Trade Rumors and Free Agent TalkTrade rumors, transactions, and free agent talk. Rumors must contain the word RUMOR in post title. Proposals must contain the word PROPOSAL in post title.
Iginla and Nash are similar players with Iginla having the edge. Iginla is older, Nash has a crappy contract. The value is similar.
Player in his prime vs player pass his prime. Nash's contract isn't attractive but its actually close to being fair value. Iggy however is overpaid next season for his production or expected production (likely 60-70 point given that has been his production 2 of the last 3 seasons) but given the lack of UFAs out there, he has decent value. Just nothing close to Nash who's entering his prime/in his prime.
Player in his prime vs player pass his prime. Nash's contract isn't attractive but its actually close to being fair value. Iggy however is overpaid next season for his production or expected production (likely 60-70 point given that has been his production 2 of the last 3 seasons) but given the lack of UFAs out there, he has decent value. Just nothing close to Nash who's entering his prime/in his prime.
Iggy, who is no longer in his prime, hits 60-70 points consistently. Nash, who is in his prime, has had over 70 points once in his career.
Nash makes 8 million. Iggy makes 7 million. And Iggy is "nothing close to Nash"?
Player in his prime vs player pass his prime. Nash's contract isn't attractive but its actually close to being fair value. Iggy however is overpaid next season for his production or expected production (likely 60-70 point given that has been his production 2 of the last 3 seasons) but given the lack of UFAs out there, he has decent value. Just nothing close to Nash who's entering his prime/in his prime.
For a team that feels they are on the edge of winning a cup, Iginla is probably a much better option as he is currently the better player and has shown the ability to produce in the playoffs. Rich Nash is the younger player, who will remain at a high level for another 5+ years. He has next to no playoff experience, and his contract could be viewed as a huge deterrent to anyteam long term.
Rick Nash asking price - Columbus rejected two top prospects (Erixon/Miller), young roster player (Dubinsky), 1st round pick, B level prospect (Thomas)
Jarome Iginla asking price - 1st, young roster player, top prospect.
Depending on the team, and where they feel they are/areas they need to address Iginla could be the more desirable asset.
Also I find it funny how you say Nash's contract is almost fair value, and proceed to say that Iginla will be overpaid next season even though he has produced better offensive results every year since the lockout.
Iggy will not be traded to a rival team (especially Vancouver)
Iggy has been and continues to be a better player than Nash (though obviously Nash's upside is greater - if he ever gets it together wherever he ends up).
Iggy needs to be traded. This is another Sundin thing, how did that work for the Leafs?
The Flames is Iggy's team. Not Brent Sutter's, not Jay Feasters, not Ken King's. He has been running the on ice product and when anyone disagrees with him, they are gone...(insert Dion Phaneuf).
Fair return? First rounder, top end prospect.
Likely destinations? Washington, Buffalo with Regher, Tampa with Stevie Y., Pittsburgh with Sid.
Can they afford the cap hit, likely not now, depends non how the deal was broken down and possible cap dump players.
Which $7m in players would Gillis move to get him?
I never said they could do it, I just said Gillis would want him. Wanting a player and being able to work a deal out are not the same. But any GM wouldn't be doing their due diligence if they didn't at least kick the tires on an Iginla trade if it were known he was available.
Iginla's value decreases past every deadline (Draft, UFA Day, Trade Deadline) and Flames need to stop finishing in limbo every year.
Make the move already. I remember Flames fans not wanting Krejci, Colborne and Boston's 1st, then not wanting Krejci, then not wanting Marchand and Boston's 1st.
Imagine what they could have gotten for him two years ago? Flames have wasted the last couple years of his career and their franchises' progress.
When you are widely considered to be the Canadian franchise in the worst shape it speaks volumes to the moves that were/were not made.
In the offseason most teams can take his cap hit/ have time to make room room for it versus the deadline when only a handful of teams want and can afford him. If I had to guess where Iggy would go I would say Detroit. They have 21 mil in cap space with out the cap going up.
Normal logic might not apply this off season though. Although league revenues would dictate the cap going up on July 1st, the reality could very well be a much lower cap come September if/when the new CBA is ratified.
I doubt it will play out that way, but that spectre may make GM's a little more gunshy in a deal for a veteran player.
Normal logic might not apply this off season though. Although league revenues would dictate the cap going up on July 1st, the reality could very well be a much lower cap come September if/when the new CBA is ratified.
I doubt it will play out that way, but that spectre may make GM's a little more gunshy in a deal for a veteran player.
GM's have been told to operate as normal I take that to believe that the cap will be close to what it is currently there no GM's should be scared off.
All this nonsense about Iggy being too old....
He's scored 30+ goals 11 years straight ney sayers.
Plus, if Vancouver was willing to pay a washed up Sundin 20million dollars(pro-rated)
Iggy will harvest a good bounty to the right team. He is still a power forward above a lot in the league. Not what he once was, but could definately put the right team over the hump.
Iginla's value decreases past every deadline (Draft, UFA Day, Trade Deadline) and Flames need to stop finishing in limbo every year.
Make the move already. I remember Flames fans not wanting Krejci, Colborne and Boston's 1st, then not wanting Krejci, then not wanting Marchand and Boston's 1st.
Imagine what they could have gotten for him two years ago? Flames have wasted the last couple years of his career and their franchises' progress.
When you are widely considered to be the Canadian franchise in the worst shape it speaks volumes to the moves that were/were not made.
All this nonsense about Iggy being too old....
He's scored 30+ goals 11 years straight ney sayers.
Plus, if Vancouver was willing to pay a washed up Sundin 20million dollars(pro-rated)
Iggy will harvest a good bounty to the right team. He is still a power forward above a lot in the league. Not what he once was, but could definately put the right team over the hump.
Keep dreaming, he's getting older and his value decreased every day.
All this nonsense about Iggy being too old....
He's scored 30+ goals 11 years straight ney sayers.
Plus, if Vancouver was willing to pay a washed up Sundin 20million dollars(pro-rated)
Iggy will harvest a good bounty to the right team. He is still a power forward above a lot in the league. Not what he once was, but could definately put the right team over the hump.
There is a difference between what a type of contract a team would giving an aging star, especially when it was pro-rated, to what a team would have to give up to get that player, plus have to actually pay them.
BTW, Sundin got a pro-rated $8.6 million deal, meaning it was actually a $5 million deal, not all that crazy at all. Who cares what they offered, when that isn't what he got.
If Washington could sign both players to extensions what about
Washington
Jerome Iginla
Matt Stajan (Contract move/bury him in minors)
(Maybe a conditional pick based on Green playing x amount of games or Semin getting x amount of points)
Calgary
Alex Semin (re-signed)
Mike Green (re-signed)
*I know sign and trades are rare, but I think this move makes both teams better.
And then some generic moves San Jose
Mikka Kiprussoff
Anton Babchuk
Calgary
Martin Havlat
Douglas Murray
1st Round Pick
LA Kings
1st Round Pick (Either San Jose/Calgary)
Leland Irving
Calgary
Jonathon Bernier
Just my wild attempt. Obviously not a scorched earth approach, but gives the team some strong offense, and a decent d-core and a good young goalie without mortgaging the future.
If Washington could sign both players to extensions what about
Washington
Jerome Iginla
Matt Stajan (Contract move/bury him in minors)
(Maybe a conditional pick based on Green playing x amount of games or Semin getting x amount of points)
Calgary
Alex Semin (re-signed)
Mike Green (re-signed)
*I know sign and trades are rare, but I think this move makes both teams better.
And then some generic moves San Jose
Mikka Kiprussoff
Anton Babchuk
Calgary
Martin Havlat
Douglas Murray
1st Round Pick
LA Kings
1st Round Pick (Either San Jose/Calgary)
Leland Irving
Calgary
Jonathon Bernier
Just my wild attempt. Obviously not a scorched earth approach, but gives the team some strong offense, and a decent d-core and a good young goalie without mortgaging the future.
If Washington could sign both players to extensions what about
Washington
Jerome Iginla
Matt Stajan (Contract move/bury him in minors)
(Maybe a conditional pick based on Green playing x amount of games or Semin getting x amount of points)
Calgary
Alex Semin (re-signed)
Mike Green (re-signed)
*I know sign and trades are rare, but I think this move makes both teams better.
And then some generic moves San Jose
Mikka Kiprussoff
Anton Babchuk
Calgary
Martin Havlat
Douglas Murray
1st Round Pick
LA Kings
1st Round Pick (Either San Jose/Calgary)
Leland Irving
Calgary
Jonathon Bernier
Just my wild attempt. Obviously not a scorched earth approach, but gives the team some strong offense, and a decent d-core and a good young goalie without mortgaging the future.
interesting ideas, I like that you are thinking outside the norm and not blowing it up. So Cudos.
That said I would consider the 1st of these deals, but only if the Flames keep Stajan. The guys gets **** on alot by Flames fans (and other fans) but he is a solid defensive player who has shown he can produce when given quality minutes, he is also our only centerman that can win faceoffs and since we are already worst in the league by a full percentage point that is not an area we can afford to get weaker in.
The 2nd deal I understand the value but I really don't want Havlat or Murray, Murray is a quality player but we just finally made our blueline more mobile. And well Havlat isn't what he used to be, except injury prone.
The 3rd is probably good value, but I am extremely high on Irving. I honestly think he can be a starter in the NHL in 2 years, and a good one at that. So I would balk for that reason.
interesting ideas, I like that you are thinking outside the norm and not blowing it up. So Cudos.
That said I would consider the 1st of these deals, but only if the Flames keep Stajan. The guys gets **** on alot by Flames fans (and other fans) but he is a solid defensive player who has shown he can produce when given quality minutes, he is also our only centerman that can win faceoffs and since we are already worst in the league by a full percentage point that is not an area we can afford to get weaker in.
The 2nd deal I understand the value but I really don't want Havlat or Murray, Murray is a quality player but we just finally made our blueline more mobile. And well Havlat isn't what he used to be, except injury prone.
The 3rd is probably good value, but I am extremely high on Irving. I honestly think he can be a starter in the NHL in 2 years, and a good one at that. So I would balk for that reason.
More than anything I included Stajan for cap purposes. I figured Stajan + Iggy = 10.5 million and thats in the ballpark of what Green/Semin would make.
Theres also going to be players like Gaustad/Kelly/Pahlsson/Campbell/Slater hitting free agency, so I think the role of defensively responsible center can be fairly easily replaced.
Outside of this season, Havlat has been fairly healthy in recent memory (81, 73, 78 games played the 3 prior seasons). Obviously he isn't quite a star player, but should consistently put up 60 points, and is only 31 years old.
That is a good point about Douglas Murray, but I think a trade based around Kipper for Havlat wouldn't be too far off in value (San Jose likely adding a bit).
I think Irving has a shot a being a starting goalie some day, but I definitely think Bernier is the better of the 2. Same draft year, and picked 15 spots ahead of Irving. More impressive AHL numbers, and more likely to be a quality starter in the NHL.
Nothing against Irving, I just think Irving + a mid 1st for arguably the 3rd best goalie prospect in the league is worth it from a Flames perspective.
interesting ideas, I like that you are thinking outside the norm and not blowing it up. So Cudos.
*Also thanks. Its a bit different making proposals for a different team...but I don't think a team who barely miss the playoffs needs a scorched earth approach.
A shakeup, yes but it doesn't mean years of tanking and trading star players for picks.
What would it take to bring Iggy to Phoenix? Would like to see him get to play with Doaner again, and seeing what Whitney's been able to do I'd be okay with him nearing the "downside" of his career. Assuming we get this whole ownership situation sorted out I doubt we would mind taking on his contract.
How about a Rundblad + 2012 1st? This is my first proposed trade, so feel free to laugh me out of the thread if this isn't nearly enough. Thanks boys.
More than anything I included Stajan for cap purposes. I figured Stajan + Iggy = 10.5 million and thats in the ballpark of what Green/Semin would make.
Theres also going to be players like Gaustad/Kelly/Pahlsson/Campbell/Slater hitting free agency, so I think the role of defensively responsible center can be fairly easily replaced.
Outside of this season, Havlat has been fairly healthy in recent memory (81, 73, 78 games played the 3 prior seasons). Obviously he isn't quite a star player, but should consistently put up 60 points, and is only 31 years old.
That is a good point about Douglas Murray, but I think a trade based around Kipper for Havlat wouldn't be too far off in value (San Jose likely adding a bit).
I think Irving has a shot a being a starting goalie some day, but I definitely think Bernier is the better of the 2. Same draft year, and picked 15 spots ahead of Irving. More impressive AHL numbers, and more likely to be a quality starter in the NHL.
Nothing against Irving, I just think Irving + a mid 1st for arguably the 3rd best goalie prospect in the league is worth it from a Flames perspective.
Flames have lots of cap space this off-season and I think even with Stajan the Flames need one of Stoll or Gaustad, we are that bad at faceoffs. I also think Backlund should play next season on the wing to allow him to focus on his offensive game for a while, i think it will help him break out a bit. And like I said I see the value in your proposal, I just think there is better fits that would help the Flames a bit more (I think Kipper to Toronto could bring back Franson & Bozak as a starting point).
I get Havlat had a healthy stretch, but in the 3 years before those 3 healthy years he only played 109 total games. I don't remember 100% for sure but I seem to remember some of those being recurring injuries too. But even more than his health I just really don't want him on my team because of some of his questionable antics (been suspended for kicking twice).
And to Irving/Bernier, you might be right and Bernier does have a better history. But Irving is still steadily improving and I would go as far as saying in 6 of his 7 starts he was the reason we weren't blown out. I know Irving's GAA isn't great, but the kid was peppered an average of 34+ shots per game. I think both will be excellent goaltenders, and maybe Bernier will be better, but IMO it would only be marginally better and that the 1st rounder could go towards stocking our cupboards a bit more and hopefully plugging one of the other holes in the organization. I would rather keep Irving and hope for another Baertschi type prospect.
What would it take to bring Iggy to Phoenix? Would like to see him get to play with Doaner again, and seeing what Whitney's been able to do I'd be okay with him nearing the "downside" of his career. Assuming we get this whole ownership situation sorted out I doubt we would mind taking on his contract.
How about a Rundblad + 2012 1st? This is my first proposed trade, so feel free to laugh me out of the thread if this isn't nearly enough. Thanks boys.
I'd have no interest in Rundblad I have had him pegged a a player that would bust for a while. We are more likely to want a forward back and well to be blunt your group of forward prospects is horrible (it's even worse than ours ) I really don't see a fit at all.
I would also say it would take more than Rundblad and a 1st as even Kaberle returned more than that last season.
) I really don't see a fit at all.
