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Offseason discussion continued (Contract chart in Post #1)

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04-22-2012, 04:31 PM
  #176
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Well the best thing that came from this playoff series is Staal's value has gone up even higher, 6 goals and 9 points in 6 games and was the Pens best player.

I have a feeling this is the offseason that he is dealt. It's not that he doesnt bring a lot to our team but its really difficult to pay a 3rd line center what he's gonna be worth for his new contract.

Trade value for trading him would be what Jeff Carter or Mike Richards went for last offseason I would think.

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04-22-2012, 04:31 PM
  #177
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Doakes View Post
1) What on earth has Tangradi EVER done to warrant being a top nine forward?
2) What has Jeffrey done to prove his an NHL regular?
3) James Wisnewski got $6 million, you think Suter will come cheaper?
4) Niskanen-Michalek, do you know how soft and bad that pairing is?
5) Your bottom four defenseman are horrible.
6) Goaltending is not improved.

=1st round playoff loss again.

You don't get it, Tangradi and others have not PROVEN or EARNED one thing, and our defense is WAY WAY too soft and our goaltending needs major improvements.
The problem with that is if they don't ever get a shot they will never be able to prove anything.

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04-22-2012, 04:33 PM
  #178
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I think the Flames will finally possibly move both Iginla and Kipper this offseason. Would not mind the Pens going after Kipper...he could be a nice filler for a few seasons while we draft or get a new goalie set up behind him.

It's possible if the Bruins lose early that Thomas could be available too, cant see any way they would trade Rask though.

Schneider would be the best option but it seems as though the Canucks have now chosen to go forward with him instead of Luongo.

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04-22-2012, 04:34 PM
  #179
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I've got $100 betting our top 4 looks exactly the same next season. Our D was godly last year, which will give them a "get out of jail free" card for this season.


I don't see Shero making any drastic moves this offseason. He'll just plug holes created from UFA, which I'll be fine with.

Our defense will rebound and we still have Malkin, Crosby, Staal, Neal, and Kunitz. Just like this year, we will once again be favorites to win the Cup, and we can only hope everyone is clicking at the same time. If thats the case, there isn't a team that can beat us.

At the beginning of the season, everyone was talking about this team like the early 90's Pens and rightfully so. We're stacked. Now our players just have to perform.

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04-22-2012, 04:35 PM
  #180
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I'm not for trading Orpik, I don't care what kind of season he had, it was his 1st bad season since he was given a top line role, plus he plays better with Letang, which he wasn't with most of the season. Martin and Michalek were a good pair, Martin though showed he doesn't fit this team and should be traded, replace him with Despres. Trade Niskanen's RFA rights and sign a physical defenseman like Bryan Allen.

Orpik-Letang
Despres-Michalek
Allen-Engelland

As for the forward group, everything should be status quo, maybe a couple minor changes, but there is no needed shakeup. We should wait and see, maybe Bennett makes the team? Maybe we re-sign Sullivan, or we add another winger with size like Stempniak or Penner. Maybe we move Staal up to the top 6 and sign Dominic Moore to play 3rd line center.

Goaltending, you people are nuts to want Fleury gone, some bad playoff series is something he can fix, he can play better, but I'm tired of hearing Fleury needs traded every single season. The guy has some good times and bad times, I don't know who you think you're going to get that is an upgrade over Fleury. Don't re-sign Johnson and bring in Al Montoya.

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04-22-2012, 04:35 PM
  #181
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Quote:
Originally Posted by M0NTY26 View Post
I've got $100 betting our top 4 looks exactly the same next season. Our D was godly last year, which will give them a "get out of jail free" card for this season.


I don't see Shero making any drastic moves this offseason. He'll just plug holes created from UFA, which I'll be fine with.

Our defense will rebound and we still have Malkin, Crosby, Staal, Neal, and Kunitz. Just like this year, we will once again be favorites to win the Cup, and we can only hope everyone is clicking at the same time. If thats the case, there isn't a team that can beat us.

At the beginning of the season, everyone was talking about this team like the early 90's Pens and rightfully so. We're stacked. Now our players just have to perform.
So, then next year will be the last do over, or should one expect a fresh excuse?

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04-22-2012, 04:36 PM
  #182
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Quote:
Originally Posted by M0NTY26 View Post
I've got $100 betting our top 4 looks exactly the same next season. Our D was godly last year, which will give them a "get out of jail free" card for this season.


I don't see Shero making any drastic moves this offseason. He'll just plug holes created from UFA, which I'll be fine with.

Our defense will rebound and we still have Malkin, Crosby, Staal, Neal, and Kunitz. Just like this year, we will once again be favorites to win the Cup, and we can only hope everyone is clicking at the same time. If thats the case, there isn't a team that can beat us.

At the beginning of the season, everyone was talking about this team like the early 90's Pens and rightfully so. We're stacked. Now our players just have to perform.
I agree.

Except, that Shero just has to trade Martin. We need a a physical, mean, big defender to this team. Also a winger for Crosby would be nice.

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04-22-2012, 04:36 PM
  #183
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Quote:
Originally Posted by phaneuf_fan_3 View Post
Well the best thing that came from this playoff series is Staal's value has gone up even higher, 6 goals and 9 points in 6 games and was the Pens best player.

I have a feeling this is the offseason that he is dealt. It's not that he doesnt bring a lot to our team but its really difficult to pay a 3rd line center what he's gonna be worth for his new contract.

Trade value for trading him would be what Jeff Carter or Mike Richards went for last offseason I would think
.
I see Shero accepting that AT A MINIMUM. He'll ask for more, and I wouldn't be shocked if he gets it from someone.

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04-22-2012, 04:39 PM
  #184
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I think we should take note from the Flyers & find out the potential of player during the regular season. Tangradi gets 5 minutes a game all season we aren't going to learn anything about his potential. Regular season wins are nice & all but they key is finding the best team possible.

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04-22-2012, 04:43 PM
  #185
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Doakes View Post
1) What on earth has Tangradi EVER done to warrant being a top nine forward?
2) What has Jeffrey done to prove his an NHL regular?
3) James Wisnewski got $6 million, you think Suter will come cheaper?
4) Niskanen-Michalek, do you know how soft and bad that pairing is?
5) Your bottom four defenseman are horrible.
6) Goaltending is not improved.

=1st round playoff loss again.

You don't get it, Tangradi and others have not PROVEN or EARNED one thing, and our defense is WAY WAY too soft and our goaltending needs major improvements.
You need to calm down man! And what the ****? Read again tomorrow when you are less drunk and you can read (Suter's salary).

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04-22-2012, 04:43 PM
  #186
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Quote:
Originally Posted by eXile59 View Post
I think we should take note from the Flyers & find out the potential of player during the regular season. Tangradi gets 5 minutes a game all season we aren't going to learn anything about his potential. Regular season wins are nice & all but they key is finding the best team possible.
Completely agree. Make the playoffs, find out what you have, trade for what you learn you need. Everything else is meaningless...or detrimental to winning a cup.

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04-22-2012, 04:43 PM
  #187
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Why are we trading Staal again? You want to trade the players that don't show up in the playoffs, not the ones who do.

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04-22-2012, 04:44 PM
  #188
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I think that Staal getting traded is at least a good possibility. Cant trade Sid or Malkin. Malkin would be my choice to move but I dont think thats realistic, Also Malkin is more likely to come back to haunt us.

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04-22-2012, 04:44 PM
  #189
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Quote:
Originally Posted by M0NTY26 View Post
I've got $100 betting our top 4 looks exactly the same next season. Our D was godly last year, which will give them a "get out of jail free" card for this season.


I don't see Shero making any drastic moves this offseason. He'll just plug holes created from UFA, which I'll be fine with.

Our defense will rebound and we still have Malkin, Crosby, Staal, Neal, and Kunitz. Just like this year, we will once again be favorites to win the Cup, and we can only hope everyone is clicking at the same time. If thats the case, there isn't a team that can beat us.

At the beginning of the season, everyone was talking about this team like the early 90's Pens and rightfully so. We're stacked. Now our players just have to perform.
Martin getting benched 3 games in a row makes me think otherwise.

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04-22-2012, 04:45 PM
  #190
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Quote:
Originally Posted by eXile59 View Post
I think we should take note from the Flyers & find out the potential of player during the regular season. Tangradi gets 5 minutes a game all season we aren't going to learn anything about his potential. Regular season wins are nice & all but they key is finding the best team possible.
Also if Tangradi ISN'T a guy you want to move forward with, then it's better to find that out sooner rather than later. That way you could maybe package him with a deal at the deadline to make the team better. THATS why it's so important to give your young players a chance when there are roster openings. This team figured it would be a better idea to give the Chris Conners and Corey Potters of the world a shot instead these past few years. It's a ****ing joke.

Then people say, well these guys are playing better than the young players. That may be true, but these guys are also worthless as trade assets, and will not be with our organization for very long. Now you're left with what we have now.

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04-22-2012, 04:49 PM
  #191
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Originally Posted by MrBurgundy View Post
Also if Tangradi ISN'T a guy you want to move forward with, then it's better to find that out sooner rather than later. That way you could maybe package him with a deal at the deadline to make the team better. THATS why it's so important to give your young players a chance when there are roster openings. This team figured it would be a better idea to give the Chris Conners and Corey Potters of the world a shot instead these past few years. It's a ****ing joke.

Then people say, well these guys are playing better than the young players. That may be true, but these guys are also worthless as trade assets, and will not be with our organization for very long. Now you're left with what we have now.
Chris Conner played 60 games for the Pens last year, Tangradi 15. Conner played all 7 playoff games, Tangradi 1, just think about that for a second.

Conner, removed from Dan Bylsma, played 8 games in the NHL this year.

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04-22-2012, 04:52 PM
  #192
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Originally Posted by MrBurgundy View Post
Also if Tangradi ISN'T a guy you want to move forward with, then it's better to find that out sooner rather than later. That way you could maybe package him with a deal at the deadline to make the team better. THATS why it's so important to give your young players a chance when there are roster openings. This team figured it would be a better idea to give the Chris Conners and Corey Potters of the world a shot instead these past few years. It's a ****ing joke.

Then people say, well these guys are playing better than the young players. That may be true, but these guys are also worthless as trade assets, and will not be with our organization for very long. Now you're left with what we have now.
Even if Tangradi doesn't become an asset you see that he isn't & can move on from there. After the deadline though you got what you got.

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04-22-2012, 04:54 PM
  #193
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Originally Posted by M0NTY26 View Post
I've got $100 betting our top 4 looks exactly the same next season. Our D was godly last year, which will give them a "get out of jail free" card for this season.


I don't see Shero making any drastic moves this offseason. He'll just plug holes created from UFA, which I'll be fine with.

Our defense will rebound and we still have Malkin, Crosby, Staal, Neal, and Kunitz. Just like this year, we will once again be favorites to win the Cup, and we can only hope everyone is clicking at the same time. If thats the case, there isn't a team that can beat us.

At the beginning of the season, everyone was talking about this team like the early 90's Pens and rightfully so. We're stacked. Now our players just have to perform.
Did you just black out for the last two weeks?

We just got beat. While a 100% healthy, with a team that has spent more than almost every other team in the NHL.

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04-22-2012, 04:55 PM
  #194
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Originally Posted by KIRK View Post
So, then next year will be the last do over, or should one expect a fresh excuse?
If there's another first round exit, I'm sure there'll be some shake ups, but it'll also come at the same time a lot of contracts are up.

I know we have Sid and Geno, but you aren't going to win the Cup every year. We aren't the only team with a supremely stacked core. Theres Detroit, Washington, Anaheim, San Jose, Vancouver, and Chicago off the top of my head. Vancouver and Chicagos core is arguably better than ours because of their depth, yet only three of those teams have won a Cup since the lockout, and none twice.

Toews, Kane, Hossa, Sharp, Keith, Seabrook, Hjalmarsson.

Datsyuk, Zetterberg, Franzen, Lidstrom

Ovechkin, Backstrom, Semin, Green, Alzner, Carlson

Sedins, Kesler, Booth, Bieska, Hamhuis

Ryan, Getzlaf, Perry, Selanne

Thornton, Marleau, Havlat, Pavelski, Boyle, Burns

I know we all expect a core with Sidney Crosby and Evgeni Malkin to be a dynasty, but those things just don't exist anymore. We have a lot of talented players that have earned their big contracts, but so does every other team that makes the playoffs. Since the Cup, things haven't shaken out well for us. Out of all those loses, this one definitely stings the most because our big time goalie and our stacked top 4 didn't perform when it mattered most.

If our defense was **** last year, I'd expect big changes if they repeated this year. They were great last season and sucked this year. If they don't rebound next year, expect changes late in February. To think we need to blow it up is crazy though. This roster is massively more skilled than the team that won the Cup. We just need more team toughness and our defense to play like they're paid and we'll have a deep post season run next year.

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04-22-2012, 04:56 PM
  #195
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Martin getting benched 3 games in a row makes me think otherwise.
He played poorly most of the year, he is our highest paid defenseman, and we played better after he was benched...how can we justify keeping him.

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04-22-2012, 04:58 PM
  #196
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Originally Posted by phaneuf_fan_3 View Post
I think that Staal getting traded is at least a good possibility. Cant trade Sid or Malkin. Malkin would be my choice to move but I dont think thats realistic, Also Malkin is more likely to come back to haunt us.
I'm of two minds on Malkin: One, he'd probably be the easiest one to trade from a PR perspective, because the media will provide cover for keeping Staal over Malkin. Two, trading Malkin will come back to haunt the Penguins a lot more than replacing the coaching staff and trading a guy like Mr Soundbite would.

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04-22-2012, 05:01 PM
  #197
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Martin getting benched 3 games in a row makes me think otherwise.
He was benched the last 3 games, not just hurt?

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04-22-2012, 05:01 PM
  #198
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I would trade Crosby way before I'd trade Malkin. Crosbys head scares the **** out of my. With the way surgery can fix knees, I'd put money on Malkins knee before Crosbys head.

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04-22-2012, 05:01 PM
  #199
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Originally Posted by M0NTY26 View Post
If there's another first round exit, I'm sure there'll be some shake ups, but it'll also come at the same time a lot of contracts are up.

I know we have Sid and Geno, but you aren't going to win the Cup every year. We aren't the only team with a supremely stacked core. Theres Detroit, Washington, Anaheim, San Jose, Vancouver, and Chicago off the top of my head. Vancouver and Chicagos core is arguably better than ours because of their depth, yet only three of those teams have won a Cup since the lockout, and none twice.

Toews, Kane, Hossa, Sharp, Keith, Seabrook, Hjalmarsson.

Datsyuk, Zetterberg, Franzen, Lidstrom

Ovechkin, Backstrom, Semin, Green, Alzner, Carlson

Sedins, Kesler, Booth, Bieska, Hamhuis

Ryan, Getzlaf, Perry, Selanne

Thornton, Marleau, Havlat, Pavelski, Boyle, Burns

I know we all expect a core with Sidney Crosby and Evgeni Malkin to be a dynasty, but those things just don't exist anymore. We have a lot of talented players that have earned their big contracts, but so does every other team that makes the playoffs. Since the Cup, things haven't shaken out well for us. Out of all those loses, this one definitely stings the most because our big time goalie and our stacked top 4 didn't perform when it mattered most.

If our defense was **** last year, I'd expect big changes if they repeated this year. They were great last season and sucked this year. If they don't rebound next year, expect changes late in February. To think we need to blow it up is crazy though. This roster is massively more skilled than the team that won the Cup. We just need more team toughness and our defense to play like they're paid and we'll have a deep post season run next year.
This wait until next year crap expired. We are not talking dynasty. We are talking make it past the first round at this point. With this talented of a team it shouldn't be that hard.

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04-22-2012, 05:03 PM
  #200
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Originally Posted by KIRK View Post
I'm of two minds on Malkin: One, he'd probably be the easiest one to trade from a PR perspective, because the media will provide cover for keeping Staal over Malkin. Two, trading Malkin will come back to haunt the Penguins a lot more than replacing the coaching staff and trading a guy like Mr Soundbite would.
I can't see any scenario would they would trade either Sid or Malkin. You can never get the type of return that would justify trading 2 guys who are clearly top 5 players in the league.

I honestly can't think of anyone who would prefer to keep Staal over Geno. Geno in his worst season has been better than Staal's best and salaries won't be very different. Trading Staal makes sense when you look at his upcoming free agency, being 3rd on the totem pole and the fact that the Pens have glaring problems at D and goalie. In a perfect world, they find a way to keep all 3, but the team has too many holes to just let Staal walk as a UFA.

People have been talking about trading Staal for about 5 years now, don't think there would be any fan backlash about it, there would huge amounts for any Sid/Geno trade.

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