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Warmington: Burke tarnishing Leafs' brand

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04-11-2012, 01:47 PM
  #151
Leafsman
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Originally Posted by Gatorade View Post
I know the Rangers structure well. I have never seen GM Sather in Newsday or anywhere else calling the media ******** etc.

Burke has ongoing feuds with more than the Sun writers. He even went after Don Cherry and for a while boycotted HNIC.
So what????? He's not going to get fired over it! Why keep bringing it up? What is it to you?? Did he call you a name??

Why keep bringing up everything Burke has done like it is going to change anything???

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04-11-2012, 01:55 PM
  #152
veedubn1
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Originally Posted by Gatorade View Post
Well the problem is that Burke set the expectations and making the playoffs was part of the plan. Waiting five or six years to be competitive was not part of the plan as he described it. So the reaction is in response to what he promised but did not deliver.

"I'm not interested ... in a five-year rebuild like some of these teams have done," said Burke. "Maybe because of my age, maybe just because I know it doesn't have to be five years because it wasn't in Anaheim.

"I like the group that finished the year, I think just on internal improvement we will be better. I think we will be good enough with this group and a couple additions to say in training camp that the playoffs are a reasonable goal."
He never PROMISED anything. He said the playoffs were a reasonable goal. Read the quotes you put up. He didn't need a five year re-build in Anaheim and as a result he knew there was more than one way to go about building a champion and was hopeful he could pull it off here in Toronto.

Burke set the expectations of folks who don't know how to think for themselves. Burke knew this team needed to be active in the free agent market to be successful.. and that hasn't worked out because VERY few quality free agents have hit the market in the past 5 years.

Top free agents since 09/10 (Burke was hired by the Leafs in November 2008)


Hossa
Gaborik
Havlat
Volchenkov
B.Richards
Vokoun

That's everyone who can be considered a #1 goalie, top 3 forward, top 2 defenseman... and you can't even say that about Havlat any longer (Vokoun wasn't that hot this year either).

I strongly urge you to look at the big picture and stop focusing on simply making the playoffs or some predictions (not promises) Burke made when he arrived.

The Leafs are in a much better position now to build long term than when Burke first arrived on the scene. That's a fact.

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04-11-2012, 01:57 PM
  #153
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Originally Posted by Gatorade View Post
Sure we have had GMs for longer than four years since 1967. However, Burke is the only one to miss the playoffs four years in a row since the Leafs came into existence. In fact none had even missed three prior to Burke.
Really?

When did the Leafs make the playoffs in 2006, 2007 or 2008 with Ferguson in charge?

But hey, keep making stuff up. It makes your argument look better.

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04-11-2012, 01:57 PM
  #154
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building a hockey team isnt easy. its just funny to listen to all the kiddies "firez burke cuz we dont win hockey gamez" while forgetting that hes taken a turd of a prospect pool and turned it into something useful and fruitful. the leafs roster will get better with time. it was the prospect issue to me that was the most important to address before this team goes where it needs to go.Burkes not the issue here. its the fans impatience and media needing to create drama to sell papers. thats it. just let the man do his job.

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04-11-2012, 01:58 PM
  #155
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Originally Posted by Holy Mackinaw View Post
No. It's called customer service. Stand behind your product, don't write a cheesy "John Doe" letter. Or do nothing at all. You think if the Leafs had a 100 point season, ticket prices wouldn't be going up next year?

Say you're sorry with actions. Put your money where your mouth is. It is far more sincere.
Giving back $$$ is not customer service. That's bad business. If season ticket holders are so pissed off they simply don't have to renew their subscriptions.

If you eat at a restaurant and didn't enjoy the food - do you demand 10% off your bill? Or do you do what the rest of us in the normal world does which is find somewhere else to eat?

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04-11-2012, 01:59 PM
  #156
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Originally Posted by veedubn1 View Post
A 10% refund? Did someone hold a gun to their heads and tell them they had to purcahse season tickets? Get real.

Fire a GM because the fans are uneasy? I guess the Rangers should have fired Glen Sather 5 years ago when the Rangers were really bad.. because trusting their decision to hire Sather and sticking to his plan certainly hasn't yielded any positive results... oh wait.
You do realize I am a Burke supporter, right?

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04-11-2012, 02:01 PM
  #157
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And this my friends is why I haven't bought a paper in 10 years. Sensationalist BS. They are running out of ideas to talk about so they keep recycling (no pun intended) the same cookie cutter crap as every other publication out there.

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04-11-2012, 02:01 PM
  #158
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Originally Posted by Gatorade View Post
I think giving him one more year is dangerous. As a GM gets closer to the hot seat he will make desperation moves that will likely be of the short term fix variety with long term negative consequences.
Unless he's not on the hot seat... which Burke isn't.

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04-11-2012, 02:04 PM
  #159
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Originally Posted by Hyperglide View Post
And this my friends is why I haven't bought a paper in 10 years. Sensationalist BS. They are running out of ideas to talk about so they keep recycling (no pun intended) the same cookie cutter crap as every other publication out there.

12 years for me, now I don't even pick one up as they are free a lot of the time. Just a waste of good trees.

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04-11-2012, 02:08 PM
  #160
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gatorade View Post
I know the Rangers structure well. I have never seen GM Sather in Newsday or anywhere else calling the media ******** etc.

Burke has ongoing feuds with more than the Sun writers. He even went after Don Cherry and for a while boycotted HNIC.
No, but have you seen Sather's coach?

Oh, and Burke is the first one to ever do that with CBC and Cherry.

But can I see the link where he called the media " ********* etc"? I must have missed that.

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04-11-2012, 02:08 PM
  #161
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Originally Posted by Gatorade View Post
I didn't say it was a National paper. I said it was delivered and available across Canada in response to the implication that only people in Toronto read it.
My apology. It was birddog who originally called it a national newspaper. But I wouldn't call getting the paper by mail "delivery" because by that logic, small town newspaers from Scotland are delivered around the world.

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04-11-2012, 02:09 PM
  #162
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Ridiculous.

This is just piling on, selling papers, etc…

And there is an obvious grudge in the writing...
100% this. Pretty obvious, if you ask me.

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04-11-2012, 02:12 PM
  #163
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Originally Posted by Leafsman View Post
Burke's performance???? What about Nonis, Fletcher, Dudley, Loiselle, Allaire, Wilson, CArlyle, Assistant Coach's, Phanuef, Komi, Kessel, Lupul. Bozak, Grabo, Kule, Connolly, Armstrong............................

Burke iced the team.. The performance falls on the player!

Should Connolly not apologize for signing a sizeable contract and not living up to even partof it?

Should Armstrong not apologize for not fulfilling his end of the contract!


Etc, etc...

Why shoudl Burke apologize for everything and be the sole benficiary of an entire nation's anger!

That team shoudl have performed far better than they did! Most of our blame has been directed at Burke when most of it shoudl be directed at players who didn;t do their end!

Tired of all this whipping boy mentality of Leafs Nation! The blame and fault never goes to teh people responsible it just gets concentrated and targeted on whoever is easiest! Hard to keep blaming a lot of people so let's just focus it on one!

Komi shoudl have been a great signing but he **** the bed!!!

Armstrong was a good signiong but he got injured and called her quits!

Connolly decided to grab a contract and then play occassionally when he felt like it!


I am not excusing his role in this meltdown but jesus christ, let's think rationally and target the blame where it rightfully belongs and not all of it belongs in the lap of Burke. He iced the team but that is all he can do!! He can't go Weekend at Bernie's and control these guys withlevers and pulleys to ensure they live up to their end!
And all of these FAs had a gun to Burkie's head when they forced him to sign them.

I guess in Burkie's case, to paraphrase Harry S. Truman, the buck does not stop there, as it never reaches him.

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04-11-2012, 02:14 PM
  #164
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Originally Posted by veedubn1 View Post
Sooo we haven't won a cup since 67 and we've never had a GM that lasted longer than 4 years.

Coincidence?
Great comeback... except that he was talking about making the playoffs, not winning the Cup.

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04-11-2012, 02:15 PM
  #165
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Originally Posted by veedubn1 View Post
Giving back $$$ is not customer service. That's bad business. If season ticket holders are so pissed off they simply don't have to renew their subscriptions.

If you eat at a restaurant and didn't enjoy the food - do you demand 10% off your bill? Or do you do what the rest of us in the normal world does which is find somewhere else to eat?
If you pay full price for a meal you didn't enjoy , that's your problem.

Anyway, if you ready my rationale, I am not saying MLSE "should" give a refund. I am saying their letter sounded insincere. It was a hypothetical, if they were so sorry, offer a refund...but we know MLSE would never do that.

That letter was shallow and reeked of desperation.


Last edited by Holy Mackinaw: 04-11-2012 at 02:22 PM.
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04-11-2012, 02:19 PM
  #166
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Originally Posted by veedubn1 View Post
Giving back $$$ is not customer service. That's bad business.
Really? A month ago Rogers accidently shut down my internet and phone for a day. It took 24 hours to restore and I called and complained.

I didn't get a letter of apology from Rogers. I got $70 off my bundle package for the next year, which is over $800. I was originally pissed off. Now I am am quite happy.


Explain to me how that is bad business?

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04-11-2012, 02:23 PM
  #167
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Originally Posted by OlderTimer View Post
He is accountable to you? He's not!!!...Don't buy what he's selling, don't buy the product, and tune out!! And please show me a link where Burke has made promises?

He has made statements, but never a promise to anyone. If he personally made a promise to YOU I can see why you want him gone.

But you can't break promises if you don't make any.

Even if he did..Promises are meant to be broken. Burke stays.


And I thought you were a trustworthy fellow.

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04-11-2012, 02:28 PM
  #168
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I guess when his medium's brand is known for the Sunshine Girl, I just really find it hard to accept Warmington calling out Burke's class.

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04-11-2012, 02:29 PM
  #169
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Originally Posted by beauchamp View Post
And all of these FAs had a gun to Burkie's head when they forced him to sign them.

I guess in Burkie's case, to paraphrase Harry S. Truman, the buck does not stop there, as it never reaches him.
What in the hell does that mean?? Because they didn't force Burke to sign them they are excused for not living up to their contract.

Burke lived up to his end of their contract, time for some blame to be on the players that didn't live up to theirs!

Like I said, Burke has to SHARE in the blame but shoudl not shoulder the brunt of it! It was an organizational and team failure! Butlet's face it! They missed the playoffs, they didn't go 0 for 82! SO lets not get all bent out of shape!

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04-11-2012, 02:32 PM
  #170
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Originally Posted by Holy Mackinaw View Post
Really? A month ago Rogers accidently shut down my internet and phone for a day. It took 24 hours to restore and I called and complained.

I didn't get a letter of apology from Rogers. I got $70 off my bundle package for the next year, which is over $800. I was originally pissed off. Now I am am quite happy.


Explain to me how that is bad business?
They did that because you are paying for a service you didn't receive and that is good business. Paying to watch a hockey game is a different service where it doesn't matter if they win or they lose, regardless what the outcome of the game is you aren't entitled to a refund. What you are paying for is to watch them play, that's it.

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04-11-2012, 02:38 PM
  #171
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Originally Posted by Leafsman View Post
What in the hell does that mean?? Because they didn't force Burke to sign them they are excused for not living up to their contract.

Burke lived up to his end of their contract, time for some blame to be on the players that didn't live up to theirs!

Like I said, Burke has to SHARE in the blame but shoudl not shoulder the brunt of it! It was an organizational and team failure! Butlet's face it! They missed the playoffs, they didn't go 0 for 82! SO lets not get all bent out of shape!
I'm quite sure there's a "not" or a "?" missing in that sentence.

But back to the subject at hand.

It means that Burke is not to be excused for signing players who would do that, or to sign players that are not as good as he thought they were (bad evaluation).

By your argument, Fletcher should not be held responsible for signing Finger, or Gainey for obtaining Gomez...


Last edited by beauchamp: 04-11-2012 at 02:41 PM. Reason: Spelling
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04-11-2012, 02:39 PM
  #172
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Stopped reading when it became a "Lord's name in vain" argument.
Pretty much. It's pathetic pandering to the papers base.

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04-11-2012, 02:41 PM
  #173
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Originally Posted by beauchamp View Post
I'm quite sure there's a "not" or a "?" missing in that sentence.

But back to the subject at hand.

It means that Burke is not to be excused for signing players who would do that, or to sign players that are not as good as he thought they were (bad evaluation).

By your argument, Fletcher should not be held responsible for signing Fingers, or Gainey for obtaining Gomez...
Maybe work on your comprehension there!! I never said they shouldn't be blamed, I specifically said they shoudl share the blame!

Too much blame being put on Burke with not enough going to players and coach's! Burke is not solely responsible for the collapse as for 60 games they were a playoff team meaning they had the potential Burke can only ice the potential, he can't force players and coach's to reach it. But that is still not an excuse for Burke as he has to share in the responsibility also for the crash!

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04-11-2012, 02:46 PM
  #174
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Does The Sun have a weekly quota for excessively negative topics about Burke that they have to meet?

And people say Burke has an obsession with the media... looks like it's the other way around.

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04-11-2012, 02:59 PM
  #175
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Originally Posted by thebluemachine View Post
They did that because you are paying for a service you didn't receive and that is good business. Paying to watch a hockey game is a different service where it doesn't matter if they win or they lose, regardless what the outcome of the game is you aren't entitled to a refund. What you are paying for is to watch them play, that's it.
Bingo.

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