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What do the Leafs and their fans get out of the 'New NHL'?
That's what he wants his team would be loaded with all the good players and would not have to do any scouting. I'll say it again the Leafs have 5 players on their 25 man roster that they draft and developed 5
Of course he does, I'm just genuinely surprised that he doesn't seem to see that. I doubt he'd be advocating ridiculous policies like this if 4 of the last 10 number 1 overall picks were from Massachusetts.
This is what I think is the problem, but I'm not in business, so it's probably wrong but I'll try.
The Leafs are owned by a big company. They make a ton of money regardless if their team is going to the SCF or is a lottery team. They don't care about the quality of the product because the fans will pay no matter what. The seats are always filled, they still sell tons of merchandise, and still have a huge tv market. We all know McDonald's sucks, but people still buy it just because it's there.
Bettman has nothing to do with it, neither did Ziegler. It's the owners.
Of course he does, I'm just genuinely surprised that he doesn't seem to see that. I doubt he'd be advocating ridiculous policies like this if 4 of the last 10 number 1 overall picks were from Massachusetts.
Agreed the sad thing is his team had the advantage the draft provides (bad teams get higher picks in each round) and squandered it. Now he wants to correct his teams mistakes with some half cocked poilcy. In his world teams could get free do overs like a 5 year old kid.
Absolutely nothing I would say. They do not get to have many star players anymore, they are forced to give welfare handouts to teams that have few fans to begin with, and the current system prevents them from making the playoffs. Even worse, they get mocked and jeered by fans of teams that they are forced to give these welfare handouts to!
Fans in Toronto are paying steak prices for hot dog meals, and I would think they are getting mighty tired of it. Good Ontario boys like Tavares and Stamkos should be Maple Leafs IMO but Bettman's commie system prevents this. The Leafs wanted to sign Tavares but a certain New York lawyer forbid it! What nonsense . It is not only the Leafs that are getting the raw end of things either. Crosby was a Montreal fan but Bettman's rigged system forced him to go to Pittsburgh instead. Can you imagine if Crosby was a Hab and the Leafs had players like Stamkos and Tavares?
I think alot of long time fans are also getting mighty tired of being lectured by the johnny come lately types about 'growing the game' and how important it is to have teams succeed in crummy markets at the Leafs expense.
Time for Leaf fans and like minded fans of other big market teams to show their support for Fehr and get rid of Bettman Inc. once and for all!
I believe the only appropriate response to a ridiculous post like this is:
Ahh the Leafs, the NY Yankees of the sport -- you know, minus the success. Just out of curiosity, what was the 'solution' circa 2004-05 before Bettman duped all 30 owners into his devious communist plan?
The real solution here is to relocate the Leafs. Clearly, the market needs to be saved from itself at this point. If the city of Toronto refuses to exercise their right to stop paying ridiculous prices for a crap product, what other solution is there?
Also, say what you want about the salary cap as the cause of the Leafs' ills, but I personally think the problem runs deeper. Expansion is the real culprit here. Leafs win the Cup in '67, first round of expansion arrives in '68 -- coincidence? I think not! Once the NHL rights the wrong of adding 24 teams, then and only then can things finally get back to normal!
Exactly. If there was a luxury tax things would be different, but the current system puniushes the Leafs for being successful period and has funnelled money and players to places like Phoenix and Atlanta. I would rather watch top players play for the Leafs on Saturday night then have to watch lowly highlights of them playing in more obscure places.
The Leafs and other teams should end the current welfaring. They get nothing out of it anyways. And to make matters worse, fans of teams who receive tht money always mock the Leafs anyways.
This word "welfare" is being used around way too much with regards to revenue sharing. Its not really welfare if its money being used around in the same private sector in the same league. Now if the govenment is giving money to a private entity or private citizen then that is where the word welfare can be used.
But do keep in mind that there was something called the Canadian Assistance Plan. You know where America dollars from American teams went to helping teams up north in trouble when the Loonie was below 70 cents to the America Dollar? Did you have a problem with this kind of system that one could call a welfare kind of one as well or is there a double standard you have in mind over which teams should be entitled to such revenue?
This word "welfare" is being used around way too much with regards to revenue sharing. Its not really welfare if its money being used around in the same private sector in the same league. Now if the govenment is giving money to a private entity or private citizen then that is where the word welfare can be used.
But do keep in mind that there was something called the Canadian Assistance Plan. You know where America dollars from American teams went to helping teams up north in trouble when the Loonie was below 70 cents to the America Dollar? Did you have a problem with this kind of system that one could call a welfare kind of one as well or is there a double standard you have in mind over which teams should be entitled to such revenue?
Fehr and I care about making money. I can't speak for him on that. But I can care less were teams are located. If Winnipeg has to move because they lose money, I am behind that, and vice versa. No bias here.
This word "welfare" is being used around way too much with regards to revenue sharing. Its not really welfare if its money being used around in the same private sector in the same league. Now if the govenment is giving money to a private entity or private citizen then that is where the word welfare can be used.
But do keep in mind that there was something called the Canadian Assistance Plan. You know where America dollars from American teams went to helping teams up north in trouble when the Loonie was below 70 cents to the America Dollar? Did you have a problem with this kind of system that one could call a welfare kind of one as well or is there a double standard you have in mind over which teams should be entitled to such revenue?
In the entire existence of the Canadian assistance plan less money flowed to Canadian teams than revenue sharing to American teams in ONE year.
And many Canadians remember Caps owner Ted Leonsis whining about having to pay welfare to Canadian teams YET he has yet to thank anyone for the millions more he has received in revenue sharing.
I'd say the four Canadian teams that received money from the CAP have more than given it back.
Of course he does, I'm just genuinely surprised that he doesn't seem to see that. I doubt he'd be advocating ridiculous policies like this if 4 of the last 10 number 1 overall picks were from Massachusetts.
Fehr and I care about making money. I can't speak for him on that. But I can care less were teams are located. If Winnipeg has to move because they lose money, I am behind that, and vice versa. No bias here.
Yep we are on the same page. I had no issues with teams like Dallas and Colorado using their resources to win in the past. It is not a Canada vs U.S. type of thing with me.
I bring up the Leafs because they (and especially their fans) are really being punished under this system. They basically subsidize other teams' ability to get good players and really get nothing out of it themselves. And then many of the fans of those teams receiving money from the Leafs have the gall to lecture and mock Leaf fans about running a successful franchise. If it was not for the Leafs they would likely have been out of business years ago and might be soon anyways. It must grate pretty hard on some Toronto fans nerves IMO...
Wait, I thought you guys cared about the fans getting value for their tickets? Now you care about the franchise making money? I'd wager that the Leafs likely make more money now than they did pre-lockout.
Wait, I thought you guys cared about the fans getting value for their tickets? Now you care about the franchise making money? I'd wager that the Leafs likely make more money now than they did pre-lockout.
I can't speak for anyone else but my main beef is players not having the freedom to play where they want.
That goes for any professional athlete.
If you want to have a draft, fine, but let the player become a UFA when he's younger. I suggest 22 y/o.
Wait, I thought you guys cared about the fans getting value for their tickets? Now you care about the franchise making money? I'd wager that the Leafs likely make more money now than they did pre-lockout.
Fans would get more fair value for their tickets if the proceeds actually benefitted their own team that they support instead of a bunch of weak sisters. A luxury tax would solve this. Fans in places like Toronto would at least get to see their teams spend some real money on players in return for paying as much as they do for tickets.
I'm just confused why so many fans care about the finances of the corporate entity that controls their team....and I don't mean I care if they go broke....but as a Kings fan, I don't really care if AEG was worth 6.532 Billion last year and is only worth 6.527 billion this year....Oh Noes my corporate enity had to play .003% of their wealth to another corporate entity they are in business with, poor corporate entity.
Absolutely nothing I would say. They do not get to have many star players anymore,
No one is stopping them from having star players. They are free to trade or draft star players under the same set of rules every other team in the league lives under. And as long as they keep the salaries within the salary cap that every team has to live with they can have as stacked a team as they like.
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Originally Posted by Fehr Time
they are forced to give welfare handouts to teams that have few fans to begin with,
It`s not like they are the only team in the league that does that.
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Originally Posted by Fehr Time
and the current system prevents them from making the playoffs. Even worse, they get mocked and jeered by fans of teams that they are forced to give these welfare handouts to!
How does the current system prevent Toronto from making the playoffs? Every season 16 teams that live under the same rules as Toronto manage to qualify for the playoffs so what 'special circumstances" is Toronto forced to deal with that these other teams do not face.
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Originally Posted by Fehr Time
Fans in Toronto are paying steak prices for hot dog meals, and I would think they are getting mighty tired of it.!
No one is holding a gun to Maple Leaf fans heads forcing them to buy tickets if they don`t like the product they are paying for. You don`t like the product a company is selling you, then stop buying the product until it changes.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fehr Time
Good Ontario boys like Tavares and Stamkos should be Maple Leafs IMO but Bettman's commie system prevents this. The Leafs wanted to sign Tavares but a certain New York lawyer forbid it! What nonsense . It is not only the Leafs that are getting the raw end of things either. Crosby was a Montreal fan but Bettman's rigged system forced him to go to Pittsburgh instead. Can you imagine if Crosby was a Hab and the Leafs had players like Stamkos and Tavares?
Perhaps your new to the concept, but most NA sports leagues have something called a draft every year to decide where players get to play. It`s been around a long time now, long before anyone had even heard of Gary Bettman.
And by the way did you think it was such a commie system when your team drafted high in the 1st round. Since 1970 Toronto has had 18 first round picks in the top ten.
I think alot of long time fans are also getting mighty tired of being lectured by the johnny come lately types about 'growing the game' and how important it is to have teams succeed in crummy markets at the Leafs expense.!
While I`m no Bettman fan and may question the viability of some of the new markets the NHL moved into, none of that is to blame for the last 44 seasons of failure by the Toronto Maple Leafs.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fehr Time
Time for Leaf fans and like minded fans of other big market teams to show their support for Fehr and get rid of Bettman Inc. once and for all!
Well if you want to jump on that horse good luck. But if you think Fehr is going to wave some magic wand and presto no more salary cap then you are in for a big disappointment. Bettman or no Bettman the cap is not likely to be going anywhere.
And besides after the 67 expansion Toronto went many years in an uncapped league without being successful, what makes you think getting rid of it now will change that.
Inept ownership, and management will fail no matter what system the team is under, and Toronto has had more than it`s share of both of those. Perhaps that is where you should be pointing the finger for the Maple Leaf`s woes.
Last edited by Kirikanoir: 04-05-2012 at 01:37 AM.
NHL teams, outside of there first few picks, draft for the future, like in baseball. Keeping the UFA rules like baseball's FA rules makes the must sense.
Last edited by IU Hawks fan: 04-05-2012 at 01:48 AM.
I notice on a few forums discussing baseball, basketball and football a large portion of fans like the idea of territorial rights to a couple of players. But, not so much here on a hockey forum.
I wonder why.
What forums do you go to? Nobody freaking suggests anything of the sort nowadays.
And we get it.... you want the Leafs to become the Yankees of the NHL. It ain't happening, though.
. It is not only the Leafs that are getting the raw end of things either. Crosby was a Montreal fan but Bettman's rigged system forced him to go to Pittsburgh instead. Can you imagine if Crosby was a Hab and the Leafs had players like Stamkos and Tavares?
