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International Tournaments Discuss international tournaments such as the World Juniors, Olympic hockey, and Ice Hockey World Championships, as they take place; or discuss past tournaments.

U18 day 9 SEMIFINALS Fin-Swe & Can-USA

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Old
04-21-2012, 01:34 PM
  #226
habsrule4eva3089
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cagney View Post
It's still annoying to see the way so many Canadians say this tournament doesn't mean anything because they can't bring their best. I'm not going to make an argument that the Ivan Hlinka isn't relevant because the US doesn't bring it's best. Take these tournaments for what they are. I am proud of the US achievements at this tournament while acknowledging the advantages we have in it.
This tournament does mean something even if we don't send out best. Personally for me it's a good thing the CHL playoffs are going on so this way we can see if there's any other potential World Junior calibre players in the depth pool other then the obvious candidates. Even if it means we don't end up on top of this tourney it's still a very good evaluation tool. If we sent the the best u-18 or each year it would be a romp similar to the Ivan Hlinka and that just wouldn't be fun. And let's be honest how many countries can even contemplate to send a B team that competes for Gold each year like Canada, answers none, which is a good way of testing the depth of the talent in the junior leagues and giving those players the international exposure.

And as far as if we sent our best, i'm guessing it would look something of this variety which is scary to see, especially the combination on the backend...

Hunter Shinkaruk Sean Monahan Kerby Rychel
Sam Reinhart Nathan Mackinnon Charles Hudon
Brendan Gaunce Troy Bourke Scott Laughton
Felix Girard Gemel Smith Michael Winther
Scott Kosmachuk

Morgan Rielly Slater Koekkoek
Mathew Dumba Derrick Pouliot
Adam Pelech Griffin Reinhart
Ryan Pulock

Matt Murray
Daniel Altshuller


Last edited by habsrule4eva3089: 04-21-2012 at 01:40 PM.
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Old
04-21-2012, 02:17 PM
  #227
Ilyeu
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Same excuse every year on HF and TSN:

- USA is favourite/suppose to win
- USA trains for two years
- Canada's best players aren't available.

Bottom Line: It's up to Hockey Canada to come up with some preparation to do better at this tournament with current crop of players or the IIHF has to alter schedules. That's if people want to prevent the US from winning the next 7 straight. They're 'supposed' to win this tournament, right?

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Old
04-21-2012, 02:46 PM
  #228
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Quote:
Originally Posted by slovakiasnextone View Post
And the US actually plays with a B squad there, donīt they. So basically the Ivan Hlinka isnīt anymore of a best on best than the U18 WC - at the U18 WC Canada has a B team (well not even completely a B team) and other teams miss some players from CHL or European pro play-offs and at the Ivan Hlinka US plays with a B team and European teams miss some of their players that are playing at the U20 tournaments.

Does anyone please know the groups for next year? The system for determining the groups itīs the same like in the WJC, right?
01
04
05 Russia
08 Czech Republic
09 Latvia

02
03
06 Germany
07 Switzerland
10 Slovakia

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04-21-2012, 04:26 PM
  #229
KevyD
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ilyeu View Post
Same excuse every year on HF and TSN:

- USA is favourite/suppose to win
- USA trains for two years
- Canada's best players aren't available.

Bottom Line: It's up to Hockey Canada to come up with some preparation to do better at this tournament with current crop of players or the IIHF has to alter schedules. That's if people want to prevent the US from winning the next 7 straight. They're 'supposed' to win this tournament, right?
If Hockey Canada and most Canadians don't care about the U-18's why would they alter anything? Besides, it is far easier to move this tournament than it is to alter the CHL playoffs.

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04-21-2012, 04:32 PM
  #230
slovakiasnextone
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zorz View Post
01
04
05 Russia
08 Czech Republic
09 Latvia

02
03
06 Germany
07 Switzerland
10 Slovakia
Thanks. Not too bad for us, sucks for you though once again...

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Old
04-21-2012, 10:16 PM
  #231
Jussi
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KevyD View Post
If Hockey Canada and most Canadians don't care about the U-18's why would they alter anything? Besides, it is far easier to move this tournament than it is to alter the CHL playoffs.
I would think it would be easier to shorten the regular season in CHL by ~10 games. At least than they'd have better players to choose from.

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04-21-2012, 10:24 PM
  #232
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Originally Posted by Jussi View Post
I would think it would be easier to shorten the regular season in CHL by ~10 games. At least than they'd have better players to choose from.
Oh come on... For a tournament no one in Canada cares about? Don't hold your breath my friend.

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Old
04-22-2012, 12:07 PM
  #233
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I'm not disappointed in Canada's showing. To throw together a bunch of kids a couple of weeks before the tournament and expect them to win gold every year is unrealistic. No one can afford to do what the US does, well, other than the US. The results of this tournament only determine who the best club team is. Imagine if Sweden, Finland, Russia etc could afford to do what the Americans do......you wouldn't see 7-0 gold medal games.

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Old
04-22-2012, 12:55 PM
  #234
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Originally Posted by KevyD View Post
Oh come on... For a tournament no one in Canada cares about? Don't hold your breath my friend.
Well then stop complaining about when the tournament is held!

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Old
04-22-2012, 05:51 PM
  #235
Yakushev72
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KevyD View Post
If Hockey Canada and most Canadians don't care about the U-18's why would they alter anything? Besides, it is far easier to move this tournament than it is to alter the CHL playoffs.
I don't think it would be easier to move this tournament, given the fact that some European countries, Russia included, start their training camps in early August, and their season in late August or early September. League schedules around the world don't conform to the same time frames. I favor best-on-best tournaments, but it will always be hard to schedule them in a way that's fair to everyone. Maybe early July is the only time that every country has a blank schedule.

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Old
04-22-2012, 05:58 PM
  #236
Yakushev72
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Quote:
Originally Posted by habsrule4eva3089 View Post
This tournament does mean something even if we don't send out best. Personally for me it's a good thing the CHL playoffs are going on so this way we can see if there's any other potential World Junior calibre players in the depth pool other then the obvious candidates. Even if it means we don't end up on top of this tourney it's still a very good evaluation tool. If we sent the the best u-18 or each year it would be a romp similar to the Ivan Hlinka and that just wouldn't be fun. And let's be honest how many countries can even contemplate to send a B team that competes for Gold each year like Canada, answers none, which is a good way of testing the depth of the talent in the junior leagues and giving those players the international exposure.

And as far as if we sent our best, i'm guessing it would look something of this variety which is scary to see, especially the combination on the backend...

Hunter Shinkaruk Sean Monahan Kerby Rychel
Sam Reinhart Nathan Mackinnon Charles Hudon
Brendan Gaunce Troy Bourke Scott Laughton
Felix Girard Gemel Smith Michael Winther
Scott Kosmachuk

Morgan Rielly Slater Koekkoek
Mathew Dumba Derrick Pouliot
Adam Pelech Griffin Reinhart
Ryan Pulock

Matt Murray
Daniel Altshuller
I've seen Canadian posters refer to this year's Canadian entry as the "B" team. But as I look at your list, I see a lot of names from this team who you include on the "A" team (Shinkaruk, Dumba, etc.). Maybe it would be more accurate to say that these guys were the "A" team of players eliminated from the CHL playoffs.

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Old
04-22-2012, 06:35 PM
  #237
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Originally Posted by Yakushev72 View Post
I've seen Canadian posters refer to this year's Canadian entry as the "B" team. But as I look at your list, I see a lot of names from this team who you include on the "A" team (Shinkaruk, Dumba, etc.). Maybe it would be more accurate to say that these guys were the "A" team of players eliminated from the CHL playoffs.
Not even really close, they just wanted to give other players a look, most of these players won't wear a team Canada sweater again, really not much high end talent here.

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04-22-2012, 06:42 PM
  #238
habsrule4eva3089
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Yakushev72 View Post
I've seen Canadian posters refer to this year's Canadian entry as the "B" team. But as I look at your list, I see a lot of names from this team who you include on the "A" team (Shinkaruk, Dumba, etc.). Maybe it would be more accurate to say that these guys were the "A" team of players eliminated from the CHL playoffs.
Well put, A team of players eliminated or B team from all players available , either way the tournament is at the perfect time and hopefully never gets changed. Hockey would be boring if it was all about Best on Best at each tournament, it should only be such at the Olympic level. Every player or kid has their own story of how they got there and i'm glad I got to know some of those kids during this tourney thanks to TSN and the difficulties and hurdles they had to overcome to arrive at this moment and wear their national jersey. Some of these players will never again step on this stage and some people on here might think just because we don't send our best and don't win Gold it doesn't mean anything but for some of these kids this Bronze might very well be the one of the highlights of their Hockey careers so good on them!


Last edited by habsrule4eva3089: 04-22-2012 at 06:48 PM.
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04-22-2012, 07:55 PM
  #239
2525
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I'm confused by some of my fellow Canadians on here.
Give these kids their due for representing Canada. They lost to the eventual winner by a goal in each game (yes I know the first game was by 2, but it was an empty net goal)
Canada threw together a bunch of kids to play in this tournament and you expect better results? Come on, they played well, seemed slow and tired at times but that's to be expected.
Put this team together 2 years ago, have them play, sleep, study and eat together, you really think they'd have won bronze?
The Americans build their team with one purpose...to win, anything else is a failure. They're fortunate that Gary bankrolls their team.
There's rumours now, USA hockey will start a national under 16 team too. For them it's all about winning.

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04-23-2012, 12:48 PM
  #240
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Originally Posted by 2525 View Post
I'm confused by some of my fellow Canadians on here.
Give these kids their due for representing Canada. They lost to the eventual winner by a goal in each game (yes I know the first game was by 2, but it was an empty net goal)
Canada threw together a bunch of kids to play in this tournament and you expect better results? Come on, they played well, seemed slow and tired at times but that's to be expected.
Put this team together 2 years ago, have them play, sleep, study and eat together, you really think they'd have won bronze?
The Americans build their team with one purpose...to win, anything else is a failure. They're fortunate that Gary bankrolls their team.
There's rumours now, USA hockey will start a national under 16 team too. For them it's all about winning.
Don't want to leave the impression that I'm disappointed with their effort at all. To be put together a week before the tourney is tough. They did themselves proud.

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