I think his bench management is proof that he was coaching to develop and not necessarily to win. I'd like to see him resigned with the mandate to win.
Playing Belanger on the PP is developing this team how?
Renney's problem is that he thinks he is smarter than everybody. He thought he was dazzling everybody is his post game pressers with his big vocabulary, but his game management spoke way louder than his words.
Playing Belanger on the PP is developing this team how?
lol, that there is no defense for.... Maybe trying to get some offensive confidence back in his game? I saw zero offensive ability or creativity in Belanger though. That is definitely a head scratcher....
Playing Belanger on the PP is developing this team how?
Renney's problem is that he thinks he is smarter than everybody. He thought he was dazzling everybody is his post game pressers with his big vocabulary, but his game management spoke way louder than his words.
Belanger was easily my least favorite Oiler this year, he was alright on the PK. Every where else he was the blackhole of offence or as coined on hf the belanger triangle.
Realizing your dream vs. hoping that you'll realize your dream and that your team won't suck so that you're never heard from again without fulfilling your dream
Riding planes vs. riding the bus
Getting a chance to show that you can coach and make a difference at the NHL level vs. waiting until Detroit needs a new coach
Taking on a challenge that could end up very rewarding vs. playing it safe and trying not to take on a challenge
I specifically brought up George Burnett because its crystal clear illustration of the exact same thing. A coach that moved up too quickly, thought it was the right opportunity, and the Oilers actually thought at the time they had a group of young players that was going to quickly ride up, and the whole thing crashed into a heap in 38gp, Burnett, a very good coach, never got another sniff at the bigs anywhere. He was defined as NHL bust the rest of his career, nobody gave him a look see.
If your goal is to be an NHL coach Burnett took the wrong road in what is often a longterm lifelong dream. For sure if they offer the job to Nelson he'll take it. But I specifically questioned "should" he take it. You missed that wording in the fine print.
ps "Challenge" "rewarding" lol.
I've learned to stay away from jobs that have the word "challenging" throughout the job description as its often code for: "will deal with cluster**** situations, miscreations, and incompetent hierarchical abomination on at least a daily basis, probably more."
Last edited by Replacement: 04-08-2012 at 10:28 AM.
I want to see Renney back for 1 more year. Eberle himself was quoted as saying he allowed the young guys to make mistakes but gave them allot of leeway and know pressbox situations. I think Hall's, Eberle;s, Nuge's, DD's, and Petry's development has come a long way under Renney's watch.
The owner loves the guy so no, Horcoff is a protected player who should have had his rump kicked to the curb long ago. The fact that to go along with his atrocious contract for term and dollar amount goes the ntc and nmc.
r u serious? OMG. Kevin Lowe, what were you thinking?
Playing Belanger on the PP is developing this team how?
Renney's problem is that he thinks he is smarter than everybody. He thought he was dazzling everybody is his post game pressers with his big vocabulary, but his game management spoke way louder than his words.
I've heard many things about Renney, but this is the first time i've heard someone accuse him of using "big vocabulary" in his post game pressers...
I specifically brought up George Burnett because its crystal clear illustration of the exact same thing. A coach that moved up too quickly, thought it was the right opportunity, and the Oilers actually thought at the time they had a group of young players that was going to quickly ride up, and the whole thing crashed into a heap in 38gp, Burnett, a very good coach, never got another sniff at the bigs anywhere. He was defined as NHL bust the rest of his career, nobody gave him a look see.
If your goal is to be an NHL coach Burnett took the wrong road in what is often a longterm lifelong dream. For sure if they offer the job to Nelson he'll take it. But I specifically questioned "should" he take it. You missed that wording in the fine print.
ps "Challenge" "rewarding" lol.
I've learned to stay away from jobs that have the word "challenging" throughout the job description as its often code for: "will deal with cluster**** situations, miscreations, and incompetent hierarchical abomination on at least a daily basis, probably more."
I tend to agree. going with a newbie is hit and miss. I'd go with someone proven, someone with a ring on their finger as coach. whatever happen to Bob Hartly? Martin assisted the 02 olympic team. Crawford. heck, i'd even give keenan an interview. he didn't do too bad in Calgary.
I don't dislike Renney, and I'm not sure if he needs to go. What more could you do with this roster? He's done a good job with the kids so far, exceptions to Paajarvi and O'Mark, but that's a matter of circumstance. Where do they fit in the line-up?
He played the vets because there was no one else, without burning out the kids by making them play 25 minutes a game.
Defense wasn't strong, goaltending was left out to dry. I'm not sure what to think about Tambellini, I'm on the fence. I'm hoping Lowe goes to Montreal though.
I think jacques matin should be at the top of the 'hire' list.
Dude would've win a cup during that lockout year, and has a VERY impressive list of players he's developed.
Interesting thought, I hadn't even given Martin any thought. He does have a pretty successful track record, took Montreal to the conference finals a few years ago, and perhaps most surprisingly is currently 9th all time in NHL wins with 613. I could get on board with that, actually.
I don't dislike Renney, and I'm not sure if he needs to go. What more could you do with this roster? He's done a good job with the kids so far, exceptions to Paajarvi and O'Mark, but that's a matter of circumstance. Where do they fit in the line-up?
He played the vets because there was no one else, without burning out the kids by making them play 25 minutes a game.
Defense wasn't strong, goaltending was left out to dry. I'm not sure what to think about Tambellini, I'm on the fence. I'm hoping Lowe goes to Montreal though.
I could take or leave Tembellini. Both Hall and RNH were no brainer picks and signing Bulin was a mistake the day he made it.
As for Lowe, I don't know what he even does anymore.
I tend to agree. going with a newbie is hit and miss. I'd go with someone proven, someone with a ring on their finger as coach. whatever happen to Bob Hartly? Martin assisted the 02 olympic team. Crawford. heck, i'd even give keenan an interview. he didn't do too bad in Calgary.
Bob Hartley is coaching in Switzerland, but I think he'd be a fantastic choice for the job. Won a cup with Avs and what he did the Thrashers was pretty good , especially with the stars they had, Kovalchuk,heatley,hossa, all had some of their best years under his guidance, why not Hall,Ebere,RNH, (plus Grigs?).
Haha , guess who plays on his team in Switzerland , Jeff Tambellini, a sign ? lol
Bob Hartley is coaching in Switzerland, but I think he'd be a fantastic choice for the job. Won a cup with Avs and what he did the Thrashers was pretty good , especially with the stars they had, Kovalchuk,heatley,hossa, all had some of their best years under his guidance, why not Hall,Ebere,RNH, (plus Grigs?).
Haha , guess who plays on his team in Switzerland , Jeff Tambellini, a sign ? lol
Some of you who are upset about Renney being let go have extremely short memories. His bench management was horrible, his line combinations were suspect at best, the team has no system in place after 2 full years under his watch and don't have one line combo that can be counted on going into next year.
His tenure with the Rangers in a nutshell as well.
The Oilers need a change at coach and GM. Just my $.02.
They stated that Renney won't be back and the AHL coach in OKC looks to be the guy to replace hime?
Thoughts
Great idea. I stated the same sentiments without knowing what anyone else was saying. Just from looking at the successes of other teams with using non-recycled coaches and that is the Avs, Sens, Panthers, Pens, Canucks etc who used 'new" coaches that have fresh ideas and approaches. There will be some exceptions ie Hitchcock..
That's the big problem with hiring a new coach direct from ahl, does he have the balls to look at tape and say from day one. Shawn Horcoff you are a 4th liner and will never see any pp time and only occasional 2nd tier pk time and tell that to the gm who ust hired him?
Not that long ago Renney was quoted as saying there were going to be big changes in team dynamic next year.
AHL coaches are like nhl backup tenders or backup qb's, beware the highy thought of backup.
He had better have the balls to do that, because if he doesn't it will be his on the chopping block.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Replacement
I specifically brought up George Burnett because its crystal clear illustration of the exact same thing. A coach that moved up too quickly, thought it was the right opportunity, and the Oilers actually thought at the time they had a group of young players that was going to quickly ride up, and the whole thing crashed into a heap in 38gp, Burnett, a very good coach, never got another sniff at the bigs anywhere. He was defined as NHL bust the rest of his career, nobody gave him a look see.
If your goal is to be an NHL coach Burnett took the wrong road in what is often a longterm lifelong dream. For sure if they offer the job to Nelson he'll take it. But I specifically questioned "should" he take it. You missed that wording in the fine print.
ps "Challenge" "rewarding" lol.
I've learned to stay away from jobs that have the word "challenging" throughout the job description as its often code for: "will deal with cluster**** situations, miscreations, and incompetent hierarchical abomination on at least a daily basis, probably more."
I truly believe that the players will be very receptive to him, he is a younger guy, he knows some of the guys from OKC, and the players will be eager to hear from a new voice and hopefully a voice of reason. I also expect to see this team take some steps forward in the next 2 years if the GM has a clue about what he has to do to turn this team into a tougher to play against club and one with far fewer glaring weaknesses.
__________________ Treat Others As You Would Like To Be Treated
He had better have the balls to do that, because if he doesn't it will be his on the chopping block.
Beerfish brings up the perfect point that comes immediately to mind. # veteran coaches have been through the turnstills in recent years and only one of them ever got much out of Horcoffs game. I can't imagine an AHL coach would have much inflluence with some of the established entitlement here.
People still thinking yelling, stomping feet, and cursing out players is going to do anything with this lineup? For the most part the same posters favoring a coaching change, and say Nelson, were in favor of Pat Quinn as headcoach. Who got absolutely tuned out.
Quote:
I truly believe that the players will be very receptive to him, he is a younger guy, he knows some of the guys from OKC, and the players will be eager to hear from a new voice and hopefully a voice of reason. I also expect to see this team take some steps forward in the next 2 years if the GM has a clue about what he has to do to turn this team into a tougher to play against club and one with far fewer glaring weaknesses.
Who cares if he knows some of the young guys from the AHL? Given the composition of this club next season I don't even know how that factors much into the lineup. Maybe Teubert, MPS, Harti.
PLus that with what you just stated it opens up possibilities that a headcoach might have certain comforts with bringing up some AHL plugs. Not exactly something that was popular all the time MacT was putting Reddox out there. Nelson could very well be the type of coach that would give lesser guys toi.
What shocks me the most is that in our rebuild we're willing to take the gamble of taking a team with now several young stars in it, and exposing them to the whim of an untried coach at this level. It seems counterintuitive to do this. Bringing up Nelson is more the type of thing a desperate team, with limited expectations of success, would do.
I think we need a vet coach for young players to develop and guide them. Somebody savvy with the NHL game. I don't think we need somebody that compounds their lack of experience.
I didn't read the whole thread but if Renney sucks so much......how do you explain the team's progress in every statistical category that matters this year? could it be development?? I believe developing the team, the young guns in particular, is his job.
The Barons have been one of the better coached pro hockey teams I've ever watched. Nelson has them run a very simple and effective system which really needs every player to buy in to be effective, and that they do. His player development has been extremely impressive (Teubert, Pitlick, Plante, Hartikainen, Cornet are the best examples), and he has absolutely no problem benching or scratching guys who do not perform. I think he also has a pretty decent eye for talent; he was (I think) the main guy responsible for bringing in Helmer, Yeo, LeNeveu, and probably Keller and Tremblay, all of whom have been solid contributors.
His offensive system is really simple: short, controlled breakout, dump and chase to the strong side, plenty of cycling and a focus on puck movement. Defensively it is a pretty standard setup; he encourages defensemen to be aggressive at the blueline and usually holds a forward high to cover a pinch. Relatively low pressure in the defensive zone, lets a lot of shots go from outside and tries to avoid getting outnumbered down low. Hard forecheck is important to both the defense and the offense, and players play defense from the offensive zone faceoff dots on back. He usually rolls 3 pretty balanced scoring lines (all of whom play defense) and then a goon/checking line for a few minutes a night.
It is very similar to the Blues system and the results are also similar: scoring distributed amongst a bunch of players with no really high scorers, very good defense, great goaltending stats.
I'm not sure if he's ready for the NHL just yet; he's been pretty awesome as a coach everywhere he's been so far, but he's only been coaching for 9 years, 4 of those as an assistant. He'd certainly be an unknown quantity in the NHL and a pretty big risk, but his resume doesn't look very different from Ken Hitchcock's (for example) when he took over the Stars. He seems to run a pretty tight-but-fun ship which the young guys seem to respond to and the vets like/tolerate, but he's also been pretty blessed with some great guys in the locker room in OKC.
I do think that he'll have an NHL coaching offer by the end of next season so they want to keep him in the organization they'll probably need to decide soon if he's their guy.
