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Old
04-22-2012, 09:34 PM
  #151
Eddie Shack
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Originally Posted by Ducks DVM View Post
Sbisa had 2G 17A 19P -18 in 115 games playing on the third pairing at the end of the year he signed that contract.
Fowler already has 15G 54A 69P -53(ouch) in 158 games with another year to play and will have had two years playing on the top pairing when he signs his RFA deal.


As much as it would help the cap, there is exactly zero chance that Fowler's deal is remotely similar to Sbisa's in anything other than potentially length.
I did allow for next year being an unknow. But let us not forget this is RFA not UFA. If it came to matching an offer sheet I'm sure Murray would. But to offer something much bigger than he gave Sbisa without a gun to his head would surprise me. I do think a lot will depend on how next year goes (either way). If he were signing today I'd guess maybe .5M per season more than Sbisa for three years.

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04-22-2012, 10:08 PM
  #152
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Fowler's been playing first pairing minutes for a couple seasons now. And he will have been playing for three years compared to Sbisa's two. The situations really aren't that comparable to me.

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04-22-2012, 10:14 PM
  #153
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Fowler's been playing first pairing minutes for a couple seasons now. And he will have been playing for three years compared to Sbisa's two. The situations really aren't that comparable to me.
Well, yeah, sort of. I'm not trying to pick on him but I don't think anybody would say his game to this point in his career is NHL first pairing caliber. He just plays that here.

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04-22-2012, 11:43 PM
  #154
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Originally Posted by snarktacular View Post
Fowler's been playing first pairing minutes for a couple seasons now. And he will have been playing for three years compared to Sbisa's two. The situations really aren't that comparable to me.
Fowler deserves (and will get) more, but I would say the situations are comparable. Fowler's salary will just average about 1.5-2 more IMO. However, it will be similar in that the contract slowly rises as Sbisa's does.

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04-23-2012, 05:12 AM
  #155
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Re-sign Parros! I like McGrattan too but Parros should stay here 1 more season (at a lower price).
No. Parros sucks and doesnt even fight well anymore.

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Originally Posted by ninetynine View Post
-Fan favourite
-fights more than almost all enforcers, even with the off-year last year
-great teammate
-shows no rust after being scratched for significant periods of time
-will be cheap to re-sign, even at a lower price
-will complement Konopka
-other players strongly associate him with the franchise
-awesome 'stache
-likely sells a few tickets to otherwise MMA and boxing fans
The only thing he and Konopka have in common is they both are terrible hockey players. All Konopka does is win faceoffs and all parros does, or used to do, is fight. They suck.

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Also, if Teemu doesn't return, I'd give him Teemu's "A". Also, if we can get Parros for league minimum, he's an asset, as he's one of the best enforcers playing-wise in the league, and was a plus player last year (and most years).
Ok now you have to be trolling. How can you give an "A" to someone playing 5 minutes a night and gets scratched 1/3 of the games.

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04-23-2012, 10:47 AM
  #156
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Originally Posted by ninetynine View Post
Also, if Teemu doesn't return, I'd give him Teemu's "A". Also, if we can get Parros for league minimum, he's an asset, as he's one of the best enforcers playing-wise in the league, and was a plus player last year (and most years).
takingthepiss.jpg

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04-23-2012, 12:02 PM
  #157
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Parros' run is up. Anyone who still wants him wants him there because of the fan connection. Teams don't win by saving a spot for a guy that people like. He's just ineffective. For the last few years, every time I fill out a lineup, I do so filling in Parros with the thought in the back of my head that we can do better at that spot.

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Originally Posted by Eddie Shack View Post
I did allow for next year being an unknow. But let us not forget this is RFA not UFA. If it came to matching an offer sheet I'm sure Murray would. But to offer something much bigger than he gave Sbisa without a gun to his head would surprise me. I do think a lot will depend on how next year goes (either way). If he were signing today I'd guess maybe .5M per season more than Sbisa for three years.
Sorry...try again. Contracts are based on more than just on ice results...which those alone are enough to warrant more than what Sbisa got, but upside is taken into account. That's why Ryan got as much as Getzlaf and Perry did. His agent based everything on the statistical projection of Bobby being a future 40 goal scorer if everything went according to plan.

No way in hell is a guy who got two full NHL seasons playing right out of his draft going to get nothing more than a 1.3 million dollar raise. Like it or not, and regardless of how he's played this year, he's in the Pietrangelo, OEL, Doughty, Bogosian, Larsson, etc group of young talented blueliners. I think we can expect 3.5 for Fowler just because of this bad year and the low +/-.

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04-23-2012, 12:16 PM
  #158
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Well, I seriously doubt he will be re-signed this off season. So speculating today is almost meaningless. We should probably just revisit this a year from now at which time we may all be on the same page.

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04-23-2012, 01:03 PM
  #159
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The OCR adresses our need of a #2C.

http://www.ocregister.com/articles/n...ybe.html?pic=2

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04-23-2012, 01:13 PM
  #160
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Originally Posted by DuckJet View Post


Sorry...try again. Contracts are based on more than just on ice results...which those alone are enough to warrant more than what Sbisa got, but upside is taken into account. That's why Ryan got as much as Getzlaf and Perry did. His agent based everything on the statistical projection of Bobby being a future 40 goal scorer if everything went according to plan.

No way in hell is a guy who got two full NHL seasons playing right out of his draft going to get nothing more than a 1.3 million dollar raise. Like it or not, and regardless of how he's played this year, he's in the Pietrangelo, OEL, Doughty, Bogosian, Larsson, etc group of young talented blueliners. I think we can expect 3.5 for Fowler just because of this bad year and the low +/-.
I agree that Fowler will get a nice raise. As of right now, I'd expect him to get something similar to what Luke Schenn got from Toronto. Young kid, straight to the NHL, playing top minutes (Schenn isn't now, but was at the time of his extension), with a lot of upside. Anything similar to Schenn's deal would be acceptable in my eyes.

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04-23-2012, 03:01 PM
  #161
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Doesn't suprise me, I've been badgering Stephens about it on twitter for a while now

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04-23-2012, 03:15 PM
  #162
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What kind of resources would be willing to give up for a #2C? Of course it depends on who is coming, but would we be willing to give up Holland + our #6 draft pick to an average 2C? Ryan? Some combo of prospects?

Or will we fish in the UFA market and if nothing works, work with our prospects or Koivu, not even thinking trade

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04-23-2012, 04:15 PM
  #163
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I want a proper #2C, but at the same time also having Ryan on that 2nd line left wing.

A short-term solution while giving Holland another year in bottom6/AHL could perhaps be best if we think long-term.

2012/13:
DSP-Getzlaf-Perry
Ryan-Koivu-Teemu/Palmieri

2013/14:
Etem-Getzlaf-Perry
Ryan-Holland-Palmieri

(Also keep in mind that we COULD draft Galchenyuk this june)

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04-23-2012, 04:15 PM
  #164
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Originally Posted by Fallenity View Post
What kind of resources would be willing to give up for a #2C? Of course it depends on who is coming, but would we be willing to give up Holland + our #6 draft pick to an average 2C? Ryan? Some combo of prospects?

Or will we fish in the UFA market and if nothing works, work with our prospects or Koivu, not even thinking trade
I don't see us picking someone as enigmatic as Jokinen. I don't see us placing a high priority on some prospect that will be ready in two to four years. I don't see us icing two to three inexperienced youngsters in the top six, either. We need help now, and we need to add someone with experience to our current top six. We'll package up the 6th overall to land a center. If there are still problems, then one of the big 3 will be moved out at the deadline to address them; performance and contract status will determine who is leaving.

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04-23-2012, 05:13 PM
  #165
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Quote:
Originally Posted by quentez View Post
I want a proper #2C, but at the same time also having Ryan on that 2nd line left wing.

A short-term solution while giving Holland another year in bottom6/AHL could perhaps be best if we think long-term.

2012/13:
DSP-Getzlaf-Perry
Ryan-Koivu-Teemu/Palmieri

2013/14:
Etem-Getzlaf-Perry
Ryan-Holland-Palmieri

(Also keep in mind that we COULD draft Galchenyuk this june)
Which isn't a factor at all. Galchenyuk won't be in the NHL next season, and perhaps not in a second line role by 13/14. If we take him, it's because he's the BPA and/or to shore up center prospect depth, has absolutely nothing to do with our current need of a 2nd line centerman.

Which is why trading the pick is probably a decent idea. Our prospect pool's pretty deadly as is, so it's dealing from a position of strength, and there's ways we could swing a deal and stay about even. Something around the 6th pick, one of Holland or Bonino and something else for Matt Duchene and Ryan O'Byrne. If they could somehow get Duchene without giving up guys like Getzlaf, Perry, Ryan, Fowler and Sbisa, good lord they gotta try at it.

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04-23-2012, 05:37 PM
  #166
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Depending on player, id target a deal around 1st + Holland. I don't trade Ryan because that just creates another whole on the team.

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04-23-2012, 06:30 PM
  #167
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Which isn't a factor at all. Galchenyuk won't be in the NHL next season, and perhaps not in a second line role by 13/14. If we take him, it's because he's the BPA and/or to shore up center prospect depth, has absolutely nothing to do with our current need of a 2nd line centerman.

Which is why trading the pick is probably a decent idea. Our prospect pool's pretty deadly as is, so it's dealing from a position of strength, and there's ways we could swing a deal and stay about even. Something around the 6th pick, one of Holland or Bonino and something else for Matt Duchene and Ryan O'Byrne. If they could somehow get Duchene without giving up guys like Getzlaf, Perry, Ryan, Fowler and Sbisa, good lord they gotta try at it.
If Colorado considers moving Duchene it will be for way more than that. And quite likely will involve a scoring winger and no picks or prospects.

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04-23-2012, 06:33 PM
  #168
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Which is why trading the pick is probably a decent idea. Our prospect pool's pretty deadly as is, so it's dealing from a position of strength, and there's ways we could swing a deal and stay about even. Something around the 6th pick, one of Holland or Bonino and something else for Matt Duchene and Ryan O'Byrne. If they could somehow get Duchene without giving up guys like Getzlaf, Perry, Ryan, Fowler and Sbisa, good lord they gotta try at it.
I agree. I think it's time to start taking advantage of the prospect pool we've built up by dealing for some proven commodities. If Holland and a 1st could net us someone like Duchene then I'm all for it (it will likely take more than that though).

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04-23-2012, 07:25 PM
  #169
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Holland and 6th for Dutchy is done in a moment for me. But yeah I agree it would take more.

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04-23-2012, 07:58 PM
  #170
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If Colorado considers moving Duchene it will be for way more than that. And quite likely will involve a scoring winger and no picks or prospects.
I'm not sure it'd be way more, but don't know why I said Holland when I meant Etem. Local or not, you don't pass up an opportunity at Duchene. Hell, I wouldn't be opposed to 6th, Etem, Bonino for Duchene, O'Byrne, third or something like that.

EDIT-Remembered the Duchene for 6th, 36th, Etem proposal, and it'd definitely be along those lines, maybe get Bonino in there to sweeten the deal(and so we have room to sign Koivu to be the third line center). Two picks is tough, but that 36th probably won't be much of a player anyway. Some mentioned our track record with second rounders, and wanted to sub in Clark(really, a second rounder who's developing well? That Family Guy clip comes to mind), but that thing's probably more valuable because it's the 36th best pick and not for what kind of player it will bring.

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04-23-2012, 08:02 PM
  #171
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Originally Posted by MVPeyton View Post
I'm not sure it'd be way more, but don't know why I said Holland when I meant Etem. Local or not, you don't pass up an opportunity at Duchene. Hell, I wouldn't be opposed to 6th, Etem, Bonino for Duchene, O'Byrne, third or something like that.
They might toss in the third, but I don't O'Byrne joining Duchene if that's what we're offering.

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04-23-2012, 08:22 PM
  #172
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I'm not sure it'd be way more, but don't know why I said Holland when I meant Etem. Local or not, you don't pass up an opportunity at Duchene. Hell, I wouldn't be opposed to 6th, Etem, Bonino for Duchene, O'Byrne, third or something like that.

EDIT-Remembered the Duchene for 6th, 36th, Etem proposal, and it'd definitely be along those lines, maybe get Bonino in there to sweeten the deal(and so we have room to sign Koivu to be the third line center). Two picks is tough, but that 36th probably won't be much of a player anyway. Some mentioned our track record with second rounders, and wanted to sub in Clark(really, a second rounder who's developing well? That Family Guy clip comes to mind), but that thing's probably more valuable because it's the 36th best pick and not for what kind of player it will bring.
I'd be good with that and the 36th for even just Duchene only. But from what I read they don't want pics and prospects. They want a scoring winger like Ryan.

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04-23-2012, 09:29 PM
  #173
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I'd be good with that and the 36th for even just Duchene only. But from what I read they don't want pics and prospects. They want a scoring winger like Ryan.
That's what Avs fans want, but who knows if Sherman is willing to settle on a price if the relationship is strained between Sacco and Duchene. Palmieri+Bonino+6th could feasibly get it done, but we'll see. I have serious doubts that he'd even be available.

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04-23-2012, 09:42 PM
  #174
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That's what Avs fans want, but who knows if Sherman is willing to settle on a price if the relationship is strained between Sacco and Duchene. Palmieri+Bonino+6th could feasibly get it done, but we'll see. I have serious doubts that he'd even be available.
Well, I think the issue between Saco and Duchene might influence if he is traded. But if he goes on the market a lot of people will be interested. In a bidding contest I don't see that offer being enough.

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04-23-2012, 09:44 PM
  #175
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They might toss in the third, but I don't O'Byrne joining Duchene if that's what we're offering.
I see O'Byrne as more of "we're taking on a bad contract" type of situation, unless I'm mistaken(didn't see much of Colorado this year) and he's actually worth the deal. Basically just an added incentive, and if they would rather keep him, then obviously they do.

Also, I'm sure Avs fans don't want prospects, but that doesn't mean it's what their GM wants. They have some great young forwards in Landeskog, O'Reilly and obviously Duchene, but past that and Stastny there isn't a whole lot and next to nothing in the prospect cupboard. Their defense is also brutal and will be for a few years until Elliot, Barrie and Siemans arrive and develop. They're probably not contending any time soon, and add that with their crazy depth at center and the Sacco-Duchene problems and trading Duchene for the best assets possible, be they prospects or NHLers, could easily happen.

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