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Any interest in Thomas Vanek? Value?

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Old
04-08-2012, 06:56 PM
  #26
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Originally Posted by BLBarmada View Post
Vanek is a goalscorer, I think he tops out at 40, and he's only hit 40 once. And he's making 7.1 M, it's steep, so I would like him, but I wouldnt pay much for him.
but doesn't the "we have the cap space" argument work for vanek too? It's only two more years (I think). Wasn't it artificially inflated to $7m/year only to beat an offer sheet?

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04-08-2012, 08:05 PM
  #27
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Originally Posted by rynryn View Post
but doesn't the "we have the cap space" argument work for vanek too? It's only two more years (I think). Wasn't it artificially inflated to $7m/year only to beat an offer sheet?
Yes, but I think we're better saving that cap space till were ready to contend, and for now, we'll do favors for other teams..

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04-08-2012, 08:10 PM
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Yes Gopher fans...

Should hate the head case that delivered them a National Championship. I dunno, I don't think too many Gophers fans hated Vanek.

As far as us getting Vanek? Nah pass. The term and the size of the deal are ridiculous. No matter how you slice it would be a horrible deal for the Wild.

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04-08-2012, 08:12 PM
  #29
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Originally Posted by LemaireisGOD View Post
Should hate the head case that delivered them a National Championship. I dunno, I don't think too many Gophers fans hated Vanek.

As far as us getting Vanek? Nah pass. The term and the size of the deal are ridiculous. No matter how you slice it would be a horrible deal for the Wild.
I dunno, if we strike out in FA then the contract side of things wouldn't really hurt us too much. I'd be more concerned about Buffalo's asking price.

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04-08-2012, 08:19 PM
  #30
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Out of curiosity, why does Vanek have a reputation for being a head case?

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04-08-2012, 08:26 PM
  #31
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Originally Posted by Sabres Fan UK View Post
Out of curiosity, why does Vanek have a reputation for being a head case?
Not sure. I've never heard such a thing.

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04-08-2012, 08:56 PM
  #32
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Originally Posted by Sabres Fan UK View Post
Out of curiosity, why does Vanek have a reputation for being a head case?
He does?

I haven't heard anything.

But seriously. 1st rounder + Clutter + Bulmer + Haula. Even if we don't get Parise, Vanek would really, really help out our lineup.

Heatley - Koivu - Granlund
Vanek - Cullen - Setoguchi

Then once PMB is ready to come back, put him on the line with Koivu and Heatley, push Granlund in at 2nd line center, and all of a sudden we have two really, really good lines.

This is assuming Latendresse does not get brought back.

I suddenly really, really want Vanek if we can't get Gal or Trouba. Damn you curious Buffalo fans for getting my hopes up

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04-08-2012, 08:57 PM
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Originally Posted by tyratoku View Post
He does?

I haven't heard anything.

But seriously. 1st rounder + Clutter + Bulmer + Haula. Even if we don't get Parise, Vanek would really, really help out our lineup.

Heatley - Koivu - Granlund
Vanek - Cullen - Setoguchi

Then once PMB is ready to come back, put him on the line with Koivu and Heatley, push Granlund in at 2nd line center, and all of a sudden we have two really, really good lines.

This is assuming Latendresse does not get brought back.

I suddenly really, really want Vanek if we can't get Gal or Trouba. Damn you curious Buffalo fans for getting my hopes up

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04-08-2012, 09:11 PM
  #34
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Originally Posted by BuddyMcCormick View Post
My other offer was 1st + Clutter + Bulmer and I was told it was not enough value. Toss in Haula who simply does not have a future on this team.

Clutter, like I said before, collapsed after Schultz was traded. I did not like his game after the trade deadline at all. Clutter is our only guy who could get some great trade value, IMO. Others have said drop him in the future, why not sooner so we could get a dynamic guy like Vanek?

I've never been high on Bulmer, even when he supposedly played so well with the team this fall. I could be totally wrong but I don't see him amounting to all that much.

I'd like either Trouba or Gal with our first rounder, otherwise I'm not really interested in anyone but Teuvo Teravainen, and he looks to be a mid/late first according to most.

Pick up a 2nd with Vanek in our trade, package that new second with the Washington one to move into the late 1st, and we could take a defender or Teuvo. I'd be happy with that.

I'm also crazy(well, not compared when compared to Avder, but compared to most ), so my proposals could be seen as much.

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04-08-2012, 09:16 PM
  #35
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Originally Posted by tyratoku View Post
I'm also crazy(well, not compared when compared to Avder, but compared to most ), so my proposals could be seen as much.
Hey!! I resemble that remark.

I would not mind seeing Clutter moved this offseason for something of value. The guy made me look sane after the trade deadline with the way he did things, and especially after he more or less put us in the box several times for swearing at the ref.

If someone is willing to put up some good draft picks for him before the draft and we can roll those picks and our first into something special, that could be fun. Honestly I would probably do Tyratoku's deal except I think Bulmer might actually be useful as Clutterbucks replacement. Who else could we throw into that spot?

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04-08-2012, 09:26 PM
  #36
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I'm terrible at making trades for good value... so I'm not gonna try and create a proposal... But I'd rather not see the Wild give up any of their top prospects for Vanek.

If the Sabres are willing to take a bad offer for Vanek I'm interested in something involved Setoguchi. I don't really have a problem with Seto... it's just he seems like the piece I'd want to move the most.

Also, if Vanek was on this roster, I'd want him on a line with Granlund. Vanek is a sniper, and having a player like Granlund to feed him in the slot would make for a dangerous line.

I think the Wild finally have a set of prospects worth building a long-term contender with... I think that's the better course of action, even if it means one more year of disappointment...

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Old
04-08-2012, 09:43 PM
  #37
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Originally Posted by tyratoku View Post
My other offer was 1st + Clutter + Bulmer and I was told it was not enough value. Toss in Haula who simply does not have a future on this team.

Clutter, like I said before, collapsed after Schultz was traded. I did not like his game after the trade deadline at all. Clutter is our only guy who could get some great trade value, IMO. Others have said drop him in the future, why not sooner so we could get a dynamic guy like Vanek?

I've never been high on Bulmer, even when he supposedly played so well with the team this fall. I could be totally wrong but I don't see him amounting to all that much.

I'd like either Trouba or Gal with our first rounder, otherwise I'm not really interested in anyone but Teuvo Teravainen, and he looks to be a mid/late first according to most.

Pick up a 2nd with Vanek in our trade, package that new second with the Washington one to move into the late 1st, and we could take a defender or Teuvo. I'd be happy with that.

I'm also crazy(well, not compared when compared to Avder, but compared to most ), so my proposals could be seen as much.
First of all, if the Sabres are going to trade away Vanek they're going to want much more than that in return. If they're trading him away they're admitting that they are going into a rebuild phase. No way they're going to do that with a pretty high first, a checking winger with 20goal ceiling, a duplicate player (with possible greater upside), and a player that has a long way to go to make it to the show. They would be looking to return something more along the lines of our 1st + Phillips (or player of that stature) + a mid prospect like Haula. There's not a snowballs chance in hell the Wild come close to touching something like that.

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Old
04-08-2012, 10:00 PM
  #38
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Originally Posted by BuddyMcCormick View Post
First of all, if the Sabres are going to trade away Vanek they're going to want much more than that in return. If they're trading him away they're admitting that they are going into a rebuild phase. No way they're going to do that with a pretty high first, a checking winger with 20goal ceiling, a duplicate player (with possible greater upside), and a player that has a long way to go to make it to the show. They would be looking to return something more along the lines of our 1st + Phillips (or player of that stature) + a mid prospect like Haula. There's not a snowballs chance in hell the Wild come close to touching something like that.
Someone in their thread on it said they would be lucky to get our first, or a package of Seto/Coyle. I think most Buff fans know he isn't exactly worth his contract right now so they aren't even looking for a package that large. Give up Seto, which hurts but come on, Vanek is elite and a huge upgrade to us for salary and then either Bulmer or Clutterbuck and I would gladly take Vanek on the team, add or subtract a mid pick or two I think that is reasonably close.

Pretty sure the guy saying Vanek was a headcase was referring to Tyler Hirsch. Vanek by all accounts was loved by the coaching staff and players.

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04-08-2012, 10:12 PM
  #39
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Someone in their thread on it said they would be lucky to get our first, or a package of Seto/Coyle. I think most Buff fans know he isn't exactly worth his contract right now so they aren't even looking for a package that large. Give up Seto, which hurts but come on, Vanek is elite and a huge upgrade to us for salary and then either Bulmer or Clutterbuck and I would gladly take Vanek on the team, add or subtract a mid pick or two I think that is reasonably close.

Pretty sure the guy saying Vanek was a headcase was referring to Tyler Hirsch. Vanek by all accounts was loved by the coaching staff and players.
Don't those contradict themselves? Also, this is not what Buffalo fans think he's worth, this is what I think the GM of Buffalo would look to get for him. As I mentioned above, they would be rebuilding and getting A first round draft pick for him isn't going to help that much with a rebuild.

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04-08-2012, 10:15 PM
  #40
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Those who are arguing that Vanek is getting paid too much... I'd like to hear what you think of Koivu and Heatley's cap hits.

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04-08-2012, 10:18 PM
  #41
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Those who are arguing that Vanek is getting paid too much... I'd like to hear what you think of Koivu and Heatley's cap hits.
Heatley is at least getting 2 mil for his interview abilities and quotes.

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04-08-2012, 10:22 PM
  #42
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the only prospects i would be willing to give up at this point are jason zucker and brett bulmer. definitely not the 7th overall this year or where ever we land up. i think the asking price would be too high, but i wouldnt mind him on the team if we could afford him

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04-08-2012, 11:33 PM
  #43
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Originally Posted by BuddyMcCormick View Post
First of all, if the Sabres are going to trade away Vanek they're going to want much more than that in return. If they're trading him away they're admitting that they are going into a rebuild phase. No way they're going to do that with a pretty high first, a checking winger with 20goal ceiling, a duplicate player (with possible greater upside), and a player that has a long way to go to make it to the show. They would be looking to return something more along the lines of our 1st + Phillips (or player of that stature) + a mid prospect like Haula. There's not a snowballs chance in hell the Wild come close to touching something like that.
Oh yeah. A lot of what I see in here are lowball offers, but that's the way of the HF world: you have a bad 40 games, you're worthless, not worth your contract, prospects are better than you, etc. I can say with near certainty that any deal not including Coyle would be a non-starter from Regier's perspective. (And I completely understand why Wild fans wouldn't want to trade him, but you have to understand why we wouldn't trade a proven player like Vanek for second-tier prospects.)

We Sabres fans are down on him because he completely disappeared in the second half--be it because of injuries or any number of other factors. But, at the same time, we don't forget that only two NHL players outscored Vanek in the calendar year 2011. Plus, if Heatley's ice time is any indication, he'd see a lot more ice in Minnesota than he does in Buffalo.

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04-08-2012, 11:36 PM
  #44
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I imagine value is pretty far off. I think Coyle would be very high on their list, and just like the Burns trade doesn't get done without Coyle, I think a Vanek deal would be the same.
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Oh yeah. A lot of what I see in here are lowball offers, but that's the way of the HF world: you have a bad 40 games, you're worthless, not worth your contract, prospects are better than you, etc. I can say with near certainty that any deal not including Coyle would be a non-starter from Regier's perspective. (And I completely understand why Wild fans wouldn't want to trade him, but you have to understand why we wouldn't trade a proven player like Vanek for second-tier prospects.)
Bam. What do I win?

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04-09-2012, 01:53 AM
  #45
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I'd like Vanek here. It would work out pretty well. Vanek comes off in two years. When you think about our young guys they are not going to be super impact players until 2-3 years. Having a Vanek could make a nice transition for them. Then when Vanek and Heatley leave 14 mil in space you can really fine tune who you need to fill spots.

Bulmer, Zucker, Coyle, Phillips, Larrson, maybe Brodin this years pick will all need some AHL time and Lucia is 2 NCAA years and maybe 1 AHL away from making an impact.

I'd love to see Heatley and Vanek on the PP. Throw in Parise, Gilbert and Prosser and you have a WCHA PP.

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04-09-2012, 02:05 AM
  #46
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Oh yeah. A lot of what I see in here are lowball offers, but that's the way of the HF world: you have a bad 40 games, you're worthless, not worth your contract, prospects are better than you, etc. I can say with near certainty that any deal not including Coyle would be a non-starter from Regier's perspective. (And I completely understand why Wild fans wouldn't want to trade him, but you have to understand why we wouldn't trade a proven player like Vanek for second-tier prospects.)

We Sabres fans are down on him because he completely disappeared in the second half--be it because of injuries or any number of other factors. But, at the same time, we don't forget that only two NHL players outscored Vanek in the calendar year 2011. Plus, if Heatley's ice time is any indication, he'd see a lot more ice in Minnesota than he does in Buffalo.
It's not that we don't like Vanek... it's just we've spent an entire 2nd half of the season looking at our prospects lustfully waiting for next year... and now you come in here trying to take them away from us

Also, the Wild have the cap space to go after proven goal-scorers in free agency... without sacrificing prospects in the process. While there aren't exactly loads of players available, the Wild should be able to convince someone to come here that will improve this roster, so I tend to look at it like: Is having Vanek a better option than having a free agent + the prospects we lose in the trade? If we get Parise or Semin (i know nobody likes him here) then the answer is undoubtedly no... the decision is harder as you go down the list...

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Old
04-09-2012, 08:45 AM
  #47
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Trading for Vanek would be a mistake. We're not in that position to add a piece to put us over the top. We're still building this team, and until we have some proven pieces in position, ready to make a run at the cup, we can't be moving fair value for 28 year olds.

Look at Vanek's goal totals: 25-43-36-40-28-32-26

He's hit that point we've talked about before. Goal scorers taper off around 26-28. By the time this team is ready to start contending, he'll be at least 30. That 28-32-26 stretch will likely have settled into 22-26-20. Of course, that's assuming we somehow retain him after his contract is up. The price Buffalo is going to ask is far too high for this team to pay for 2 years of an aging goal scorer. If he were a free agent, I'd love to go after him, but this particular team is not in a position to pay the price to obtain him in trade.

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04-09-2012, 09:35 AM
  #48
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I guess I'll be in the minority in the thought process where I'd like to bring in a true scorer. Don't know if it would be Vanek (sort of lukewarm on a deal regarding him specifically), but I'd like to see a guy who can really put the puck in the net. Not a middling guy like Setoguchi or in that sort of mold. Ideally, I'd like to add to Seto to get that guy. Whether it's a pick or a prospect. I won't name names or anything because I can't say what the value would be for really anyone either way; but I'd still like to see a move done to make this NHL team better.

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Out of curiosity, why does Vanek have a reputation for being a head case?
Well, I wouldn't exactly say headcase; per se.

But those of us who were in college around that time frame I'm sure all heard the same horror stories about what he was doing off the ice. I won't go into detail and state what I haven't personally seen. But based on all times I seen him around; lets just say he liked to hit the bottle often. And hard. Not that he'd be all that different from any other typical college student.

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04-09-2012, 09:56 AM
  #49
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I'd love to see Heatley and Vanek on the PP. Throw in Parise, Gilbert and Prosser and you have a WCHA PP.
Then we get hit by injuries, and our WCHA PP has Taffe and Genoway on it

But back to Vanek. I'd love to have him on the Wild, but it's too early for us to trade for big-name players. We have to be patient, wait until our first wave of prospects starts making an impact, then we can trade for a big piece. The proverbial cupboard is not fully restocked yet to make those kinds of trades.

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04-09-2012, 12:08 PM
  #50
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No interest in Vanek. We're not in a position to be trading away picks and prospects right now. Plus, I guess I still hold it against Vanek a little that he was a headcase when he was with the Gophers.
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I guess I'll be in the minority in the thought process where I'd like to bring in a true scorer. Don't know if it would be Vanek (sort of lukewarm on a deal regarding him specifically), but I'd like to see a guy who can really put the puck in the net. Not a middling guy like Setoguchi or in that sort of mold. Ideally, I'd like to add to Seto to get that guy. Whether it's a pick or a prospect. I won't name names or anything because I can't say what the value would be for really anyone either way; but I'd still like to see a move done to make this NHL team better.



Well, I wouldn't exactly say headcase; per se.

But those of us who were in college around that time frame I'm sure all heard the same horror stories about what he was doing off the ice. I won't go into detail and state what I haven't personally seen. But based on all times I seen him around; lets just say he liked to hit the bottle often. And hard. Not that he'd be all that different from any other typical college student.
Thanks for clearing that up.

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