Chris Stewart is a great athletic hockey player, but he doesn't posses the hockey skills and sense like Neal has. Athletic ability can only get you to a certain level of the game, skills and sense will make you an elite and prolong your game.
Is McDonald or Perron great 2 way players? Our system doesn't require you to be a great 2 way player, it requires you to buy in and play with hustle and discipline. Tarasenko's drive and heart would thrive on this team. His play style is similar to Bobby Ryan. He will fit in just fine.
Those guys play hard and are not big pure offensive players. McDonald played very well 2 way game in Anaheim.
I am taking about legitimate start potential offensive young players that are very creative. Not hard working top 6-9 guys.
No, he had back to back 28 goal seasons, and one was cut short because of injuries. He was progressing until this season, this season is the freak season.
He'll return to that 25-30 level, but not much more than that. He had 15 goals on a 22.4% shooting percentage for the Blues last year. That's completely obscene. His 9% this year puts him at a career average of 12.7%. Unless he gets more ice time, it's unlikely he'll be a consistent 60-point player.
Those guys play hard and are not big pure offensive players. McDonald played very well 2 way game in Anaheim.
I am taking about legitimate start potential offensive young players that are very creative. Not hard working top 6-9 guys.
The only issues that Hitch has had were with players that didn't apply themselves, players that didn't put the effort in, like Stewart and Filatov.
Tarasenko was a Captain for his WJC team and played with cracked ribs. He goes hard to the net and battles for pucks. He is a Hitch type of player. Hitch's views have also changed since he left Columbus, he has modified his system, and the players even said they have more freedom on offense than they did before.
All this Hitch hates Russians and hates offensive players is completely blown out of proportion.
He'll return to that 25-30 level, but not much more than that. He had 15 goals on a 22.4% shooting percentage for the Blues last year. That's completely obscene. His 9% this year puts him at a career average of 12.7%. Unless he gets more ice time, it's unlikely he'll be a consistent 60-point player.
If he goes to a run n gun, rush type of offensive team, he will get top 6 minutes.
The Blues will qualify him at the 1yr, 3.25M to retain his rights. Stewart won't sign it, as I'd be shocked if he thinks his future's with the Blues at this point.
In the end, Stewart will have to sign the one-year Blues offer or accept an offer elsewhere. Last year's Oshie situation is precedent. If some team offered Stewart a modest 2yrs, 3.5M and Tarasenko had signed his ELC (all indications are Tarasenko's coming and they'll know before this all transpires), if I were the Blues I wouldn't match, I'd take the first and third as compensation. However, heading into a new CBA my guess is this is not the year teams will be signing guys to offer sheets.
So before it reaches free agency, it's possible there's a draft day trade. Possible ideas:
1) Blues 1st + Stewart to move higher in the 1st;
2) Stewart for already-drafted, near NHL ripe LH defensive prospect (Despres, for example);
3) Part of a package including other Blues prospects/picks for one player;
4) Stewart for a later-first now (15-25 range?) rather than wait for a first and third next year.
Who knows which one it will be, as I am sure they'll look into all their options. The longer he stays on the Blues, the more his value diminishes, as the way the Blues play and Stewart's skills are at odds. He needs to be on an undisciplined bottom-feeder to thrive in his numbers. A team that tries to out odd-man rush its opponents is a team where he'd score 30. Or on a line with Crosby because your mom could probably do that. Pittsburgh can give up 12 goals to Philly in two games and still correctly think it has a chance because its offense is so potent.
What won't happen is trading him for another player with a bad contract. Why on earth would the Blues do that? I see some folks suggesting guys they want to dump. That's nonsensical. The Blues aren't on the hook for any more money to Stewart. Paul Martin is an example of this. Even if the Blues could afford that kind of contract, why pay Paul Martin 5M if they can get a better player in UFA Jason Garrison and still have Stewart's rights to trade?
If for some reason he signed his QO for 1 year at this year's salary level of 3.25M then the Blues could wait for another opportunity to move him. But they really will have an overloaded roster once Tarasenko signs. He will easily replace Stewart's 15-15-30 year production, by the way. Those of us in this thread talking about Tarasenko who've seen him play lots of games this year on the streams see a totally different style of player, one who specifically goes into the dirty areas to score, a dynamic player who himself generates offense. He dominated the best non-NHL league in the world in the regular season and then crushed the playoffs even with laughably miniscule ice time, by far SKA's best player. He's ready.
I don't think the average fan realizes how bad Johnson had to get out of St. Louis. He needed a change for him to take the next step in his career. Shattenkirk's impact on our offense has been bigger than Johnson's and that's what we needed.
I think it was a win-win trade for both teams, even if Stewart no longer fits within the Blues long range plans.
Shattenkirk was having a Calder trophy type season when he was traded, and he now looks like an all-star.
Johnson seems to have found his game and was one of Colorado's best players during the second half of the season, despite his lower point totals.
Johnson's potential was and always will be limited due to his lack of (and some times even severe) elite hockeysense.
Blues got more than a fair return for him despite Stewart's fall out.
EJ's hockey sense is fine and he was tremendous down the stretch for Colorado, although I realize Blues fans seem to have a strange urge to constantly try to reassure themselves that he is complete garbage.
EJ's hockey sense is fine and he was tremendous down the stretch for Colorado, although I realize Blues fans seem to have a strange urge to constantly try to reassure themselves that he is complete garbage.
No, you just don't realize how mistake prone he was and how many boneheaded plays he would make. I really think being the #1 pick and his golf cart polo injury overwhelmed him and he had to get out of St. Louis to be successful.
No, you just don't realize how mistake prone he was and how many boneheaded plays he would make. I really think being the #1 pick and his golf cart polo injury overwhelmed him and he had to get out of St. Louis to be successful.
Maybe at that point in time it was true, but that was not what I was responding to in my prior post. I think there is a clear difference in saying that he was mistake prone during his time in St. Louis versus saying that he lacks hockey sense now and going forward, which is how I read the statement with respect to him. I think a lot of statements about him would properly be characterized as falling in the latter category, which I believe are patently false in nature.
Maybe at that point in time it was true, but that was not what I was responding to in my prior post. I think there is a clear difference in saying that he was mistake prone during his time in St. Louis versus saying that he lacks hockey sense now and going forward, which is how I read the statement with respect to him. I think a lot of statements about him would properly be characterized as falling in the latter category, which I believe are patently false in nature.
Well he isn't a blues fans, just so you know. Johnson was always going to be a longer type project, it just got to complicated in St. Louis.
EJ's hockey sense is fine and he was tremendous down the stretch for Colorado, although I realize Blues fans seem to have a strange urge to constantly try to reassure themselves that he is complete garbage.
Yeah, that guy isn't a Blues fan.
Basically what this trade taught us is that both fanbase's warning to the other about the limitations of EJ and Stewart were true. Blues fans wrote off Colorado's warnings about Stewart's negatives (in part because scoring 15 goals in 26 games will do that) but Avs fans were correct. What most Blues fans said about EJ is he has all the potential in the world because of his physical gifts but his hockey sense was in serious question and would be his primary limiting factor. Avs fans wrote this off but it's still true. There's a logical reason why each player was traded. Stewart's limitations impede him more than EJ's impede him. EJ's a top-four defender no matter what. Stewart isn't a top-six forward when his problems show themselves. What EJ did in St. Louis was put together solid stretches, parts of years where you thought, ah, this is the real deal. Same as this year in Colorado. Some of his year was very good, some of it was poor.
I think this trade was a humbling lesson in taking the other fan base seriously when they watch their guys a lot, because neither fan base is reporting in bad faith.
Johnson's potential was and always will be limited due to his lack of (and some times even severe) elite hockeysense.
Blues got more than a fair return for him despite Stewart's fall out.
I think McClement and Siemens could tilt it in the Avs favor.
McClement was awesome for us this year. Amazing PKer, chipped in with 10 goals, was a rock defensively and was a leader for the young Avs in the locker room.
If the Avs can re-sign him that would be a huge plus.
Basically what this trade taught us is that both fanbase's warning to the other about the limitations of EJ and Stewart were true. Blues fans wrote off Colorado's warnings about Stewart's negatives (in part because scoring 15 goals in 26 games will do that) but Avs fans were correct. What most Blues fans said about EJ is he has all the potential in the world because of his physical gifts but his hockey sense was in serious question and would be his primary limiting factor. Avs fans wrote this off but it's still true. There's a logical reason why each player was traded. Stewart's limitations impede him more than EJ's impede him. EJ's a top-four defender no matter what. Stewart isn't a top-six forward when his problems show themselves. What EJ did in St. Louis was put together solid stretches, parts of years where you thought, ah, this is the real deal. Same as this year in Colorado. Some of his year was very good, some of it was poor.
I think this trade was a humbling lesson in taking the other fan base seriously when they watch their guys a lot, because neither fan base is reporting in bad faith.
I can't comment on Stewart because I haven't watched him closely this year... but EJ had one bad stretch... the beginning paired with Hejda.
After October, EJ was consistently very very good and played very good in his own end. His most impressive games I felt were against Vancouver. He didn't score much this year, but in his own zone, he dominated with ease. With taking the puck out, making simple and smart plays without being overly physical... I'd hope more people would have watched him this year but that's usually how it is... unless he has a career year, I don't think he'll change popular opinion.
Quote:
Originally Posted by BlueDream
Yeah I'm thinking the Blues will give him a one-year deal for around 3.5M which isn't that expensive (IF they don't trade him obviously).
I recall that happening to him in Colorado and perhaps he does need another wake-up call. But I really think he deserves another chance. We know he has the ability to score 30 goals, and on a team like the Blues who don't exactly score a ton, I think shipping him off after one down year is quite a risk to take. Blues fans are assuming 1. That Tarasenko even comes over here next season (which isn't guaranteed), and 2. That he actually makes an impact (He'll be a rookie, can't expect the world out of him). Stewart has been good for us before, and over the past few weeks he has been a lot more energetic and physical. I personally think he looks better now than he did at the beginning of the season. Colorado fans are definitely right that he doesn't have the best work ethic, but I for one am willing to give him another chance. He's definitely frustrating but can also be rewarding when he's on his game. There's no doubt that he's an inconsistent player though. I'll never understand him but I will always be a fan of him.
I think it would be wise for the Blues to sign him to a 1year deal... figure out what they have with him... isn't much of a gamble signing him and at least they can be sure of him one way or another.
I can't comment on Stewart because I haven't watched him closely this year... but EJ had one bad stretch... the beginning paired with Hejda.
After October, EJ was consistently very very good and played very good in his own end. His most impressive games I felt were against Vancouver. He didn't score much this year, but in his own zone, he dominated with ease. With taking the puck out, making simple and smart plays without being overly physical... I'd hope more people would have watched him this year but that's usually how it is... unless he has a career year, I don't think he'll change popular opinion.
I think it would be wise for the Blues to sign him to a 1year deal... figure out what they have with him... isn't much of a gamble signing him and at least they can be sure of him one way or another.
It went on longer than October. He had a totally forgettable November, for example. I'm just saying this is what we saw too. Plenty of very good, very strong games. Just not enough of them. But he clearly brings an element the Avs needed on D, and the Blues needed a puck mover like Shattenkirk because they had some stay at homers already in Jackman and Polak. It was a win-win deal. You guys love your new D, we love our new D. Seriously good swap.
As for Stewart, yeah a one-year deal would be the only thing the Blues would offer, much like Oshie last summer. Stewart can sign it, hold out, or sign an offer sheet if one is offered. I'm not sure the Blues would match and the offer could be pretty modest in the 3s too. I'd take the first and third. It could be a win-win offer sheet from the right team.
It went on longer than October. He had a totally forgettable November, for example. I'm just saying this is what we saw too. Plenty of very good, very strong games. Just not enough of them. But he clearly brings an element the Avs needed on D, and the Blues needed a puck mover like Shattenkirk because they had some stay at homers already in Jackman and Polak. It was a win-win deal. You guys love your new D, we love our new D. Seriously good swap.
This is correct. When EJ really turned his season around was December 4th after coming back from a groin injury. He was eased back into his playing time, and really started to thrive after that. I'm hoping the difference between EJ's stretches in St. Louis and his play in Colorado this season was that he started slow, then came back and maintained it for roughly 50 games to end out the season. If he plays defense like he played for the final 50 games, finds his offensive game and gets 40 + points, people will start taking note of him as a very good # 1 defenceman.
Even with Stewart's struggles, if he ends up getting traded it will still net the Blues some nice assets. No reason he doesn't make the original trade a win-win still. Just send him out East please.
