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Warmington: Burke tarnishing Leafs' brand

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Old
04-11-2012, 01:04 PM
  #126
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So what????? Thanks for the trivia answer!! But so what??? What's your point?
The point is pretty obvious. Brian Burke has produced the worst results in club history and should be canned for his performance

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04-11-2012, 01:11 PM
  #127
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Lol, Warmington.

What a putz.


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04-11-2012, 01:12 PM
  #128
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didn't read the article, but this is getting ridiculous.
i'm dissapointed as the next fan, and blame burke for some of the moves (LACK) but the ribbing he's been getting is out of hand.

give the guy a couple of more years, there's some light at the end of the tunnel, this team will get a lot better with a few on ice personnel changes. We are very close.

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04-11-2012, 01:12 PM
  #129
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That's okay, think about the customer but just don't be stupid enough to let them dictate what you do.
They want to run a successful business and finishing in the bottom 5 of the league standings 2 of the past 3 seasons is not considered "winning" by definition.

So if "winning is the goal" of ownership, and they replace the GM in that process, which has failed to deliver on expectations, is that considered what MLSE wanted to do or is that customer dictated?

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04-11-2012, 01:14 PM
  #130
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Sure we have had GMs for longer than four years since 1967. However, Burke is the only one to miss the playoffs four years in a row since the Leafs came into existence. In fact none had even missed three prior to Burke.
You say that like making the playoffs during the first 3 years of Burke's tenure was remotely possible... and that simply making the playoffs should be our ultimate goal.

You sound like someone that would have been happy to move our first and whatever prospects we have in the cupboard to get a couple 30+ year olds so we could have squeezed in.

This was the first year under Burke that we had a chance at the playoffs and we came up short. We are (by 3 months) the second youngest team in the league and don't have a number 1 centre. Our goalie was playing very well until he suffered that concussion. The fact that we were as high in the standings as we were on Feb 6 is mind-blowing.

Also, why even bring up the pre-cap years? Building a team back then vs now is completely different due to the restraints the cap puts on teams and the long term penalties involved with giving out bad contracts. Burke had a mess on his hands when he took over the Leafs and I'm stunned that people refuse to acknowledge that this team now has direction and has improved in several key areas (old core removed for young core, farm system vs no prospects) since he took over.

I find it absolutely ridiculous that folks focus on simply making the playoffs instead of building something that has the potential to go deep into the playoffs.

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04-11-2012, 01:18 PM
  #131
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I don't want to lynch him. I just want him gone. He has earned it.
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The point is pretty obvious. Brian Burke has produced the worst results in club history and should be canned for his performance
But he's not gone and isn't going. SO are you just going to keep repeating the same thing over and over and over and over and just annoy and frustrate alot of people over something that will not and did not happen????

You've stated yourpoint so many times and posted quotes and everyone is quite clear on your stance so why just keep bring up the same thing!!

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04-11-2012, 01:20 PM
  #132
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You say that like making the playoffs during the first 3 years of Burke's tenure was remotely possible... and that simply making the playoffs should be our ultimate goal.

You sound like someone that would have been happy to move our first and whatever prospects we have in the cupboard to get a couple 30+ year olds so we could have squeezed in.

This was the first year under Burke that we had a chance at the playoffs and we came up short. We are (by 3 months) the second youngest team in the league and don't have a number 1 centre. Our goalie was playing very well until he suffered that concussion.

Also, why even bring up the pre-cap years? Building a team back then vs now is completely different due to the restraints the cap puts on teams and the long term penalties involved with giving out bad contracts. Burke had a mess on his hands when he took over the Leafs and I'm stunned that people refuse to acknowledge that this team now has direction and has improved in several key areas (old core removed for young core, farm system vs no prospects) since he took over.

I find it absolutely ridiculous that folks focus on simply making the playoffs instead of building something that has the potential to go deep into the playoffs.
Well the problem is that Burke set the expectations and making the playoffs was part of the plan. Waiting five or six years to be competitive was not part of the plan as he described it. So the reaction is in response to what he promised but did not deliver.

"I'm not interested ... in a five-year rebuild like some of these teams have done," said Burke. "Maybe because of my age, maybe just because I know it doesn't have to be five years because it wasn't in Anaheim.

"I like the group that finished the year, I think just on internal improvement we will be better. I think we will be good enough with this group and a couple additions to say in training camp that the playoffs are a reasonable goal."

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04-11-2012, 01:22 PM
  #133
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Sure we have had GMs for longer than four years since 1967. However, Burke is the only one to miss the playoffs four years in a row since the Leafs came into existence. In fact none had even missed three prior to Burke.
not trying to turn this into a who would you hire debate, but answer it.

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04-11-2012, 01:25 PM
  #134
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not trying to turn this into a who would you hire debate, but answer it.
Ken Holland.

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04-11-2012, 01:26 PM
  #135
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Mail and they also have Edelivery available.
But that doesn't make them a national newspaper. I'm pretty sure that I could live in anywhere in Canada (and probably in the world) and get the Brockville Recorder and Times mailed to me (as a subscription) but that doesn't make it a national newspaper.

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04-11-2012, 01:27 PM
  #136
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Ken Holland.
So, out of available candidates, who would you hire?

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04-11-2012, 01:28 PM
  #137
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Ken Holland.
ok, now for a realistic answer

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04-11-2012, 01:30 PM
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So, out of available candidates, who would you hire?
Ken Holland. Same way they got Burke when he was GM in Anaheim and not available.

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04-11-2012, 01:30 PM
  #139
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Well the problem is that Burke set the expectations and making the playoffs was part of the plan. Waiting five or six years to be competitive was not part of the plan as he described it. So the reaction is in response to what he promised but did not deliver.

"I'm not interested ... in a five-year rebuild like some of these teams have done," said Burke. "Maybe because of my age, maybe just because I know it doesn't have to be five years because it wasn't in Anaheim.

"I like the group that finished the year, I think just on internal improvement we will be better. I think we will be good enough with this group and a couple additions to say in training camp that the playoffs are a reasonable goal."

So if had of said..."I plan to do a full rebuild and in 5 years and plan to be in the playoffs" Would you be here next year crying about what he said if it didn't happen and it would take longer?

You keep harping on what he said. A lot of times things donot go according to plan.
Seriously.....Get over it. Your postings sound like a broken record and no one really cares that you want Burke gone.

I want him to stay so he's staying.

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04-11-2012, 01:33 PM
  #140
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But that doesn't make them a national newspaper. I'm pretty sure that I could live in anywhere in Canada (and probably in the world) and get the Brockville Recorder and Times mailed to me (as a subscription) but that doesn't make it a national newspaper.
I didn't say it was a National paper. I said it was delivered and available across Canada in response to the implication that only people in Toronto read it.

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04-11-2012, 01:35 PM
  #141
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this turd has no sources ...i guess he needed a break from bashing Cops, and decided to bash the Leafs instead

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04-11-2012, 01:36 PM
  #142
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The point is pretty obvious. Brian Burke has produced the worst results in club history and should be canned for his performance
IMO you have to be careful here. Just to say he's produced the worst results isn't saying a lot. We have a different structured league now, and if he was building assets through the draft properly he has all the reason in the world to have history's worst record.

What I see is a poorly thought out patch job, which is a hybrid of rushing and foresight. I think giving him one more year to improve is reasonable.

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04-11-2012, 01:36 PM
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So if had of said..."I plan to do a full rebuild and in 5 years and plan to be in the playoffs" Would you be here next year crying about what he said if it didn't happen and it would take longer?

You keep harping on what he said. A lot of times things donot go according to plan.
Seriously.....Get over it. Your postings sound like a broken record and no one really cares that you want Burke gone.

I want him to stay so he's staying.
It's called accountability. If the team was steadily improving he would have something to stand on but the team has not improved at all and hist draft day (July 1st) has been nothing short of a disaster.

He spouts off about having the most 1st round picks in the NHL but fails to point out that he is including Connolly, Komisarek and Steckel. Not so impressive when you start breaking down Burke's claims and promises.

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04-11-2012, 01:38 PM
  #144
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Ken Holland. Same way they got Burke when he was GM in Anaheim and not available.
alrrighttyyy then "Ive had so much success in detriot, that i decided to up and leave out of nowhere to take a job with the Leafs"

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04-11-2012, 01:38 PM
  #145
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The Leafs are on the cusp of new owners. These new owners are media companies. Burke will likely tie the proverbial can to himself if he keeps up his hostilities with the media.
Really? Kinda like John Tortorella, the NHL's most outspoken and media-loathing coach, in New York? You know the Rangers' ownership structure, right?

The hostilities are with the garbage the Sun writes about, and goes back to the days when Burke proclaimed the Sun is good if you have a puppy or a parrot.

Notice how Burke had an ongoing spat with Berger? Who is still employed? Like Berger, Simmons et al have made this personal. It's not about journalism; it is about evening scores.

The Sun has an company-wide vendetta against Burke because he doesn't kiss ass. It's not like he just became this abrasive guy that speaks his mind when he arrived here. He's always been that way.

See, DiManno, who could write circles around Simmons and Wamington, can blame Burke without resorting to obvious vendettas. Not only that, it is well-written.

DiManno:

http://www.thestar.com/sports/leafs/...nd-goaltending

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Muscle, menace and goaltending are top of the shopping list for the off-season, though Burke intends to rectify via trades rather than chasing free agents, and he won’t be sacrificing draft picks to fill his cart. There are sufficient assets, he claims, to swap for the bodies he wants, difficult as it is to see where those assets lie unless he’s referring to the young players so painstakingly assembled in the Leafs system and the handful of big-team scrubeenies such as Jake Gardiner — “a revelation to us” — who really did knock it out of the ballpark.

Several of his major moves proved wrong-headed. But Phil Kessel did have a career season and Joffrey Lupul turned out an unexpected gem. In retrospect, Burke gambled incorrectly in not obtaining a mature netminder to stamp out the conflagration between the pipes, though he did try to make that deal at the trade deadline, not liking the price attached.

The other C bandied about, caustically, is the one on Dion Phaneuf’s sweater. I remain convinced that was a poor decision. The captaincy should be earned, not invested by management on a newcomer. But in a trying season, a crucible season, Phaneuf improved immensely in the media aspect of his role. Further, whatever the caterwauling about his leadership deficiencies, this was not a divided locker room. There were no cliques, no internal divisions.

What fans got instead was that corporate apology in Toronto newspapers on Monday from Maple Leaf Sports and Entertainment chairman Larry Tanenbaum. When then-Raptors GM Glen Grunwald took to the microphone and apologized from centre court for a wretched season, it felt sincere. This doesn’t. It’s actually icky, perhaps a nadir in Burke’s career, though he echoed the sentiments at his press conference.


Burke persists in the view that the Leafs have “put some building blocks in place” and won’t be starting from scratch in rebuild mode. “It’s very hard to see that today but . . . the keys you need, the Phil Kessels, the Joffrey Lupuls, the Jake Gardiners, the Dion Phaneufs, the second line, all those things have been put in place. And that’s what can’t be overlooked when you analyze and dissect the season, even a season that’s marked by failure.”


So the Sun goes on and on about thsi full page ad, and how it tells the story of how crummy a job Burke is doing. Three full pages of the Sun are hatchet jobs on Burke.

Even Cox feels the MLSE apology was insincere:

http://thestar.blogs.com/thespin/201...ry-season.html

Quote:
Sorry, I don't understand what they're saying sorry for.

Which also means I don't believe MLSE is sorry about anything, and its hard to be believe anyone would take this corporate press release as something either meaningful or necessary. That it was delivered not in person but rather by type underscores the reality that it means little. Actually, less than little.

To me, an apology like that offered today in full newspaper expression was something that was necessary after the sex scandal was totally unveiled at Maple Leaf Gardens.

Just don't see what the Leafs have to be sorry about.

These are the facts, folks. A large group of well-meaning, well-paid, well-intentioned hockey people spared no expense in organizing and training a team for the 2011-12 season, a very young team that most industry observers believed was destined to miss the Stanley Cup playoffs because it lacked both sufficient talent at key positions and experience and because teams at this stage of development generally don't make the playoffs.

If I were a Leaf fan, I'd be offended by this corporate missive disguised as sincerity. The only thing Tanenbaum should be sorry about is paying a PR flack or consultant to come up with this pointless corporate strategy. Don't tell me you're sorry. Offer me a refund. Or tell me how it went wrong in meaningful detail and what organizational and personnel changes you're going to make to deal with the problem

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04-11-2012, 01:39 PM
  #146
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IMO you have to be careful here. Just to say he's produced the worst results isn't saying a lot. We have a different structured league now, and if he was building assets through the draft properly he has all the reason in the world to have history's worst record.

What I see is a poorly thought out patch job, which is a hybrid of rushing and foresight. I think giving him one more year to improve is reasonable.
I think giving him one more year is dangerous. As a GM gets closer to the hot seat he will make desperation moves that will likely be of the short term fix variety with long term negative consequences.

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04-11-2012, 01:40 PM
  #147
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alrrighttyyy then "Ive had so much success in detriot, that i decided to up and leave out of nowhere to take a job with the Leafs"
Stop feeding it. It has no idea how they got Burke from Anaheim.

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04-11-2012, 01:42 PM
  #148
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Really? Kinda like John Tortorella, the NHL's most outspoken and media-loathing coach, in New York? You know the Rangers' ownership structure, right?

The hostilities are with the garbage the Sun writes about, and goes back to the days when Burke proclaimed the Sun is good if you have a puppy or a parrot.

Notice how Burke had an ongoing spat with Berger? Who is still employed? Like Berger, Simmons et al have made this personal. It's not about journalism; it is about evening scores.

The Sun has an company-wide vendetta against Burke because he doesn't kiss ass. It's not like he just became this abrasive guy that speaks his mind when he arrived here. He's always been that way.

See, DiManno, who could write circles around Simmons and Wamington, can blame Burke without resorting to obvious vendettas. Not only that, it is well-written.

DiManno:

http://www.thestar.com/sports/leafs/...nd-goaltending



So the Sun goes on and on about thsi full page ad, and how it tells the story of how crummy a job Burke is doing. Three full pages of the Sun are hatchet jobs on Burke.

Even Cox feels the MLSE apology was insincere:

http://thestar.blogs.com/thespin/201...ry-season.html

I know the Rangers structure well. I have never seen GM Sather in Newsday or anywhere else calling the media ******** etc.

Burke has ongoing feuds with more than the Sun writers. He even went after Don Cherry and for a while boycotted HNIC.

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04-11-2012, 01:44 PM
  #149
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Why should they refund anything to the season ticket holders? Was there something in the agreement that the purchaser signed that wasn't delivered?
No. It's called customer service. Stand behind your product, don't write a cheesy "John Doe" letter. Or do nothing at all. You think if the Leafs had a 100 point season, ticket prices wouldn't be going up next year?

Say you're sorry with actions. Put your money where your mouth is. It is far more sincere.

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04-11-2012, 01:47 PM
  #150
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It's called accountability. If the team was steadily improving he would have something to stand on but the team has not improved at all and hist draft day (July 1st) has been nothing short of a disaster.

He spouts off about having the most 1st round picks in the NHL but fails to point out that he is including Connolly, Komisarek and Steckel. Not so impressive when you start breaking down Burke's claims and promises.

He is accountable to you? He's not!!!...Don't buy what he's selling, don't buy the product, and tune out!! And please show me a link where Burke has made promises?

He has made statements, but never a promise to anyone. If he personally made a promise to YOU I can see why you want him gone.

But you can't break promises if you don't make any.

Even if he did..Promises are meant to be broken. Burke stays.


Last edited by OlderTimer*: 04-11-2012 at 01:54 PM.
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