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Old
04-15-2012, 11:58 AM
  #1
McDunna with Fries
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Question about Refs

Do they have an obligation to step in and break up a fight when a player clearly is knocked out- similar to how UFC refs have to stop fights?

I was at the game yesterday so I couldn't really see what happened, but I watched the replays today and it was clear that Boyle got knocked out. He got caught with a sucker punch on his chin that knocked him off his feet and stunned him and then Carkner just wailed on him. If this was a UFC fight refs would have stepped in and broke it up. Hell if this was any hockey fight the refs would have broken it up at that point. I was shocked to see the refs just standing idly as a defenseless Boyle was getting wailed on. People can suffer permanent brain damage when they take blows to the head in that state. So are NHL refs required to stop a fight in a situation like that?

Also, the fact that the refs just stood by while Boyle was stunned and getting a beatdown was clearly the reason why Dubi jumped in to get Carkner off of Boyle. It's not like Dubi went in and started fighting Carkner. Dubi's game misconduct was confounding, to say the least. Not to mention that the altercation between Boyle and Carkner technically wasn't even a fight.

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04-15-2012, 12:05 PM
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Krampus
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The refs were standing right next to it, but only the linesmen can intervene. The problem was that the dumbass ref saw it as a fight

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04-15-2012, 12:09 PM
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i was asking the same questions during the game once i saw the replay....

i fully think he should have stepped in immediately to stop that...they stop all the other small quarels, but something big they stand by...

now im going to try defending his actions:
1) stupidity
2) is it the linesmen responsibility to break up the fighting so the officials can get numbers? that would somewhat explain it
3) he has a lot less protection on a ref and when he sees a mob coming towards him he cowards away to stay out of getting injured

i don't like the fact he did nothing, but looking at it from different angles

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04-15-2012, 01:01 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Maineice11 View Post
i was asking the same questions during the game once i saw the replay....

i fully think he should have stepped in immediately to stop that...they stop all the other small quarels, but something big they stand by...

now im going to try defending his actions:
1) stupidity
2) is it the linesmen responsibility to break up the fighting so the officials can get numbers? that would somewhat explain it
3) he has a lot less protection on a ref and when he sees a mob coming towards him he cowards away to stay out of getting injured

i don't like the fact he did nothing, but looking at it from different angles
Precisely this. Also the Ref needs to watch for other penalties. What if the refs were busy breaking up the fight, while a Sen skated over to the Rangers goal and two-handed Henrik? Nobody would ever know.

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04-15-2012, 01:06 PM
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The officials absolutely have an obligation to protect a player from injury on the ice when possible.

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Old
04-15-2012, 01:34 PM
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Ian Walsh was the ref who just watched. That should answer all your questions.

Look at the end of the sj/stl game last night, ref broke up the same type of altercation once one of the players was on the ice and defenseless.

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04-15-2012, 02:49 PM
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This one reason why I've always liked Dubinsky. No hesitation when **** like this happens. He's there when his teammates need him.

The referee absolutely should have climbed on Carkner. They made the right call in tossing him--technically they made the right call in tossing Dubinsky--but a teammate who'll just sit and watch a teammate get wailed on is not a good teammate and it was a terrible tradeoff for us.

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04-15-2012, 02:52 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by eco's bones View Post
This one reason why I've always liked Dubinsky. No hesitation when **** like this happens. He's there when his teammates need him.

The referee absolutely should have climbed on Carkner. They made the right call in tossing him--technically they made the right call in tossing Dubinsky--but a teammate who'll just sit and watch a teammate get wailed on is not a good teammate and it was a terrible tradeoff for us.
Technically they made a WRONG call because the initial altercation resulted in a match penalty which means Dubi shouldn't have been tossed.

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04-15-2012, 03:45 PM
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Originally Posted by Bipolar View Post
The refs were standing right next to it, but only the linesmen can intervene.
That's ridiculous.

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04-15-2012, 05:57 PM
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Originally Posted by dubinstache View Post
Precisely this. Also the Ref needs to watch for other penalties. What if the refs were busy breaking up the fight, while a Sen skated over to the Rangers goal and two-handed Henrik? Nobody would ever know.
I believe you may have stumbled onto ottawa's secret plan. Be careful, you may now get fined by the nhl...

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04-15-2012, 06:10 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bipolar View Post
The refs were standing right next to it, but only the linesmen can intervene. The problem was that the dumbass ref saw it as a fight

Usually that is the case, but last night in the STL/SJ game a referee stepped in during the same type of situation.

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04-15-2012, 06:40 PM
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Only linesman are supposed to intervene, it's the referees job to watch so they can make note of who is going to get what penalty. Stuff gets missed otherwise.

Some refs like to get involved in the rough stuff and restrain players to keep control of the game, it really depends on the type of ref you are, but strictly speaking you aren't supposed to intervene.

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04-15-2012, 06:41 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 99 Problems View Post
Only linesman can intervene, it's the referees job to watch so they can make note of who is going to get what penalty. Stuff gets missed otherwise.
That's not true. The refs can absolutely intervene if it has gotten out of hand (which this did).

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04-15-2012, 06:54 PM
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U see the ref jump in and save cindy today?

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04-15-2012, 07:32 PM
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Originally Posted by Jonathan. View Post
That's not true. The refs can absolutely intervene if it has gotten out of hand (which this did).
They can if they want to but by the letter of the law they're not supposed to. The number 1 rule is to never go in by yourself.

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04-15-2012, 09:28 PM
  #16
Mr Atoz*
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 99 Problems View Post
They can if they want to but by the letter of the law they're not supposed to. The number 1 rule is to never go in by yourself.

You don't understand the policy. You're not supposed to go in by yourself to possibly give one player an advantage. Carkner was already punching Boyle repeatedly in the back of the head. The ref also would have prevented Dubinsky from being ejected because he knew that someone had to jump in.

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04-15-2012, 10:01 PM
  #17
beastly115
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Did anyone else notice the ref intervened this afternoon when Crosby was about to get pummeled? Those ********* never intervene during fights. It's the linesman that breaks it up. Ref had no problem protecting Crosby!

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04-15-2012, 10:03 PM
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truebluegoalie
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Originally Posted by AlphaQUp View Post
Did anyone else notice the ref intervened this afternoon when Crosby was about to get pummeled? Those ********* never intervene during fights. It's the linesman that breaks it up. Ref had no problem protecting Crosby!
That isn't entirely true. As I have said multiple times the refs were breaking up fights in the SJ/STL game last night.

The reason the ref did nothing in this situation is because Ian Walsh liked seeing a ranger getting his ass handed to him with cheapshots.

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04-15-2012, 10:08 PM
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Originally Posted by eco's bones View Post
This one reason why I've always liked Dubinsky. No hesitation when **** like this happens. He's there when his teammates need him.

The referee absolutely should have climbed on Carkner. They made the right call in tossing him--technically they made the right call in tossing Dubinsky--but a teammate who'll just sit and watch a teammate get wailed on is not a good teammate and it was a terrible tradeoff for us.
Yeah, like I said before. There can't be a 3rd man in until there is clearly a 2nd combatant.

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04-15-2012, 10:10 PM
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wafflepadsave
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Originally Posted by AlphaQUp View Post
Did anyone else notice the ref intervened this afternoon when Crosby was about to get pummeled? Those ********* never intervene during fights. It's the linesman that breaks it up. Ref had no problem protecting Crosby!
Don't blame them, they are just folowing orders.

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04-16-2012, 02:55 AM
  #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr Atoz View Post
You don't understand the policy. You're not supposed to go in by yourself to possibly give one player an advantage. Carkner was already punching Boyle repeatedly in the back of the head. The ref also would have prevented Dubinsky from being ejected because he knew that someone had to jump in.
I understand it fine, I am a ref. You don't go in by yourself for your own safety. That said, NHL referees seem to ignore most of the rules, I was always taught as a linesman never to climb the boards but I see NHL ones do it multiple times a game.

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04-16-2012, 07:06 AM
  #22
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The entire problem was Ian Walsh is a *********.

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