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A Look Ahead: 2012 NHL Entry Draft Pt. 3

View Poll Results: Would you..
Draft Grigorenko. 19 40.43%
Trade the pick. 7 14.89%
Draft a defensemen. 21 44.68%
Voters: 47. You may not vote on this poll

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Old
06-08-2012, 11:22 PM
  #826
thestonedkoala
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Problem with Grigs is he's a top 6 player or nothing.

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06-08-2012, 11:24 PM
  #827
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Quote:
Originally Posted by the8bandarmadillo View Post
Problem with Grigs is he's a top 6 player or nothing.
Where did you get that idea? He's got size...

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06-08-2012, 11:26 PM
  #828
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Everyone is assuming that because of his 'work ethic'. But I'd be glad to have him on our third line.

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06-09-2012, 12:29 AM
  #829
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Id take Grigs at 7 easily

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06-09-2012, 12:40 AM
  #830
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Going back to Shrader's article on our draft tendencies, character issues with Grigorenko as well as questionable competitiveness and consistency is a stark contrast.

Not to mention, business-wise, the Russian factor is always a worry. I rather pick Jacob Trouba, Griffin Reinhart, or Morgan Rielly at #7, and one of them WILL be there.

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06-09-2012, 01:23 AM
  #831
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Grigo needs another CHL year according to Patrick Roy which I agree as well.

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06-09-2012, 01:34 AM
  #832
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Originally Posted by Minnesota View Post
Where did you get that idea? He's got size...
Size doesn't mean everything. Pouliot has size as well.

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06-09-2012, 02:42 AM
  #833
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This turned into a great discussion. You look at the 2 guys he seems to remind people of are Gaborik and Semin. As much as they float they do get goals. Now if Grigorenko turns out to have a fantastic work ethic you could compare him to Malkin with size and talent. Often Semin's name comes up as a negative but the truth is we need goals, and I just think if we pass on him it would be a huge mistake. I know we need defensive depth but there are also other ways to achieve that outside the draft. Now if we could do the proposed washington trade we would have picks 11 and 16. Where if available you could land Maatta and Ceci and you can't deny the potential of those 2. 2 weeks is too far away.

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06-09-2012, 05:05 AM
  #834
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Now if we could do the proposed washington trade we would have picks 11 and 16. Where if available you could land Maatta and Ceci and you can't deny the potential of those 2. 2 weeks is too far away.
I know it's arguing semantics here, but I don't see Maatta and Ceci both being available at 11 AND 16.

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06-09-2012, 08:44 AM
  #835
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Like others have said, I've heard more about Grigs than I've seen. That being said this management regime has done a good job of finding high value in their short history of first round picks. With the value and priority they place on work ethic and character, I'm not going be disappointed if they pick Grigs at 7. I might be surprised but if they feel he is a player that fits their mold, I'll be fine with the pick.

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06-09-2012, 09:52 AM
  #836
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Originally Posted by Victorious Secret View Post
I agree. Unlike most people I'm not opposed to having Semin join the club.


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06-09-2012, 10:53 AM
  #837
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Quote:
Originally Posted by the8bandarmadillo View Post
Size doesn't mean everything. Pouliot has size as well.
True, but size does help.

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Originally Posted by Burns4Norris View Post
I know it's arguing semantics here, but I don't see Maatta and Ceci both being available at 11 AND 16.
Theres a slim possibility one drops. Ceci and Girgensons or Faksa and Lindholm. That could be nice.

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06-09-2012, 11:06 AM
  #838
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A natural left wing, Pouliot is considered the best prospect at his position available in the draft; burst onto the scene to tie for the team scoring lead with the Wolves this season, after failing to make the club in 2003-04; also led all OHL rookies in scoring in 2004-05; has very good size and a projectable frame for the NHL level; owns excellent hockey sense and offensive flair, which should lead to plenty of points at the highest level; is willing to play a physical game; may become a franchise winger if he fills out his frame and proves that 2004-05 was not a fluke.
http://forecaster.thehockeynews.com/...Min&DraftID=10

Quote:
Pouliot is a very talented player who has yet to put it all together at the pro level. An explosive skater with a good handle on the puck and a hard, accurate shot, he has the tools to be a top-line forward in the NHL. Questions about his attitude, commitment to playing defense and consistency have dogged him since turning pro however. If he can master the mental side of the game and learn a more disciplined approach to the game, he could be a top talent. If not, he could find himself playing in Europe.
http://www.hockeysfuture.com/prospects/benoit_pouliot/

Quote:
Benoit Pouliot combines size with an elegant, even graceful skating ability that gives him as big an upside as any forward in the draft. Though not yet a finished product, Pouliot has come further, and faster, than anyone in this year's class. With his speed, vision and passing ability, he can play a finesse game, but he also has the power and disposition to get mean and physical with teams that want to play that way.
http://www.usatoday.com/sports/hocke...e-report_x.htm

That's why I kind of shy away from guys that have problems bringing their game together.

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06-09-2012, 11:09 AM
  #839
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Any one interested in Jake McCabe as our possible second round selection?

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06-09-2012, 11:10 AM
  #840
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It's funny when people hyper-focus on Grigorenko's warts, but then just completely ignore the issues with Trouba, Reilly, Reinhart, or Ceci, or whoever.

Trouba, who I think projects out the best of the Dman who might be available at #7, is pretty much a coin flip of being a top pairing guy, or bottom pairing Prosser like guy. I think he's a safe bet to make the NHL, but it might not be how people like.

Reilly had a major knee injury and was primarily an offensive Dmen before. He's not a top pairing guy. He could easily just be a #6 PP guy, and he could very easily become Tyler Cuma 2.0 with another injury. Best case scenario, he's probably a 2nd pairing guy who can put in a lot of point.

Reinhart isn't necessarily Tyler Meyers. He's got skating issues, which can be exposed badly at the NHL level. Cam Barker. Falk. Foster. Yeah, maybe he turns into Shea Weber, and everybody goes "OMG how did we pass on this guy!!!!!", but that chance is about as high as Grigorenko turning into a superstar.

Ceci has been all over the map in terms of his draft position. He's got issues with defense and consistency, but he's got a high ceiling. But so does Grigorenko.

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06-09-2012, 11:10 AM
  #841
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Quote:
Originally Posted by the8bandarmadillo View Post
That's why I kind of shy away from guys that have problems bringing their game together.
Why do you keep comparing Grigo to Pouliot?

Both are far from being the same kind of players.

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06-09-2012, 11:12 AM
  #842
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Basically, I'm saying that the Dmen in the top-10 this year aren't like the guys in 2008, Doughty, Bogosian, Pietrangelo, and Schenn, who were locks to play in the NHL.

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06-09-2012, 11:16 AM
  #843
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fel 96 View Post
Why do you keep comparing Grigo to Pouliot?

Both are far from being the same kind of players.
Agreed. Pouliot, despite the rankings, was a reach. He was drafted not on his actual point production, which wasn't that special, but of a projection of his skills, if he got stronger and played with more skilled linemates. Scouts saw his puck skills and went OMG this guy is going to score 50 goals, and blamed his lack of production on a bad team.

Grigorenko, on the other hand, as performed everywhere he's played.

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06-09-2012, 11:19 AM
  #844
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Part 1 of 3 of my Draft Articles...

http://www.stateofhockeynews.com/201...efenseman.html

This is the first of 3 articles on who I see the Wild possibly drafting on June 22nd. I don't think we'll get them all obviously, but if I was the Wild's scouting department this is who would be at the top of my short lists at each position.

I still think this team will draft a defenseman in the 1st round unless a forward they really covet falls onto their lap, but IMO the odds favor them drafting a blueliner. Enjoy!

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06-09-2012, 11:55 AM
  #845
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Any one interested in Jake McCabe as our possible second round selection?
Yeah we talked about that a few weeks ago. AFAIK, nearly everyone is for it.

I'm also campaigning for picking up Jordan Schmaltz if McCabe is gone, or if we somehow trade up to snag him.

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06-09-2012, 12:12 PM
  #846
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LemaireisGOD View Post
http://www.stateofhockeynews.com/201...efenseman.html

This is the first of 3 articles on who I see the Wild possibly drafting on June 22nd. I don't think we'll get them all obviously, but if I was the Wild's scouting department this is who would be at the top of my short lists at each position.

I still think this team will draft a defenseman in the 1st round unless a forward they really covet falls onto their lap, but IMO the odds favor them drafting a blueliner. Enjoy!
I hadn't heard much about Olli Maatta, but I really like what you wrote about him. Sounds like he would be a great pick.

I'm loving our draft position right now. Seems like we're almost guaranteed a top-4 defenseman - barring serious injuries, etc.

And his game is comparable to Ryan Suter's. Nice.

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06-09-2012, 12:32 PM
  #847
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What's scouts missed in Pouliot was his complete lack of hockey sense. The negatives were on his work effort, and people just assumed, like some still assume, that Pouliot has the mind for NHL hockey, justifying that with only based on his physical skills.

He doesn't. He doesn't have the brain for hockey. Puck skillz =/= hockey sense. He had the physical. Zero on the mental side of the game.

Now, with Grigorenko, he does actually have a mind for reading the play.

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06-09-2012, 01:09 PM
  #848
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Originally Posted by nickschultzfan View Post
It's funny when people hyper-focus on Grigorenko's warts, but then just completely ignore the issues with Trouba, Reilly, Reinhart, or Ceci, or whoever.

Trouba, who I think projects out the best of the Dman who might be available at #7, is pretty much a coin flip of being a top pairing guy, or bottom pairing Prosser like guy. I think he's a safe bet to make the NHL, but it might not be how people like.

Reilly had a major knee injury and was primarily an offensive Dmen before. He's not a top pairing guy. He could easily just be a #6 PP guy, and he could very easily become Tyler Cuma 2.0 with another injury. Best case scenario, he's probably a 2nd pairing guy who can put in a lot of point.

Reinhart isn't necessarily Tyler Meyers. He's got skating issues, which can be exposed badly at the NHL level. Cam Barker. Falk. Foster. Yeah, maybe he turns into Shea Weber, and everybody goes "OMG how did we pass on this guy!!!!!", but that chance is about as high as Grigorenko turning into a superstar.

Ceci has been all over the map in terms of his draft position. He's got issues with defense and consistency, but he's got a high ceiling. But so does Grigorenko.
it's not the wart, it's the location. one thing we know Yeo and Fletcher hate is a guy who doesn't work hard. Minnesotans in general appreciate the "earn it" kind of attitude (like Lats has his stint here) and not so much the "i'm really great, if the coach would just put me on a scoring line I'd show everyone but until then I'll just pout" attitude that Pou had. It's just reports or rumours about Grig but if there is any truth to them it doesn't sound like we'd take him. depends on how they feel about him at the combine, i guess. So what if Grig can turn into a superstar, but only after the age of 25. By then he can just flee to russia--not a pleasant option for a guy like Pou but very attractive for Grig. That's the russian factor. NA guys are more prone to just suck it up and grind it out here if they feel they're misused but euros--esp. russian or eastern europeans--can go home easily if they get too frustrated or impatient.

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06-09-2012, 02:30 PM
  #849
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Minnesota View Post
I hadn't heard much about Olli Maatta, but I really like what you wrote about him. Sounds like he would be a great pick.

I'm loving our draft position right now. Seems like we're almost guaranteed a top-4 defenseman - barring serious injuries, etc.

And his game is comparable to Ryan Suter's. Nice.
Olli Maata is projected to be a pretty safe pick. His midterm ranking was nice and only improved as the year went by. Olli has been rumored to possibly go in the top 10. I'd think that hes definitely top 15 material. He already has some very nice size, at 6.01 and 200 pounds. He has good body positioning, but he doesn't play a physical game. His offensive upside is questionable. Surprised you hadn't heard of him considering he has been a high projected pick all year.

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06-09-2012, 03:10 PM
  #850
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Any one interested in Jake McCabe as our possible second round selection?

hell yes, I would consider trading up late into the 1st to get him if he was still there too.


And Grigorenko doesn't have the makeup that this regime wants in a player.

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