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EDM/BUF Draft day

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Old
04-22-2013, 10:09 PM
  #1
Chris Cutter
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EDM/BUF Draft day

I have a feeling that with Buffalo acquiring Matt Hackett (who's projected to be a starter in a couple years) in the Pominville deal and the fact that they most likely will go through a rebuild over the next seasons (which would be the smartest thing to do for them IMO along with a complete overhaul of the management).

To Edmonton:
Ryan Miller

To Buffalo:
Devan Dubnyk
Sam Gagner
2014 First Round pick

Why Edmonton does this: Although Devan Dubnyk hasn't been horrible for them over the last two years, I don't think he's a viable option for them long term. Adding a goalie with Miller's talent and resume make them an instant playoff team (they still have to build an identity by adding players with character on their bottom pair and bottom 6 but the talent is there in the top 4 and top 6). Sam Gagner has played well in the last year and a half but I don't think he's their main man with RNH coming along.

Why Buffalo does this: Like I said above, Buffalo should go through a rebuild. They have good young players (Grigorenko, Armia in their prospect pool) and they added a bunch of picks for the upcoming draft. Ryan Miller has shown in the last year that he's not the greatest teammate to have by constantly whining to the media. He's thrown his teammates under the bus for either their play in front of him or the fact that they barely did anything to defend him after the Lucic incident. A change of scenary would do wonders for him. The Sabres' biggest weakness and the reason for their collapse this year was mainly because of their lack of depth down the middle IMO. Adding a player like Sam Gagner fixes that problem and gives them an option for the future. Devan Dubnyk is a decent replacement for a team going through a rebuild and he can carry most of the workload while Hackett gains experience as his back-up.

(Switched it to a 2014 draft pick, I hadn't realized that Edmonton was that low in the standings...)

Discuss.


Last edited by Chris Cutter: 04-22-2013 at 10:19 PM.
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Old
04-22-2013, 10:14 PM
  #2
thefifagod
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Yes without hesitation from a Buffalo perspective. Even if we don't really need Gagner or Dubynk, they can be flipped for extra value. The 2013 1st makes this a no-brainer, getting a pick around the top 5 is too good to turn down for a rebuilding team.

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04-22-2013, 10:15 PM
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Worst proposal of the year right here. I would hardly do Dubnyk straight across for Miller, let alone add pieces. Not to say that Miller isn't a better goalie, of course he is, but he has one year left on his deal, is getting to the age where he will want to win right away, and is kind of a basket case. No thanks on Miller. Miller makes no team an instant playoff team either, despite what the OP says. Hence, his Sabres looking on from the outside.

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04-22-2013, 10:21 PM
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Jack de la Hoya
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chris Cutter View Post
I have a feeling that with Buffalo acquiring Matt Hackett (who's projected to be a starter in a couple years) in the Pominville deal and the fact that they most likely will go through a rebuild over the next seasons (which would be the smartest thing to do for them IMO along with a complete overhaul of the management).

To Edmonton:
Ryan Miller

To Buffalo:
Devan Dubnyk
Sam Gagner
2014 First Round pick

Why Edmonton does this: Although Devan Dubnyk hasn't been horrible for them over the last two years, I don't think he's a viable option for them long term. Adding a goalie with Miller's talent and resume make them an instant playoff team (they still have to build an identity by adding players with character on their bottom pair and bottom 6 but the talent is there in the top 4 and top 6). Sam Gagner has played well in the last year and a half but I don't think he's their main man with RNH coming along.

Why Buffalo does this: Like I said above, Buffalo should go through a rebuild. They have good young players (Grigorenko, Armia in their prospect pool) and they added a bunch of picks for the upcoming draft. Ryan Miller has shown in the last year that he's not the greatest teammate to have by constantly whining to the media. He's thrown his teammates under the bus for either their play in front of him or the fact that they barely did anything to defend him after the Lucic incident. A change of scenary would do wonders for him. The Sabres' biggest weakness and the reason for their collapse this year was mainly because of their lack of depth down the middle IMO. Adding a player like Sam Gagner fixes that problem and gives them an option for the future. Devan Dubnyk is a decent replacement for a team going through a rebuild and he can carry most of the workload while Hackett gains experience as his back-up.

(Switched it to a 2014 draft pick, I hadn't realized that Edmonton was that low in the standings...)

Discuss.

Seems like an overpayment.

(Oh, with a 2014 1st? I guess that's closer, which isn't saying much. Miller is risky for EDM--could easily walk at the end of his contract, and I'm not sure the team is close enough to contending to make that sort of move).


Last edited by Jack de la Hoya: 04-22-2013 at 10:36 PM.
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Old
04-22-2013, 10:26 PM
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s7ark
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Is this a joke? A capable 1A/B goalie, a young C having a career year, and a top 5 pick in a deep draft for Miller?

Oilers will pass on this one, I suspect.

Edit: Pick was changed to 2014 I see. Still an easy no from Edmonton's end.

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04-22-2013, 10:34 PM
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Originally Posted by s7ark View Post
Is this a joke? A capable 1A/B goalie, a young C having a career year, and a top 5 pick in a deep draft for Miller?

Oilers will pass on this one, I suspect.

Edit: Pick was changed to 2014 I see. Still an easy no from Edmonton's end.
Exactly. Like I said, I'd rather have Dubs than Miller right now anyway for a number of reasons. This deal is horrible and doesn't even address the Oilers needs.

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04-22-2013, 10:42 PM
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Yikes.

I wouldn't trade any one of those pieces for Miller let alone all three.

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04-22-2013, 10:48 PM
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Buffalo takes this and runs....

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04-22-2013, 10:50 PM
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This trade only happens if feaster is randomly allowed to run the oilers for a day

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04-22-2013, 10:51 PM
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A goalie is actually pretty far down Edmonton's list of priorities. Dubnyk has been a pretty average NHL goalie this season, which is good enough to get into the playoffs. If Edmonton is trading assets like Gagner or 1st rounders, they're need to be addressing a major weakness in the team. That means adding size to the top 6 forward group or getting a top 4 dman.

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Old
04-22-2013, 11:03 PM
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Originally Posted by dnicks17 View Post
Yikes.

I wouldn't trade any one of those pieces for Miller let alone all three.
Yes you would, this trade is terrible for the Oilers but Miller>>>Dubnyk. Miller is highly underrated on this board and it is almost comical that people who apparently watch hockey as much as some of you do, do not realize having a terrible defense not only allows more shots against but allows many more high quality scoring chances against. Miller would have a much better save percentage behind a better defense. Just saying save percentage is how a goalie should be evaluated is dumbing it down and just not true. Miller will not get a very good young center like Gagner or a top ten pick, but he will likely return a late first rounder and a quality prospect for a team picking in the 20's and looking to improve their goaltending. Also people need to take into consideration that the Sabres will be willing to eat much of Miller's $6 million salary for the upcoming season.

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04-22-2013, 11:09 PM
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Yes you would, this trade is terrible for the Oilers but Miller>>>Dubnyk. Miller is highly underrated on this board and it is almost comical that people who apparently watch hockey as much as some of you do, do not realize having a terrible defense not only allows more shots against but allows many more high quality scoring chances against. Miller would have a much better save percentage behind a better defense. Just saying save percentage is how a goalie should be evaluated is dumbing it down and just not true. Miller will not get a very good young center like Gagner or a top ten pick, but he will likely return a late first rounder and a quality prospect for a team picking in the 20's and looking to improve their goaltending. Also people need to take into consideration that the Sabres will be willing to eat much of Miller's $6 million salary for the upcoming season.
The Oilers would more than likely be able to re-sign Dubnyk at the end of next season. Not a chance they convince Miller to sign on for more time with the dog and pony show.

The one year improvement at goalie isn't really worth it when Krueger probably coaches the Oilers to another bottom 5 finish next season.

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04-22-2013, 11:23 PM
  #13
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Hell no! Take out the first and Gagner and I'd think about it.

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04-22-2013, 11:28 PM
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imagine Miller in the Western conference.

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04-22-2013, 11:47 PM
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Hell no! Take out the first and Gagner and I'd think about it.
You'd think about trading a your goalie straight up for a better goalie? OK.

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04-23-2013, 12:36 AM
  #16
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You'd think about trading a your goalie straight up for a better goalie? OK.
I don't like Dubnyk very much. That being said he's the least of our worries. He's cheaper and younger. Miller is better but his best years are behind him and the guy's crazy.

Miller would go insane if he had to play behind this **** team.

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04-23-2013, 12:36 AM
  #17
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You'd think about trading a your goalie straight up for a better goalie? OK.
They're both gonna be UFAs. A lot of value depends on how likely they are to re-sign.

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04-23-2013, 12:38 AM
  #18
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Originally Posted by Sloth Slothersons View Post
I don't like Dubnyk very much. That being said he's the least of our worries. He's cheaper and younger. Miller is better but his best years are behind him and the guy's crazy.

Miller would go insane if he had to play behind this **** team.
Our team is ****tier. If Vanek wasn't in godmode for the first 10 games of the season we'd be in last place.

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04-23-2013, 12:42 AM
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jumptheshark
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lets compare numbers
15w-17l-2.89gaa-.912sav%-Mill
vs

13w-15l-2.57gaa-.921save%--DD

and the oilers add Gagner and a first?

I would suggest it is a SLIGHT overpayment

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04-23-2013, 12:48 AM
  #20
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how bout if edmonton and buffalo swap this years picks along with this trade and replace gagner with a lesser player

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04-23-2013, 12:55 AM
  #21
nEaLB4ZoD
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lets compare numbers
15w-17l-2.89gaa-.912sav%-Mill
vs

13w-15l-2.57gaa-.921save%--DD

and the oilers add Gagner and a first?

I would suggest it is a SLIGHT overpayment
GAA is pretty much a worthless stat and do I really need to go over the flaw of using save percentage as the end all be all with goalies again? Why do so many average goalies have very good save percentages when they play for a good defensive team? By the way the Sabres are terrible at defense, not just the defensemen but the forwards might be the worst in the league.

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04-23-2013, 01:03 AM
  #22
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Our team is ****tier. If Vanek wasn't in godmode for the first 10 games of the season we'd be in last place.
We've been ****tier longer!!!

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04-23-2013, 01:33 AM
  #23
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Originally Posted by nEaLB4ZoD View Post
GAA is pretty much a worthless stat and do I really need to go over the flaw of using save percentage as the end all be all with goalies again? Why do so many average goalies have very good save percentages when they play for a good defensive team? By the way the Sabres are terrible at defense, not just the defensemen but the forwards might be the worst in the league.
Since when is Edmonton a good defensive team.

Buffalo Defence > Oilers Defence
Miller Save % < Dubnyk Save %

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04-23-2013, 02:02 AM
  #24
nEaLB4ZoD
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Since when is Edmonton a good defensive team.

Buffalo Defence > Oilers Defence
Miller Save % < Dubnyk Save %
I admit I haven't watched nearly enough of the Oilers games (0) this season to know for sure but I can't imagine anyone being worse than the Sabres. Can anyone provide any evidence either way? I do think that if Miller is traded to a contender in thee off-season, I would expect him to have a rebound year and compete for the Vezina.

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04-23-2013, 02:11 AM
  #25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by s7ark View Post
Is this a joke? A capable 1A/B goalie, a young C having a career year, and a top 5 pick in a deep draft for Miller?

Oilers will pass on this one, I suspect.

Edit: Pick was changed to 2014 I see. Still an easy no from Edmonton's end.
My thoughts exactly.

Miller has struggled the past few years. Given his salary, I'd take Dubby over him.

Gagner isn't going anywhere. Without him our depth at center is that of an AHL team.

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