First, I want to say this was an excellent analysis. I agree with it. Predicting what the Islanders will do is almost as impossible as herding cats. I would love if we get Murray or Galchenyuk, with my personal preference of AG. Murray is a serious talent and he fills a need, but I think Galchenyuk is BPA between the two. If he was not injured, there is no comparison IMHO.
I can see Nail and the 2 G's being drafted 1-3 and the Islanders still drafting a forward. lol
Forget about what it says to the rest of the league. What does it say to the players in the room? Sure, it's a meaningless game, but I'm sure if you ask everyone in that room they'll all say they want to win the game tomorrow.
First, I want to say this was an excellent analysis. I agree with it. Predicting what the Islanders will do is almost as impossible as herding cats. I would love if we get Murray or Galchenyuk, with my personal preference of AG. Murray is a serious talent and he fills a need, but I think Galchenyuk is BPA between the two. If he was not injured, there is no comparison IMHO.
Thanks and I agree, between Galchenyuk and Murray, AG is the BPA. However I think it's close enough to where we could take Murray and still feel good about not necessarily leaving the better player on the board.
I am relatively certain that the Islanders will choose Galchenyuk if he's there and Murray is off the board, but what I am worried about is whether or not they will choose a defenseman if picks 1-3 involve Yakupov, Grigorenko and Galchenyuk. Snow's track record is consistent. He picks forwards in the 1st round. The one exception was de Haan, however that was one of multiple 1st rounders we had that year.
I would like to hope that Snow understands just how badly this team needs help on the blue-line. Murray's talent/ceiling, NHL-readiness as well as most likely being BPA at pick-4 should make it a relatively easy call for Garth. I just hope he doesn't overthink it and go with the high-risk, somewhat high reward Filip Forsberg.
Thanks and I agree, between Galchenyuk and Murray, AG is the BPA. However I think it's close enough to where we could take Murray and still feel good about not necessarily leaving the better player on the board.
I am relatively certain that the Islanders will choose Galchenyuk if he's there and Murray is off the board, but what I am worried about is whether or not they will choose a defenseman if picks 1-3 involve Yakupov, Grigorenko and Galchenyuk. Snow's track record is consistent. He picks forwards in the 1st round. The one exception was de Haan, however that was one of multiple 1st rounders we had that year.
I would like to hope that Snow understands just how badly this team needs help on the blue-line. Murray's talent/ceiling, NHL-readiness as well as most likely being BPA at pick-4 should make it a relatively easy call for Garth. I just hope he doesn't overthink it and go with the high-risk, somewhat high reward Filip Forsberg.
I agree. Murray seems like a guy that could step right in and make a immediate impact. If both Galchenyuk and Murray were there at four I would take Murray only because of the offensive talent we already have in our system and our severe lack of top defensive talent. I agree that Snow shouldn't overthink this. If both/one of Galchenyuk or Murray are there when we pick it needs to be one of the two. There is no reason to go with a high risk pick when you could take a talented forward or an NHL ready defenseman.
Despite our glaring need for defense I still feel Galchenyuk has franchise player potential. I would love if we picked this kid, despite having many centers in the system, not many are true centers. Josh Bailey has seemed to find his touch on the wing. Brock Nelson has played both wing and center at UND, same with Anders Lee I believe. Ullstrom has been a primary winger for some time now, who knows about Sundstrom right now. The only player that is a true center right now is Strome and he could potentially have a Jordan Eberle type impact on JT's wing in the future. In other words, Gally could be our number two center and play with JT on the powerplay. Filthy
Thanks and I agree, between Galchenyuk and Murray, AG is the BPA. However I think it's close enough to where we could take Murray and still feel good about not necessarily leaving the better player on the board.
I am relatively certain that the Islanders will choose Galchenyuk if he's there and Murray is off the board, but what I am worried about is whether or not they will choose a defenseman if picks 1-3 involve Yakupov, Grigorenko and Galchenyuk. Snow's track record is consistent. He picks forwards in the 1st round. The one exception was de Haan, however that was one of multiple 1st rounders we had that year.
I would like to hope that Snow understands just how badly this team needs help on the blue-line. Murray's talent/ceiling, NHL-readiness as well as most likely being BPA at pick-4 should make it a relatively easy call for Garth. I just hope he doesn't overthink it and go with the high-risk, somewhat high reward Filip Forsberg.
I am firmly entrenched in the Dumba camp if given the choice with Murray, but I will say that your argument is very solid for why Murray would be the ideal pick. The trends show that the Isles go exclusively for forwards first and go for the defenseman later. The Isles also seem to adhere to a projection/age based philosophy. They love grabbing the younger players with higher upside as opposed to the more established and older players (within their draft year). Strome over Couturier demonstrates this well. Nino over Fowler/Gormley in 2010 is another example. CDH was a similar pick in 2009, a younger kid with high upside over someone like Kulikov who was a bit more proven. I'll also throw in Hamonic is 2008 as he fits the bill.
To me, Forsberg fits the bill better than anyone else at #4 when you really look at it. Reports vary on him, but when names such as Sundin, Shanahan, and Perry are being bandied about in regards to his upside... Isles are probably salivating over him. Throw in the fact that he's an August '94 birthdate, he's almost a full year younger than Yakupov and Murray. He could be JT's star winger in the future.
Dumba is also one of the young ones who is the higher upside, less established than Murray. He may be known for his hitting, but he's got crazy offensive tools. He's the defense version of Strome from last year. Like Forsberg, Dumba has a dynamic talent that the Isles do not have in the organization. Murray might remind Snow of CDH a little too much to take him over someone like Dumba.
So for me, it's Forsberg/Dumba rather than Galchenyuk/Murray. I don't want Galchenyuk because of injury.
How are all you guys Galchenyuk experts all a sudden when the guy missed the whole damn season... Don't tell me you were watching Sarnia Sting games in 2010-2011.. i'm not buying that.... I just find it funny when we talk with so much confidence about these kids... none of us know a damn thing, but we have it all figured out.. lol
Despite our glaring need for defense I still feel Galchenyuk has franchise player potential. I would love if we picked this kid, despite having many centers in the system, not many are true centers. Josh Bailey has seemed to find his touch on the wing. Brock Nelson has played both wing and center at UND, same with Anders Lee I believe. Ullstrom has been a primary winger for some time now, who knows about Sundstrom right now. The only player that is a true center right now is Strome and he could potentially have a Jordan Eberle type impact on JT's wing in the future. In other words, Gally could be our number two center and play with JT on the powerplay. Filthy
While Galchenyuk may have great potential, I don't think it would make sense for us to take him with Murray on the board as well. I understand that people want BPA but if both Galchenyuk and Murray are there when we pick we need to take Murray. As you said, we have a number of talented players in our system. I think that Brock Nelson could step up and be our number 2 center. Maybe I'm overrating him but I just think he will be a very good player for us in the future. I've heard that Strome could play the wing but if he isn't playing with JT I think playing center is better for him. It is very possible to have JT, Nelson and Strome as you top three centers in a few years. While adding Galchenyuk to those three looks good, I feel our defense will continue to struggle because the lack of talent in the system. Drafting Murray gives us an NHL ready defenseman with top 4 potential which is something that we desperately need.
How are all you guys Galchenyuk experts all a sudden when the guy missed the whole damn season... Don't tell me you were watching Sarnia Sting games in 2010-2011.. i'm not buying that.... I just find it funny when we talk with so much confidence about these kids... none of us know a damn thing, but we have it all figured out.. lol
I have been really puzzled by the amount of love Galchenyuk has been getting lately. It's really only natural because we get enamored with different guys throughout the season, but you're right petro. The guy hasn't played all season. I don't see how he's a franchise type of player after playing like 5 games.
Besides all of that, Strome and Nelson are looking pretty good up the middle for us. If you can call us strong at any position, center would be it.
How are all you guys Galchenyuk experts all a sudden when the guy missed the whole damn season... Don't tell me you were watching Sarnia Sting games in 2010-2011.. i'm not buying that.... I just find it funny when we talk with so much confidence about these kids... none of us know a damn thing, but we have it all figured out.. lol
Actually, I was. I like to keep tabs on future top picks, much like I did with MacKinnon this year(kid is an absolute beast, btw), so naturally I was able to watch a handfull of Sting games last season to get a glimpse of Yakupov. More often than not, I came away much more impressed with Galchenyuk. Sure, Yakupov's skill is off the charts, but to me Galchenyuk just seemed like the total package. Kid just brought it every shift, and on top of that his skill is top notch. IMO, it's pretty rare to find a player with that kind of overall game.
If you don't believe me, just look at the mock drafts. Why is it all these scouts have Galchenyuk as a top-5 pick after missing basically an entire season due to injury? Shouldn't that tell you something about just how good this kid is?
I previously said that my opinion is worth as little as anyone else's. I happen to think that Galchenyuk is probably BPA when the Isles pick based upon MY OPINION of who I think will be there. I base my thoughts on what most do...highlights, a few games, and draft reports from people that know more than almost all of us. Don't act like you know more. Just don't. I clearly stated that this is only my opinion. Don't wager any bets based upon my posts. I just happen to believe based upon the Islanders track record, and the fact that I BELIEVE that you can sign d-men more easily than cornerstone forwards, that the Islanders will draft a guy like Galchenyuk. Again, I said predicting what they will do is "like herding cats." In other words, it is impossible to do.
Forget about what it says to the rest of the league. What does it say to the players in the room? Sure, it's a meaningless game, but I'm sure if you ask everyone in that room they'll all say they want to win the game tomorrow.
Unless there's an injury, Montoya needs to play.
it says that montoya has been brutal and the back up goaltender gives the isles a better chance to win.
ROW - Total number of Regulation plus Overtime Wins
Tiebreaker rules
1.The greater number of games won, excluding games won in the Shootout. This figure is reflected in the ROW column.
2.The greater number of points earned in games between the tied clubs. If two clubs are tied, and have not played an equal number of home games against each other, points earned in the first game played in the city that had the extra game shall not be included. If more than two clubs are tied, the higher percentage of available points earned in games among those clubs, and not including any "odd" games, shall be used to determine the standing.
3.The greater differential between goals for and against for the entire regular season. NOTE: In standings a victory in a shootout counts as one goal for, while a shootout loss counts as one goal against.
First, I want to say this was an excellent analysis. I agree with it. Predicting what the Islanders will do is almost as impossible as herding cats. I would love if we get Murray or Galchenyuk, with my personal preference of AG. Murray is a serious talent and he fills a need, but I think Galchenyuk is BPA between the two. If he was not injured, there is no comparison IMHO.
While I agree that we've been very Forward prone the last several years and it has been Garth who has said he values FWDS more early....I do NOT think he would have passed on Larsson...and I dont think he'll pass on Murray if he is sitting there. While I think there is a stated philosophy from the organ-i-zation, i dont think it's Dogma either. Especially when you look at our prospect pool, which contains a myriad of potential on Offense, but is scant when it comes to defenders. Sometimes, talent wins over position...and I think that would be the case with Murray.
If we "slip" to our rightly held position at #5...then I think its wide open, i dont think Dumba garners that same obviousness as Murray and so if Yak, Murray, Grigorenko, and Galeynchuk are all off the board....then I could see a FWD taken...I do not see us trading down. we do not need more picks, we need high level players.
Galchenyuck, if Yakupov, Grigorenko and Dumba are off the board. Murray scares me, his offense isn't anything special, he reminds me of a Scott Lachance type, at best a top 4 d-man. Galchenyuck has special talent. Sure the knee is worrisome, but look at what Malkin has done in less than 6 months after blowing out his knee. Not saying Galchenyuck is Malkin, but if his knee checks out as solid, he's probably the third best talent in the draft.
I think Im the Only one that Would not Draft Galchenyuk...
We need defense,more defense, and winger....
My hope id that one of Murray or Dumba are available when we pick but if not I would not mind us taking Forsberg.
The Scouts seem to be in love with his game....Could be a good fit for JT on the rite side.
I know that everyone wants Strome to move to the wing but I feel he could become a solid #2 Center behind JT. I think he could become a Krejchi type..
We DO need defense, but a blue chip defenseman may not be there. So do you draft position giving up a BPA forward for a possible middle-pairind defenseman? The answer is pretty obvious...you can always use more, higher talent. It pushes down the less talented even though they are pretty good, and it just strengthens the whole lineup.
If you have 2nd line talent playing 3rd line, and tweener 1st line talent on your 2nd line, you create a powerful group of forwards vs. just an average defense corps that can be acquired with later picks or through using some of the non-utilized forward talent in trade.
Always draft talent and character over position, ALWAYS.
You have to draft the BPA. Can't draft a player hoping he's going to make an impact next season. Chances are he won't.
I wouldn't be so sure. Larsson did it this season and Fowler the year before. Anaheim made the playoffs with 99 points in Fowler's rookie year and NJD did it this year, putting up 100 points(maybe more) with Larsson as a rookie.
Murray is on par with both of those guys, and compares pretty well with Fowler. Less offense but better defensively(at the same age, at least). Murray WILL be in the NHL next year if the Isles draft him. I'll bet my left nut on it.
Its hard to find solid defense in todays NHL, i.e. Lidstrom. Draft Murray please.
Murray would be a great start. I think he'd pair with Hamonic from day one. If we could then sign a big RH top-4 guy, we'd be good to go for 2012-13. Sheldon Brookbank would be a great fit. Pair him with Streit on the top-pairing and see if the Murray-Hamonic pair can overtake them at some point.
Maybe re-sign Staios to be the 7th. I can live with that defense. Whoever between Donovan and de Haan doesn't make it could either be used as Streit's replacement if he walks after the season, or used in a package to add scoring or bottom-6 depth at the deadline.
You guys think a defense like this is good enough to get us into the playoffs, assuming our offense and goaltending is solid? I think it could be. A few things would need to happen, but none of them are too unlikely, IMO. Streit needs to play at the same level he's been playing at recently and not as the Streit from the beginning of the season. Hamonic needs to continue to develop and improve, and Murray needs to transition well into the NHL game. Much like Larsson and Fowler did before him.
Donovan has looked awesome these past 2 games. Small sample size, I know, but it gives me some confidence in him being able to handle a 3rd pairing role next year with some PP time.
I wouldn't be so sure. Larsson did it this season and Fowler the year before. Anaheim made the playoffs with 99 points in Fowler's rookie year and NJD did it this year, putting up 100 points(maybe more) with Larsson as a rookie.
Murray is on par with both of those guys, and compares pretty well with Fowler. Less offense but better defensively(at the same age, at least). Murray WILL be in the NHL next year if the Isles draft him. I'll bet my left nut on it.
Dude, NEVER bet your nuts on anything.
I have never seen Murray play outside of last year's WJHC, and he had a bit of a rough outing so i will discount that as a small sample size for my opinion.
From scouting reports, what I gather is that Murray is a very solid performer on both sides of the puck, is not bigger than average, and is not elite in anything. A prototypical middle pairing defenseman, maybe topping out as a #2 if it all falls in place, but likely a #3/4.
He is not projected as a Doughty or Pieterangleo grade, but it is always hard to project defensemen.
From the defense category, it sounds like Jacob Trouba has the best projection as a good #2 with greater all around capabilities.....size, physical play, skating, big shot from the point. Dumba possesses these capabilities also, but his size is going to be an issue for his chose style of play unless he has a big growth spurt and bulks up by 40 lbs
Trouba could be our pick if we are going D-man when we step up (especially if the BC forwards are taken).
From scouting reports, what I gather is that Murray is a very solid performer on both sides of the puck, is not bigger than average, and is not elite in anything. A prototypical middle pairing defenseman, maybe topping out as a #2 if it all falls in place, but likely a #3/4.
I am guessing Murray will turn out like Redden before his career took a nosedive(basically a 40-50 point good 2 way guy).
Quote:
Originally Posted by blinkman360
Donovan has looked awesome these past 2 games.
Donovan needs to work on his positioning in the defensive zone. A few times in the past couple games he looked like a chicken with his head cut off.
