I think was a good thing when they publicly apologized, but I have to say the resentment will grow stronger if they have to apologize a second time.
What do you think? Yes Burke has autonomy, but do you think he has a "blank check" like Sather does? Yes he has an opportunity to turn this team around for now, but do you think he has the ownership's confidence to remain here for many years until the leafs become Stanley Cup contenders?
What do you think? Is he gone after another losing season?
I certainly hope he has a long tenure here. I'm really pleased with a lot of the things he's done, and no GM has ever made no mistakes. It will be tricky if we fail to make the playoffs again next year, but that depends on what he's able to do over the off-season.
The important thing is that Burke is constantly trying to improve this team. Always. He knows that we're not where he wants us to be, or where we want to be. That's why I find the negativity towards him so ridiculous: he's unhappier about the team's performance than any of us are. And at the end of the day, if you remove Burke, you have to replace him. There's not a single unemployed GM that I would rather have than Burke, that I think could do a better job and be more passionate about building a winner here.
he'll get fired if they fail next season without a doubt. The new GM will come in, strip the team down, throw a bunch of **** on the wall and hope it sticks. When that doesn't work - rinse, repeat
he'll get fired if they fail next season without a doubt. The new GM will come in, strip the team down, throw a bunch of **** on the wall and hope it sticks. When that doesn't work - rinse, repeat
This is why I hope Burke doesn't get canned. I've believed for a long time that he has a true plan for this organization. He wants to create a perennial contender, that challenges for the Cup every year, with a window of opportunity that allows us to remain competitive for a long, long time. He's been laying the groundwork for that for the past few seasons by doing the exact thing that everyone wishes he would do: build through youth.
He tried to not-suck now by bringing in veterans like Armstrong and Komisarek and Connolly and Beauchemin, etc., and they didn't pan out for us the way we had hoped. But those pieces weren't really ever the guys we were going to be looking to to lead us by the time we became a contender (something that we should have known was going to take time).
Burke wanted to try and retool a terrible team into one that could make the playoffs, do some damage, and keep fans happy while he went out and brought in young, close-to-NHL-ready prospects who have character and want to play for the Maple Leafs (take a look at how many of his recent acquisitions grew up as Leafs fans). The first part hasn't worked out, but the most important part of Burke's plan, the part where he tries to build a young, tough team with heart, is actually looking quite impressive. Kessel, Kadri, Gardiner, Colborne, Biggs, Percy, Ashton, and Ross, among others (not to mention whoever we pick at 5th this year), are all young, skilled or rugged players that look poised to become full-time NHLers, and every one of them was brought in by Burke.
I think the reason MLSE did this is because next Rogers/Bell will own it. It will be up to Burke to convince Bell/Rogers that they continue on the path. I think if Leafs make playoffs, Burke will be removed from GM and put to President and Nonis (or one of the other GM types Toronto has) will be named.
ALong those lines-going to be rather interesting if Rogers tries applying the baseball model: "If we're rebuilding, then we don't want to spend to cap every year" (I do know they are two different sports and not necessarily advocating it-just suggesting Rogers might point to the Jays and how just NOW they are on the verge of success and saying "we take our time")
The tricky thing for Burke is new ownership coming in. I think he'd be fine after one more losing season under this current ownership, but I'm not so sure if new owners come in and want to put their own stamp on the team.
We hold the Maple Leafs as a sacred trust and have failed in our duty to keep the media talking about our team long after they retained any competitive relevance. For this we wish to apologize and to apologize for our previous apology and to apologize for that apology to.
In fact, in my last act as MLSE Chariman, I will issue a pre-emptive apology every day.
And apologize that we are now so far behind them on a rebuild that only tanking for 4 years,which we should have done anyway,will gives us a chance.Some leaf fans are delusional on how far behind the pack Burke has put us.He took a shortcut,spent money like a drunken sailor and failed horribly.We apologize as a result we have to raise your ticket prices to recoup our loss of playoff revenue for the next 7 years.
Enjoy the rise in prices this man has caused.Most fans said his moves were a mistake at the time he did them and it is right here for public record.He is incompetent.Anything he does now,will be a mistake.We are simply too far behind the pack in the East to be fixed with a few trades,in which he will give up more assets.Bring in Bowman and rebuild,it is the only way!Retool,means raise your ticket prices.
The combination of a new CBA, transition of ownership and the Leafs early season success is what has given Burke a bit of a saving grace to play out his tenure here. You gotta believe that the clock is really winding down on this guy though if he doesn't make playoffs next season.
Quote:
Originally Posted by darrylsittler27
Retool,means raise your ticket prices.
MLSE has said they won't raise ticket prices for next season and I could be wrong, but I think they were stable this season as well. Doesn't certainly rule out the possibility of future price increases down the line though.
And apologize that we are now so far behind them on a rebuild that only tanking for 4 years,which we should have done anyway,will gives us a chance.Some leaf fans are delusional on how far behind the pack Burke has put us.He took a shortcut,spent money like a drunken sailor and failed horribly.We apologize as a result we have to raise your ticket prices to recoup our loss of playoff revenue for the next 7 years.
Enjoy the rise in prices this man has caused.Most fans said his moves were a mistake at the time he did them and it is right here for public record.He is incompetent.Anything he does now,will be a mistake.We are simply too far behind the pack in the East to be fixed with a few trades,in which he will give up more assets.Bring in Bowman and rebuild,it is the only way!Retool,means raise your ticket prices.
Again, what assets, exactly, did Burke have that were on the same level as Carter and Richards? Oh ya, none.
Burke has done a decent job in at least bringing a young core that will take time to develop compared to what was here previously. What is the problem with this whole situation? MLS&E has NEVER put out an apology letter to their fans because they could always get away with putting an on ice product with loyal fans paying.
What is happening now the loyal fans are starting to become jaded with the team and organization. You now see long term season ticket holders questioning why they are paying tens of thousands of dollars each year on season seats, let along an initial estimated $26k up front for "rights" to own the seats for cheaper sections.
The fact ownership is acknowledging the dismal play of the on ice product shows something serious is about to happen with the team. Larry Tanenbaum does not apologize, and I doubt he will repeat the apology again. It looks like this upcoming season will be the tell tale of what happens with the management team.
Sadly, there probably is no General Manager that can fix this team EVER it seems. How many have tried and failed in close to two decades now?
I certainly hope he has a long tenure here. I'm really pleased with a lot of the things he's done, and no GM has ever made no mistakes. It will be tricky if we fail to make the playoffs again next year, but that depends on what he's able to do over the off-season.
The important thing is that Burke is constantly trying to improve this team. Always. He knows that we're not where he wants us to be, or where we want to be. That's why I find the negativity towards him so ridiculous: he's unhappier about the team's performance than any of us are. And at the end of the day, if you remove Burke, you have to replace him. There's not a single unemployed GM that I would rather have than Burke, that I think could do a better job and be more passionate about building a winner here.
this. Burke is a great GM idk why people have such a hard time realizing this.
New Leafs ownership Bell/Rogers are media moguls in the industry and therefore the media coverage is expected to increase and intensify as a result in the future due to ownership change.
There is already, as we're seeing now an ever increasing love/hate, toxic relation brewing between Burke and media outlets, calling him out publicly for what he says and doesn't do, or his lack of accomplishments and Leaf struggles.
2012-13 is "Playoffs or Burke" in Toronto for MLSE, as they will not be able to subdue the avalanche of negative publicity that will rain down on them with another of season of failure in Toronto.
Without success in the near future, it will not be another apology that will be issued or required by MLSE, but rather something far more assertive, decisive and definitive.
__________________
Signature: There is no greater demonstration of Fan patience then to suggest to "Play the Kids " and be willing to accept the consequences of those actions..
Again, what assets, exactly, did Burke have that were on the same level as Carter and Richards? Oh ya, none.
Trading Kessel for what Richards (Simmons & Schenn) or Carter (Couturier & Voracek) returned in trade shouldn't be a problem, unless his perceived value is not equal to those players.
MLSE has said they won't raise ticket prices for next season and I could be wrong, but I think they were stable this season as well. Doesn't certainly rule out the possibility of future price increases down the line though.
Subscriber Ticket prices were discounted coming out of the lockout and haven't risen since.
The combination of a new CBA, transition of ownership and the Leafs early season success is what has given Burke a bit of a saving grace to play out his tenure here. You gotta believe that the clock is really winding down on this guy though if he doesn't make playoffs next season.
MLSE has said they won't raise ticket prices for next season and I could be wrong, but I think they were stable this season as well. Doesn't certainly rule out the possibility of future price increases down the line though.
The price of tickets may not rise, but the expectancy to make the playoffs to increase revenue that way certainly will.
From a recent Globe and Mail article in regards to the new ownership discussion.
Quote:
Already, the Leafs have the highest ticket price in the league at $123.77 (U.S.), according to the research site Team Marketing Report. Add in all the other costs of attending a game at the MLSE-owned Air Canada Centre and the Leafs extract more money from fans than any other team in the NHL. According to the Fan Cost Index, prepared by Team Marketing Report, the cost of four non-premium tickets, two small draft beers, four small soft drinks, four hot dogs, parking, and a couple of programs and caps would cost $622.08, almost twice the league average.
But teams that make the playoffs provide huge boosts in profits to their owners, because players are not paid more to play in the playoffs. That means that all revenue the Leafs would get from playoff tickets, beer and popcorn sales and extra merchandise sales would fall almost straight to the bottom line. For MLSE, having the Leafs back in the playoffs would be a big win financially.
In order to recover their investment, increased pressure to provide playoff gate receipt returns will be higher than ever next year, and the person presently with autonomy to control the end results of the teams fate will need to deliver or an apology simply will not do.
I'm not sure why MLSE would care about issuing apologies? They keep rolling in the profits regardless. I can tell you I'm sorry day after day and not care whether I have to say it again tomorrow when I keep getting richer off of you.
if my employer took out space in all the major toronto dailies apologizing for my work product i would start updating my resumes and begin networking in hopes of finding future employment opportunities
2012-13 is "Playoffs or Burke" in Toronto for MLSE, as they will not be able to subdue the avalanche of negative publicity that will rain down on them with another of season of failure in Toronto.
Without success in the near future, it will not be another apology that will be issued or required by MLSE, but rather something far more assertive, decisive and definitive.
If they get a new GM it'll still be another apology. Its not like a new GM = instant playoffs.
If they get a new GM it'll still be another apology. Its not like a new GM = instant playoffs.
No guarantee certainly, but 50/50 odds.
Its the finishing in the bottom 5 of the league standings 2 of the past 3 years which is what needs to be apologized for, as a result of poor current GM performance.
But most importantly is that change by holding those accountable for the current failure, that appeases the masses and brings new hope/optimism and also renewed patience in transition, once that occurs as it addresses the problem.
If Burke were fired today, that would be the greatest apology action MLSE could send out, as it sends the message saying "we simply do not accept failure and our loyal fans deserve better", than what they've been forced to endure these past 4 seasons. Actions always speak louder than words as the saying goes.
Its the finishing in the bottom 5 of the league standings 2 of the past 3 years which is what needs to be apologized for, as a result of poor current GM performance.
But most importantly is that change by holding those accountable for the current failure, that appeases the masses and brings new hope/optimism and also renewed patience in transition, once that occurs as it addresses the problem.
If Burke were fired today, that would be the greatest apology action MLSE could send out, as it sends the message saying "we simply do not accept failure and our loyal fans deserve better", than what they've been forced to endure these past 4 seasons. Actions always speak louder than words as the saying goes.
I didn't realize they just flipped coins every year to see who makes the playoffs.
It will be the same group of players and the new GM will still have the same challenges that Burke does. UFAs won't sign with a losing team, and trades are really hard to make.
Unless you think they'll hire somebody to come in and rebuild which MLSE has never done, but still in that case we're looking at another 5 years of apologies.
I didn't realize they just flipped coins every year to see who makes the playoffs.
It will be the same group of players and the new GM will still have the same challenges that Burke does. UFAs won't sign with a losing team, and trades are really hard to make.
Unless you think they'll hire somebody to come in and rebuild which MLSE has never done, but still in that case we're looking at another 5 years of apologies.
You either make the playoffs or you don't so that is the tongue in cheek 50/50 odds comment about every season for every team as there is only 2 outcomes possible. In fact the odds are even better than 50/50 because over 50% (8 of 15 teams) make the playoffs in each conference, so all you have to do is be better than 7 other teams and you've achieved a playoff invite.
If MLSE served up Burke it would be the apology the media and the masses are looking for, as it would bring peace and satisfaction that those accountable for teams failure have been dealt with appropriately, and reinforcing MLSE position that "failure is not an acceptable option" in Toronto and they expect better..
The mood in the papers and TV would instantly change, as well as throughout Leafs Nation general populous as the articles would turn from venomous attacks and ridicule that we see now, to praising MLSE for taking action and to renewed hope that the next guy will be able to do a better job.
Granted fixing this mess will not be easy, but that is true also even if Burke was asked to clean up it himself. Any new GM would be given time to clean up the current situation, as dumping LACK and others and building a different team buys time, through change. Without change the demands, expectations, pressure etc for a quicker recovery will not be present as luring UFAs to a bad team or making trades to fix what ails the Leafs doesn't change.
If this situation continues as is, the need for more apologies for poor results will escalate, and its already at its boiling over point now. Apologies as CBC Rex Murphy pointed out are falling on deaf ears as they're simply just words or excuses without concrete actions behind them..
You either make the playoffs or you don't so that is the tongue in cheek 50/50 odds comment about every season for every team as there is only 2 outcomes possible. In fact the odds are even better than 50/50 because over 50% (8 of 15 teams) make the playoffs in each conference.
If MLSE served up Burke it would be the apology the media and the masses are looking for, as it would bring peace and satisfaction that those accountable for teams failure have been dealt with appropriately and reinforcing MLSE position that "failure is not an acceptable option" in Toronto..
The mood in the papers and TV would instantly change, as well as throughout Leafs Nation general populous as the articles would turn from venomous attacks and ridicule we see now, to praising MLSE for taking action and to renewed hope that the next guy will do a better job.
Granted fixing this mess will not be easy, but that it true also even if Burke was asked to clean up it himself. Any new GM would be given time to clean up the current situation, as dumping LACK and others and building a different team buys time, through change. Without change the demands, expectations, pressure etc for a quicker recovery will not be present as luring UFAs to a bad team or making trades to fix what ails the Leafs doesn't change.
If this situation continues as is, the need for more apologies for poor results will escalate, and its already at its boiling over point now. Apologies as CBC Rex Murphy pointed out are falling on deaf ears as they're simply just words or excuses without concrete actions behind them..
I still don't understand what you are talking about odds for, its not 50/50 that detroit makes the playoffs next year and columbus misses. The odds depend on the group playing on the ice not just dividing the number of playoff spots by the number of teams.
Firing Burke is really just buying them(MLSE) another year since they are the ones who keep bringing in people to "retool". The next GM won't be coming in to rebuild, he'll be coming in to do the exact same thing as Burke.
It has nothing to do with not accepting failure. Its with dodging the blame. They told Ferguson he couldn't rebuild and they hired Burke because he fit their philosophy of making the playoffs in one year.
The next person in the door won't be saying "this is a rebuild" I ****ing guarantee you that. Its going to be a revolving door of GMs all with the same philosophy.
