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Am getting the feeling that media (aside from TSN) is behing NHLPA's proposal

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12-10-2004, 11:22 AM
  #1
True Blue
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Am getting the feeling that media (aside from TSN) is behing NHLPA's proposal

http://sports.espn.go.com/nhl/columns/story?id=1943063

By reading that, it makes me think that the media thinks that the onus to save the season (and the NHL) has shifted from the players to being squarely on Bettman after this last proposal. Off course the article still thinks that the season is lost becuase Bettman is going to come back with his hardcap mantra.
I happen to agree. And not because I am on the NHLPA's side. The givebacks that the NHLPA gave is unprecedented. The 24% rollback is unheard of. To be able to immediately slash 24% of payroll is unheard of. Salary arbitration is squarely on the owners side. Or would be if they accept.
IMO, the players definetly gave. Will Bettman? If he cannot use this offer as a platform to save a season, then he is truly going to be the death knell of the NHL.

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12-10-2004, 11:37 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by True Blue
http://sports.espn.go.com/nhl/columns/story?id=1943063

By reading that, it makes me think that the media thinks that the onus to save the season (and the NHL) has shifted from the players to being squarely on Bettman after this last proposal. Off course the article still thinks that the season is lost becuase Bettman is going to come back with his hardcap mantra.
I happen to agree. And not because I am on the NHLPA's side. The givebacks that the NHLPA gave is unprecedented. The 24% rollback is unheard of. To be able to immediately slash 24% of payroll is unheard of. Salary arbitration is squarely on the owners side. Or would be if they accept.
IMO, the players definetly gave. Will Bettman? If he cannot use this offer as a platform to save a season, then he is truly going to be the death knell of the NHL.
Other than TSN, the media definitely has shifted. I honestly believe Bettman will now come under pressure from big spending owners in general now because their overall operating costs just came down dramatically (24% decrease in salaries plus decreases in bonuses), which inturn causes their franchise value to increase.

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12-10-2004, 12:13 PM
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Melrose_Jr.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by True Blue
Off course the article still thinks that the season is lost becuase Bettman is going to come back with his hardcap mantra.
I think if the owners are behind this proposal, Bettman's forced to accept it. Regardless of his own personal agenda, he's only speaking on their behalf.

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12-10-2004, 12:37 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Melrose_Jr.
I think if the owners are behind this proposal, Bettman's forced to accept it. Regardless of his own personal agenda, he's only speaking on their behalf.
It all depends on the number of owners.

Bettman only needs 8 on his side, so if 18 or 20 are in favor of this NHLPA proposal (with some modifications), they still don't have enough to overthrow Bettman, Jacobs, Karmonos, Wirtz etc. etc.

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12-10-2004, 12:40 PM
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True Blue
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Melrose_Jr.
I think if the owners are behind this proposal, Bettman's forced to accept it. Regardless of his own personal agenda, he's only speaking on their behalf.
Actually, here is where it gets dicey. Bettman only needs 8 out of 30 votes to cancel a season. There have been rumblinbs previously that said that even if the NHLPA were to march in and agree to anything Bettman says, there would still be at least 6 owners that would vote to cancel a season. So, I have no doubts that there are those that will still opt for that option. However, if the great majority of the owners think that this is enough to work on, then Bettman is in trouble. I am betting that if the majority of the owners want to have a season, but he goes ahead and cancels it anyway, the whole thing goes to court.
Nevermind that I have a strong feeling that if Bettman does go through and cancels the season, he will have a media firestorm on his hands. This is a very serious proposal. If he cannot make it work, he will have media from 2 countries screaming murder at him. At that point, the owners may not have a choice but to fire him.

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12-10-2004, 12:42 PM
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Son of Steinbrenner
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Melrose_Jr.
I think if the owners are behind this proposal, Bettman's forced to accept it. Regardless of his own personal agenda, he's only speaking on their behalf.
You hit the nail on the head. What some people have a hard time understanding is bettman works for the owners. If the owners tell bettman to accept this deal than he has too. If the owners tell bettman to not accept this deal than he has too. I have a feeling that bettman is getting presure now from owners to look further into the nhlpa proposal. I can see the owners asking for a higher luxary tax perhaps .50 cents over 40 million?

funny i don't find tsn front page article to be biased as TB has suggested but they have been in the past.
http://www.tsn.ca/nhl/news_story.asp?id=107451
Sources indicate the union's offer was significant and addressed some of the league's concerns but still didn't include a link between player costs and league revenues - a salary cap, in other words.

Among the major points in today's proposal, the NHLPA has offered a 24% rollback on salaries and 20 cent tax on payroll over $45 million. The tax rises to 50 cents on the dollar over $50 million and 60 cents on the dollar over $60 million. The owners would also gain on entry level contracts with a cap on bonuses as well as arbitration rights.

the media is putting presure on bettman though i'll allow tb that.
http://slam.canoe.ca/Slam/Columnists...10/776679.html

http://slam.canoe.ca/Slam/Columnists...10/776673.html

http://slam.canoe.ca/Slam/Hockey/NHL...10/776688.html

http://msn.foxsports.com/story/3234100

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12-10-2004, 12:44 PM
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True Blue
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Son of Steinbrenner
You hit the nail on the head. What some people have a hard time understanding is bettman works for the owners. If the owners tell bettman to accept this deal than he has too. If the owners tell bettman to not accept this deal than he has too.
And what happens if the usual 8 suspects tell him to cancel the season and the rest are against it? He only needs the 8 to cancel.

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12-10-2004, 12:49 PM
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SoS...

I think that TSN has had a couple different articles on the same subject there, but the most recent is not biased.

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12-10-2004, 12:50 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by True Blue
And what happens if the usual 8 suspects tell him to cancel the season and the rest are against it? He only needs the 8 to cancel.
first of all please provide some sort of source material that says 6 owners would cancel the season even if the nhlpa accepts everything the owners want? i'm not even asking for a link just an simple answer of who said this.

what if the 8 usual suspects tell bettman to cancel the season and the rest are againts it? bettman is screwed than. i think bettman is screwed if he doesn't negotiate off this proposal. 25% giveback is a do over for the owners and they should be presuring him to accept some form of the nhlpa proposal.

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12-10-2004, 12:51 PM
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Son of Steinbrenner
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fletch
I think that TSN has had a couple different articles on the same subject there, but the most recent is not biased.
i'm not denying tsn hasn't been pro-owners but it seems like they have been very fair since the players came back with this proposal.

here is what bob mackenzie has to say
http://www.tsn.ca/columnists/bob_mckenzie.asp

biased?

i don't think so


Last edited by Son of Steinbrenner: 12-10-2004 at 12:57 PM.
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12-10-2004, 12:58 PM
  #11
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I did say...

'but the most recent is not biased.'

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12-10-2004, 01:00 PM
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True Blue
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Son of Steinbrenner
first of all please provide some sort of source material that says 6 owners would cancel the season even if the nhlpa accepts everything the owners want? i'm not even asking for a link just an simple answer of who said this.
It was in an ESPN article the other month. I would have to look through the entire archive to provide the actual link. Anyway, within the article the author (Maybe Frei?) said that there are "sources" that claimed that there are owners that would vote to cancel the season no matter what.
But, back to the other question. So what do you, SOS, think will happen if 8 say that this proposal is not enough, and the rest want to have a season? Just curious. Personally, I think that at that point, any owner unity is shattered and the whole thing lands in court, with owners suing owners.

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12-10-2004, 01:01 PM
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Son of Steinbrenner
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fletch
'but the most recent is not biased.'
i know. i was more or less responding to the headline of this thread.

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12-10-2004, 01:08 PM
  #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by True Blue
It was in an ESPN article the other month. I would have to look through the entire archive to provide the actual link. Anyway, within the article the author (Maybe Frei?) said that there are "sources" that claimed that there are owners that would vote to cancel the season no matter what.
But, back to the other question. So what do you, SOS, think will happen if 8 say that this proposal is not enough, and the rest want to have a season? Just curious. Personally, I think that at that point, any owner unity is shattered and the whole thing lands in court, with owners suing owners.
i don't think it will ever come down to owners suing owners. what are the odds of the vote being 22-8 and if it is 22-8 how hard would it be for owners to persuade one guy to change his vote?

I don't think bettman and the owners saw that proposal coming and i'm sure some owners are getting to bettman now telling him to either accept this offer or negotiate off this offer.

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12-10-2004, 05:25 PM
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Even if Bettman has his 8 votes, he still can't ignore the rest of the owners. If 15 or 16 want to deal and Bettman does not, he may be okay, but if 20 or so want to deal, Bettman better deal. If he doesn't, he'll find himself unemployed very quickly unless he brokers a deal that's a colossal, undisputed win for the owners. He can't piss off 2/3 of his bosses and get away with it.

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12-10-2004, 06:22 PM
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It might only take 8 owners to cancel the season but how many does it take to change their original ruling? 51%? 67%?

If the same 8 owners are being difficult about accepting an offer while the remaining are for it, I am sure a motion can be called to restructure their stance on internal votes.

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12-10-2004, 08:41 PM
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FLYLine24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Melrose_Jr.
I think if the owners are behind this proposal, Bettman's forced to accept it. Regardless of his own personal agenda, he's only speaking on their behalf.

Is he really? I have never got that impression. I dont think Bettman will accept it even if 16 GMS want to accept.

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