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Quebec tuition crisis thread

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Old
04-20-2012, 01:27 PM
  #26
Montreal Typical
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This is a disgusting situation. We have a corrupt government and a spoiled population... a recipe for disaster.

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Old
04-20-2012, 01:41 PM
  #27
Ol' Jase
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mathradio View Post
There's still 170,000 students on strike (both CEGEP and university) at this late jecture.



As I said on the Habs board, if you want to compare Quebec tuition you mustn't limit yourself to just Canada. Because Quebec draws, and competes for, students from all over the world.
So do many other Canadian schools.

I'm just a little confused as to what Quebec students believe they are entitled to.

So there is no confusion, I am not against the protesting of these tuition hikes at all, as they are far to high all over the country, I just don't remember Quebec giving two ***** about it when it was happening all over the rest of the country.

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Old
04-20-2012, 01:43 PM
  #28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by buddahsmoka1 View Post
Comparing it to anything has no relevance, on either side of the coin.

What only matters is what Quebecois' want, what others pay for their education has no bearing whatsoever.
Excuse me?

If a province like Alberta or Saskatchewan had this attitude towards anything at all there would be shouting from the rooftops.

Transfer payments and all that, remember?

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Old
04-20-2012, 01:47 PM
  #29
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ol' Jase View Post
Excuse me?

If a province like Alberta or Saskatchewan had this attitude towards anything at all there would be shouting from the rooftops.

Transfer payments and all that, remember?
Do we really need to go towards this idiotic and completely irrelevant path again?

Oh and BTW, I don't think people give a crap what goes on in Alberta or Sask as much as you think.

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Old
04-20-2012, 01:48 PM
  #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ol' Jase View Post
So there is no confusion, I am not against the protesting of these tuition hikes at all, as they are far to high all over the country, I just don't remember Quebec giving two ***** about it when it was happening all over the rest of the country.
And why the hell should they?

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Old
04-20-2012, 01:55 PM
  #31
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Railman View Post
We have a corrupt government and a spoiled population... a recipe for disaster.
An accurate and succinct description of politics in Quebec.

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04-20-2012, 01:57 PM
  #32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by buddahsmoka1 View Post
And why the hell should they?
Exactly!

So I'm sure that saying "I couldn't give less of a **** about Quebec students and how much tuition they pay" is more than OK then.

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Old
04-20-2012, 01:59 PM
  #33
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Look what happened in BC. Tuition has become totally unaffordable. In the Lower Mainland, a 16 credit (about 3-4 courses) semester can cost around $3,500...Luckily I was one of the last crop of students that was able to graduate without accumulating too much debt. I was paying near $1900/semester back in 05.

This has subsequently caused another issue here. The dramatic influx of foreign students (international students). These kids are literally spoiled; given BMW's and apartments on-campus or in other prime locations. Ridiculous, yet we always perceive protesters as spoiled brats.

Quote:
As of September 2011, SFU has approximately 4182 international undergraduate students (up 16.9%) and 1065 international graduate students (up 16.7%) for a total of over 5247.
http://students.sfu.ca/international/facts.html

That number was less than 8% back in 05.

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Old
04-20-2012, 02:00 PM
  #34
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ol' Jase View Post
Exactly!

So I'm sure that if I say "I couldn't give less of a **** about Quebec students and how much tuition they pay" is more than OK then.
I never said otherwise.

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Old
04-20-2012, 02:03 PM
  #35
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Just another pawn View Post
Look what happened in BC. Tuition has become totally unaffordable. In the Lower Mainland, a 16 credit (about 3-4 courses) semester can cost around $3,500...Luckily I was one of the last crop of students that was able to graduate without accumulating too much debt. I was paying near $1900/semester back in 05.

This has subsequently caused another issue here. The dramatic influx of foreign students (international students). These kids are literally spoiled; given BMW's and apartments on-campus or in other prime locations. Ridiculous, yet we always perceive protesters as spoiled brats.



http://students.sfu.ca/international/facts.html

That number was less than 8% back in 05.
Be careful with that correlation.

There are many reasons why international students are skyrocketing in
Vancouver; not the least of which is Asian students coming into the Canadian high school system, dropping straight As and having way better transcripts than Canadian counterparts.

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Old
04-20-2012, 02:04 PM
  #36
Ol' Jase
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Quote:
Originally Posted by buddahsmoka1 View Post
I never said otherwise.
So in the interest of discussion, who is going to pay for post-secondary costs in Quebec if the students won't?

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Old
04-20-2012, 02:07 PM
  #37
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ol' Jase View Post
So in the interest of discussion, who is going to pay for post-secondary costs in Quebec if the students won't?
The expenditures budget is huge in Quebec, and post-secondary spending makes up a very, very tiny portion of it. I am sure you can figure it out.

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04-20-2012, 02:08 PM
  #38
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Quote:
Originally Posted by buddahsmoka1 View Post
The expenditures budget is huge in Quebec, and post-secondary spending makes up a very, very tiny portion of it. I am sure you can figure it out.
So the government is supposed to pay for it is what you're saying.

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Old
04-20-2012, 02:13 PM
  #39
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ol' Jase View Post
So the government is supposed to pay for it is what you're saying.
Yup. Kind of what they are there for, to pay for public goods.

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Old
04-20-2012, 02:17 PM
  #40
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DeathFromAbove View Post
An accurate and succinct description of politics in Quebec.
I'd say it's an accurate description of politics in western "democracies" in general.

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Old
04-20-2012, 02:17 PM
  #41
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Quote:
Originally Posted by buddahsmoka1 View Post
Be careful with that correlation.

There are many reasons why international students are skyrocketing in
Vancouver; not the least of which is Asian students coming into the Canadian high school system, dropping straight As and having way better transcripts than Canadian counterparts.
I'm not sure about the correlation in Vancouver, but I read something similar not long ago for what's going on in Quebec. The article was saying basically how the Universities want to favor international students as much as possible, that it was a big business. # of international students went from around 9000 in 2003 to 26000 in 2010, which is a pretty major increase over 7 years.

If you read French here's the article about it. Not sure how accurate is all the reasoning in it, but it's definitely worth thinking about when discussing all this:

http://www.lautjournal.info/default....=3&NewsId=3623

I do see this as a big societal choice for Quebec right now, and it's pretty clear what each side thinks.

And kinda OT, but man that protest in Montreal seems to be degenerating quite badly right now. And our Prime Minister that is in a building at the center of all of it to discuss to potential investors his plan to develop mining in the far north of Quebec (another controversial plan in Quebec's politics) says 'we can offer them a job if they want. Far in the North if possible'. What an idiot...

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Old
04-20-2012, 02:18 PM
  #42
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Good on them. I wish the New Brunswick population was a little more progressive and would protest like this. Maybe then I wouldn't be paying so much or school.

Solidarity

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Old
04-20-2012, 02:19 PM
  #43
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PM making fun of the protest during an interview.... I might be against a lot of things that happened in the last days but dam this guy is ignorant

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Old
04-20-2012, 02:19 PM
  #44
Ol' Jase
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Quote:
Originally Posted by buddahsmoka1 View Post
Yup. Kind of what they are there for, to pay for public goods.
OK, so where does that money have to come from?

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Old
04-20-2012, 02:23 PM
  #45
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ol' Jase View Post
OK, so where does that money have to come from?
We pay on average 10% more income taxes in Quebec than in the rest of the country. A guy that makes 50k a year will give 5000$/year more than you. At some point it has to pay for something. It's a matter of what the population decides to invest that money into. I personally think that education is a worthy choice, but we could also go for 9 (oops sorry, 25) billion $ jets.

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Old
04-20-2012, 02:27 PM
  #46
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ol' Jase View Post
OK, so where does that money have to come from?
Taxes...

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Old
04-20-2012, 02:28 PM
  #47
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Patccmoi View Post
I'm not sure about the correlation in Vancouver, but I read something similar not long ago for what's going on in Quebec. The article was saying basically how the Universities want to favor international students as much as possible, that it was a big business. # of international students went from around 9000 in 2003 to 26000 in 2010, which is a pretty major increase over 7 years.

If you read French here's the article about it. Not sure how accurate is all the reasoning in it, but it's definitely worth thinking about when discussing all this:

http://www.lautjournal.info/default....=3&NewsId=3623

I do see this as a big societal choice for Quebec right now, and it's pretty clear what each side thinks.

And kinda OT, but man that protest in Montreal seems to be degenerating quite badly right now. And our Prime Minister that is in a building at the center of all of it to discuss to potential investors his plan to develop mining in the far north of Quebec (another controversial plan in Quebec's politics) says 'we can offer them a job if they want. Far in the North if possible'. What an idiot...
International students currently pay modulated tuition, i.e. social science students pay less than pure and applied science ones, but I think this has to stop.

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Old
04-20-2012, 02:31 PM
  #48
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Basically the hike is based on a BS study made by the rectors themselves saying they need more money, without showing any proof or giving any numbers for how much they're lacking. Also the bureaucratic expenditures have exploded during the last few years, and rectors have been spending money left and right on useless projects. For example, one university lost 500 millions investing in an estate project.

So the students are asking for legit studies and "cutting in the fat" of management before making education less accessible. With the corrupted government on an ending mendate that is in power right now, big social changes like that have to be performed by the next government.

Also to anyone new in this debate, the "spoiled kids" talk is for primitive people who can't handle a social debate like this one. The students are also taxpayers and will pay their huge share of income taxes once they get out of university, so they have every right to protest.

Finally to anyone blaming Québecois and saying they're spoiled by perequation, the constitution has not been signed by Québec so we can't be held responsible for decisions that were made without our agreement.

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Old
04-20-2012, 02:32 PM
  #49
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mathradio View Post
International students currently pay modulated tuition, i.e. social science students pay less than pure and applied science ones, but I think this has to stop.
I actually agree with streamed tuition, and this is coming from someone who pays more than double than Quebecois students.

International students should pay more for attending Canadian education institutions because they are using our national resources and probably not investing much back into the system.

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Old
04-20-2012, 02:33 PM
  #50
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Quote:
Originally Posted by buddahsmoka1 View Post
Failing 170,000 students seems quite logical.
If Charest wants to show that the National Assembley governs in Quebec, not some entitled students; it actually is the only logical solution.

You and I both know that the 'unions' won't accept anything but a complete reversal from the government, and therefore, if the government has the courage of its convictions, it really has only the one choice.

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