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GDT: Penguins @ Wolf Pack 11-27-04

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Old
11-27-2004, 10:53 PM
  #76
bmoak
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pld459666
It very well could be the system stifling the players ability to create scoring and that's not good for when players are called up to the big club, yes they can hold their own defensively, but are left wanting when it comes time to create anything meaningful in the offensive zone.
This is NOT a stifling system or a trap! The Checkers play the same system in Charlotte and have the 2nd most goals in the ECHL.

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11-27-2004, 10:59 PM
  #77
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Originally Posted by bmoak
This is NOT a stifling system or a trap! The Checkers play the same system in Charlotte and have the 2nd most goals in the ECHL.
What works in ECHL doesn't mean will work in AHL. It could be the system, it could be a load of other factors or a combination of various reasons. It is the management's job to locate and fix the problems.

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11-27-2004, 11:49 PM
  #78
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Originally Posted by Son of Steinbrenner
me too. wiseman is going to be a career ahl player while giroux has the heart and skill to play in the nhl.

completely agree, anyone with a non-biased, objective point of view would say the same.

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11-27-2004, 11:52 PM
  #79
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Son of Steinbrenner
me too. wiseman is going to be a career ahl player while giroux has the heart and skill to play in the nhl.
When Chad makes it to the NHL, I'll be sure to dig out my bag of "I told you so's".

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11-28-2004, 12:01 AM
  #80
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I would say at this point Wiseman's chances of making NHL aren't very good, but Giroux's are close to zero.

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Old
11-28-2004, 12:03 AM
  #81
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Originally Posted by majicpixie
When Chad makes it to the NHL, I'll be sure to dig out my bag of "I told you so's".
i hope your right and i'm wrong

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Old
11-28-2004, 12:05 AM
  #82
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If Wiseman doesn't make it to the NHL, then Slats is an idiot for trading Nils Ekman away.

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11-28-2004, 12:52 AM
  #83
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Originally Posted by Prucha73
I would say at this point Wiseman's chances of making NHL aren't very good, but Giroux's are close to zero.
Really? I thought you had Chad penciled in on the top line with Jagr this year if there was a season?

BTW, I think Giroux has a better chance that Wiseman. That would make for a good board poll...

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11-28-2004, 12:57 AM
  #84
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There's no way Ranger fans would stand to watch a trapping Rangers. The Devils maybe good, it's because of the system they play and they drafted all those years, because they sucked. I'd rather watch paint dry. They're runing the game by playing the trap.

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11-28-2004, 01:03 AM
  #85
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Originally Posted by sjb3599
Really? I thought you had Chad penciled in on the top line with Jagr this year if there was a season?

BTW, I think Giroux has a better chance that Wiseman. That would make for a good board poll...
The kid is having a dry spell. It happens. Get over it. He sure as hell won't suck all season, and next month you'll all be talking about what a great player he is. And then I'll laugh. I might not post here, but that doesn't mean I don't read what others post here. I watched him for 2 seasons in Cleveland. I follow the Pack, as well teams that have other former Sharks prospects on their rosters. Wiseman is better than you think. He's also better than what he's showing you right now. Give the guy a break. If Sather thought he wasn't any good, he wouldn't have re-signed him. End of story.

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Old
11-28-2004, 01:55 AM
  #86
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ILuvHockey
There's no way Ranger fans would stand to watch a trapping Rangers. The Devils maybe good, it's because of the system they play and they drafted all those years, because they sucked. I'd rather watch paint dry. They're runing the game by playing the trap.

This is a misconception. What ruined the game was the moronic rule changes Bettman made. Taking away the tag-up rule protected D-men and gave them free outs. It also pushed almost every player into the neutral zone, making the trap effective to play. And that's what you got the last eight years. An overcrowded zone with no room and little flow.

By reinstalling the tag-up, you'll see teams able to attack more and a quicker game with more transition and less whistles.


Aside from this rule change, there was also the stupid instigator, which basically eliminated players policing themselves. What you got was a total lack of respect and more sticks coming up.


Goalie equipment is a big reason for the dramatic dropoff in offense. The vast majority of these guys look like marshmallows in net leaving little room for a shooter to fire. You hardly see guys flying down the wing and letting one go anymore. Kind of sad.


And of course, the holding and hooking we see which teams are frequently allowed to get away with. This garbage has no place in hockey. If they watched what the NCAA was doing this year eliminating any of that stuff, it's made the college game much better to watch. There's a better pace and more end-to-end skating. It's a clean game. The NHL needs to enforce the same kind of strict rules in this area.


Of course, one can argue that goalies are much better today than a decade ago. Technically and fundamentally, they are. But at the same time, nobody is going to tell me Dwayne Roloson is better than Mike Richter was in his prime. Look at that '94 series they have been airing on MSG every Thursday. Look how much smaller the pads were on Richy and Brodeur and look at the caliber of saves they made. That was the standard of goaltending.

Now, any average goalie can have above average save percentages because of a variety of factors.

This is a crock.


You want to see more exciting play? Then, let's see them make these changes to the rules and you'll see goalies have to actually make more than five good saves.

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Old
11-28-2004, 04:07 AM
  #87
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kovy274Hart
Well, they'd never want it to resemble New Jersey's 1-2-2.

They're best when they can forecheck and outwork the other teams. They also are very aggressive on the PK creating shorthanded chances.

They want to have an attacking style that forces turnovers.
The system Renney has put together is very much a 1-2-2 system and its very much diffrent from the 1-3-1 the Devils and Minnesota are playing.

I also belive its up to McGill&Co. to fix the goalscoring probelms. A system is in the end only a system, what you do when you have the puck under controll and what you do when the oppostion have the puck under controll. I haven´t seen the HWP play this year but I´ve read that they are creating allot of pressure and circling downlow and thats great. Its a common probelm in hockey that the offensive game gets a bit too stereotyped and thats easy to defend against. McGill must be versatile in his thinking, get the team to back of at times and trap some to get the other team up ice because most goals are scored on quick breaks. Also when Tyutin and Drats left they lost their two best defensemen in the transition game.

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Old
11-28-2004, 08:34 AM
  #88
Anthony Mauro
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Serena587
The kid is having a dry spell. It happens. Get over it. He sure as hell won't suck all season, and next month you'll all be talking about what a great player he is. And then I'll laugh. I might not post here, but that doesn't mean I don't read what others post here. I watched him for 2 seasons in Cleveland. I follow the Pack, as well teams that have other former Sharks prospects on their rosters. Wiseman is better than you think. He's also better than what he's showing you right now. Give the guy a break. If Sather thought he wasn't any good, he wouldn't have re-signed him. End of story.
I personally have said, when Chad was doing great, that I dont think he'll make it and last in the NHL. He's a great AHL player, but I think or believe that its gonna stop there. He has nothing to bring to the table other than scoring and if he cant get it done and stay on a top 2 line on the NYR then he'll be a Gernander for us at the worst.

And Sather doesnt have to think a player is good to keep him and re-sign him. Its keeping an asset; it would be bad managing for Sather to let Wiseman go without getting something for him.

So I wont be talking about how great he is after he shakes this "dry spell".

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Old
11-28-2004, 08:37 AM
  #89
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kovy274Hart
This is a misconception. What ruined the game was the moronic rule changes Bettman made.
Thats why I say take the game back to '94 and undo all of the changes Bettman did to this game. He should be fired, I dont know how, so his grubby ass hands dont further mess the game up, although this strike is certainly doing enough.

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Old
11-28-2004, 08:53 AM
  #90
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sjb3599
Really? I thought you had Chad penciled in on the top line with Jagr this year if there was a season?

BTW, I think Giroux has a better chance that Wiseman. That would make for a good board poll...

1. I never penciled anyone in. I said use that spot on the top line to develop players and rotate young players in that spot--whoever plays best gets to play there the next game.

2. Wiseman is underachieving as is the rest of the team

3. Next season it will be much tougher to make the Rangers than it would be this season.

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Old
11-28-2004, 10:20 AM
  #91
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Prucha73
I don't even think this system is modeled after the Devils' system. I think it is supposed to be closer to what teams like Lightnings, Senators, Flames, and Maple Leafs have.
No offense. my friend, but if you were to watch these teams play, you would not list the 'Leafs as an example of a team with a defensive system. The 'Leafs play slightly more defense than the Ragners do. The biggest difference is that they actually work to clear the crease. The 'Leafs dump the puck and send in 3 forecheckers.
The 'Leafs do not play a trapping style.
And now back to your regularly scheduled arguments.....

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Old
11-28-2004, 10:38 AM
  #92
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Quote:
Originally Posted by True Blue
No offense. my friend, but if you were to watch these teams play, you would not list the 'Leafs as an example of a team with a defensive system. The 'Leafs play slightly more defense than the Ragners do. The biggest difference is that they actually work to clear the crease. The 'Leafs dump the puck and send in 3 forecheckers.
The 'Leafs do not play a trapping style.
And now back to your regularly scheduled arguments.....
I was just going to post something similar to this. Thanks.

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Old
11-28-2004, 10:56 AM
  #93
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Quote:
Originally Posted by True Blue
No offense. my friend, but if you were to watch these teams play, you would not list the 'Leafs as an example of a team with a defensive system. The 'Leafs play slightly more defense than the Ragners do. The biggest difference is that they actually work to clear the crease. The 'Leafs dump the puck and send in 3 forecheckers.
The 'Leafs do not play a trapping style.
And now back to your regularly scheduled arguments.....
I know, and it seems like Wolfpack's defense is mostly based of intense backchecking and forwards coming back to help out, not on the trap, that is why I also mentioned Leafs.

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