that leaves the Blues at:
Perron-Backes-Oshie
McDonald-Berglund-Tarasenko
Schwartz-X-Steen
D'Agostini-Sobotka-Reaves
Crombeen, X
X-Pietrangelo
X-Shattenkirk
Russell-Polak
Cole
Halak/Elliott
The sale to new ownership hasn't been finalized, so as of right now nobody knows what the operating budget is going to be. I would be surprised if it increased significantly, though. Chances are it will be right around where it is now, and it wouldn't surprise me at all if it was less. For the moment, we'll assume it's not changing. Remember that cap space means nothing to the Blues since they'll never be a cap team. The real dollars are what matter.
Real dollar raises to players already under contract account chew up $3.325 of that $16.55 mentioned above, leaving $13.225 left.
Oshie and Perron are both RFAs that need to be retained. Lets set aside $3.0 million as a ballpark amount to take care of that, leaving $10.225 left.
The Blues will likely want to retain Arnott and Jackman. Ballpark it at $2.875 again for the former and about $3.8 for the latter. We're now left with $3.55 million, with a top 4 defenseman still to go. We also haven't accounted for Tarasenko's contract or any bonus clauses yet.
If the Blues trade Stewart for a reasonably priced good top 4 defensman, they're looking great. Solid and deep throughout the lineup with no significant holes.
Adding Iginla doesn't fit in the budget without skimping significantly elsewhere and creating a decent sized hole in the defense. They could run with Sobotka at 3rd line center, place Cole in the top 6, and fill in the bottom depth on offense and defense with bargain bin players to save $4-5 million but that severely undercuts the ability of the team to withstand injuries on defense and at center, and that's never a good thing. Iginla simply looks to be a luxury the Blues can't realistically afford right now.
^ What he said. This is why Giordano would be more valuable to the Blues than Iginla and why the Blues would pay more for Giordano than Iginla. Iginla is a luxury item on the Blues. Look at how many wingers the Blues either have under contract or will have under one-way contract:
Under contract:
1. McDonald
2. Steen
3. Schwartz (not one-way but very unlikely to go to Peoria based on Armstrong comments)
4. Sobotka
5. D'Agostini
6. Crombeen
7. Reaves
RFAs:
8. Perron – guaranteed re-sign
9. Oshie – guaranteed re-sign
10. Stewart – could be trade chip or re-sign
90% likely on ELC:
11. Tarasenko (not one-way but not going to Peoria at all)
Not even mentioning:
Langenbrunner
Porter
Grachev
So you see, Iginla pretty much requires Stewart going back the other way for one thing, and again, Iginla only has a few seasons of impact playoff performance left in him. It's worth something but nowhere near the best D prospect, a blue-chip forward prospect and two first round draft picks as was suggested. That's an automatic rejection.
The Blues biggest need was scoring this year, but mostly for health reasons. Right now, and for this coming offseason when 3 of them are free to walk as UFAs, the biggest concern is the left side of the defense.
The financial situation is tighter than you're making it out to be. The Blues have $13.675 million coming off the books in UFAs. Make that $16.55 if you toss on Stewart's contract. Assuming that Schwartz and Tarasenko make the team, that leaves the Blues at:
Perron-Backes-Oshie
McDonald-Berglund-Tarasenko
Schwartz-X-Steen
D'Agostini-Sobotka-Reaves
Crombeen, X
X-Pietrangelo
X-Shattenkirk
Russell-Polak
Cole
Halak/Elliott
The sale to new ownership hasn't been finalized, so as of right now nobody knows what the operating budget is going to be. I would be surprised if it increased significantly, though. Chances are it will be right around where it is now, and it wouldn't surprise me at all if it was less. For the moment, we'll assume it's not changing. Remember that cap space means nothing to the Blues since they'll never be a cap team. The real dollars are what matter.
Real dollar raises to players already under contract account chew up $3.325 of that $16.55 mentioned above, leaving $13.225 left.
Oshie and Perron are both RFAs that need to be retained. Lets set aside $3.0 million as a ballpark amount to take care of that, leaving $10.225 left.
The Blues will likely want to retain Arnott and Jackman. Ballpark it at $2.875 again for the former and about $3.8 for the latter. We're now left with $3.55 million, with a top 4 defenseman still to go. We also haven't accounted for Tarasenko's contract or any bonus clauses yet.
If the Blues trade Stewart for a reasonably priced good top 4 defensman, they're looking great. Solid and deep throughout the lineup with no significant holes.
Adding Iginla doesn't fit in the budget without skimping significantly elsewhere and creating a decent sized hole in the defense. They could run with Sobotka at 3rd line center, place Cole in the top 6, and fill in the bottom depth on offense and defense with bargain bin players to save $4-5 million but that severely undercuts the ability of the team to withstand injuries on defense and at center, and that's never a good thing. Iginla simply looks to be a luxury the Blues can't realistically afford right now.
Gotcha. Thanks for the explanation (not sarcasm lol). I didn't realize that the need for scoring was more based on injuries.
And gotcha, he would mess up a system that's working. I get that.
^ What he said. This is why Giordano would be more valuable to the Blues than Iginla and why the Blues would pay more for Giordano than Iginla. Iginla is a luxury item on the Blues. Look at how many wingers the Blues either have under contract or will have under one-way contract:
Under contract:
1. McDonald
2. Steen
3. Schwartz (not one-way but very unlikely to go to Peoria based on Armstrong comments)
4. Sobotka
5. D'Agostini
6. Crombeen
7. Reaves
RFAs:
8. Perron – guaranteed re-sign
9. Oshie – guaranteed re-sign
10. Stewart – could be trade chip or re-sign
90% likely on ELC:
11. Tarasenko (not one-way but not going to Peoria at all)
Not even mentioning:
Langenbrunner
Porter
Grachev
So you see, Iginla pretty much requires Stewart going back the other way for one thing, and again, Iginla only has a few seasons of impact playoff performance left in him. It's worth something but nowhere near the best D prospect, a blue-chip forward prospect and two first round draft picks as was suggested. That's an automatic rejection.
Good points. I will say assuming Tarasenko coming over may be a bit premature but that shouldn't change the fact Iggy would be a luxury.
I'm not sure if I would do the Giordano for Rattie/Cole trade. He's one of the few pieces I want to keep as a Flames fan. It's certainly not bad value, having Rattie and Baertschi on the same team would be cool, and I've always been a fan of Cole. I just don't know if I want to lose Giordano at this point. It's certainly enticing though.
Good points. I will say assuming Tarasenko coming over may be a bit premature but that shouldn't change the fact Iggy would be a luxury.
I'm not sure if I would do the Giordano for Rattie/Cole trade. He's one of the few pieces I want to keep as a Flames fan. It's certainly not bad value, having Rattie and Baertschi on the same team would be cool, and I've always been a fan of Cole. I just don't know if I want to lose Giordano at this point. It's certainly enticing though.
It's not that we're straight out assuming he'll be over (hence the 90% figure) but NONE of the tea leaves suggest he's staying, and every interview and public comment Tarasenko has made has been consistent that he wants to play in the NHL. He tore up the regular season, dominated the playoffs on an SKA team full of overhyped stiffs while getting 11th most forward minutes on that team, never wanted to play for a KHL team besides his hometown Sibir, Sibir (who employed his dad) was so sure he was heading to America that they rented him for a relative pittance when they could have simply held onto his KHL rights in case he came back. What else does he have to prove in the KHL?
