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I am reading between the lines and want to think Shero said Malkin is available...

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Old
04-25-2012, 12:59 PM
  #176
HockeyGuruPitka
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does anyone have a link to the presser? I find it hard to believe Shera subliminally put Malkin on the block.

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04-25-2012, 12:59 PM
  #177
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I doubt the Avs will go after Malkin. He'd cost so much! But, just a throw in the dark value here:

Duchene + Erik Johnson + 2 of Hishon/Sagbrossa/Elliott/Barrie (Hishon is skating but understable if Pens prefer another prospect) + 1st round pick in 2013.

I'd assume that's what a conn smythe, mvp winning, 50 goal scoring player would garner. A young center, top pairing no. 1 potential dman, two blue chip prospects and a 1st rounder.

Overpayment? **** YES! Avs would/shouldn't consider it. But this is what I think the pens would expect.

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04-25-2012, 01:00 PM
  #178
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Quote:
Originally Posted by price131 View Post
Pacioretty, Subban, Montreal's 1st, Tinordi/Beaulieu.
Take out one one of Subban or Pacioretty and the deal will make sense.

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04-25-2012, 01:00 PM
  #179
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There's nothing on the Leafs I wouldn't trade. Kessel, Gardiner, 1sts, take what you need.

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04-25-2012, 01:00 PM
  #180
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Originally Posted by Dylonus View Post
I just listened to the Press Conference... He didn't say this, at all. He said he wants them all here and wants to do what he can to keep all three, but it depends on the new CBA.

I didn't hear the conference, but this makes the most sense.
And, if one was to be traded, it would most likely be Staal, to get something vs risk he bolts following year as UFA.

That said, IF IF IF IF IF IF IF IF IF IF IF IF IF IF IF IF
Malkin available for ridiculous overpayment, and ignoring div. rivalry factor, and ignoring NTC/NMC:

Lundqvist, Richards, Gaborik, Stepan, Girardi
for
Malkin + J. Staal

you can flip MAF for highest offer.

That would be costly but worth it.

Pens get best G profit
Richards, Gaborik to offset, reduce loss of Malkin-Staal
Stepan + Girardi = added profit

which is the PREMIUM overcompensation you pay for worlds best player.

Pens 3 Fs (2 Cs) replacing 2 Fs (2Cs)
+ a D + a G

Rangers not too shabby, after this, though a bit depleted.
Have follow up options...

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04-25-2012, 01:00 PM
  #181
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Originally Posted by HockeyGuruPitka View Post
does anyone have a link to the presser? I find it hard to believe Shera subliminally put Malkin on the block.
I think it's up on the Pens site. Just save yourself some time, he didn't.

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04-25-2012, 01:05 PM
  #182
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Why do people.keep offering lesser centers as part of the package? The problem ( and the reason for this ridiculus thread) is that the Pens have too many centers!

While Kopitar is a great center...he doesnt fix anything. Tavares is a great player...but it doesnt fix anything. Wings + stud dmen...thats it.

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04-25-2012, 01:10 PM
  #183
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Honestly wouldn't Edmonton be a near perfect partner?

Can offer an elite winger on an ELC, gets Malkin out of the conference, gives Pitts potentially a great pick next year, and an Elite Defensive prospect.

Yakupov
Lander/Gagner
2013 1st
Klefbom

for Malkin
Martin

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04-25-2012, 01:10 PM
  #184
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bernmeister View Post
I didn't hear the conference, but this makes the most sense.
And, if one was to be traded, it would most likely be Staal, to get something vs risk he bolts following year as UFA.

That said, IF IF IF IF IF IF IF IF IF IF IF IF IF IF IF IF
Malkin available for ridiculous overpayment, and ignoring div. rivalry factor, and ignoring NTC/NMC:

Lundqvist, Richards, Gaborik, Stepan, Girardi
for
Malkin + J. Staal

you can flip MAF for highest offer.

That would be costly but worth it.

Pens get best G profit
Richards, Gaborik to offset, reduce loss of Malkin-Staal
Stepan + Girardi = added profit

which is the PREMIUM overcompensation you pay for worlds best player.

Pens 3 Fs (2 Cs) replacing 2 Fs (2Cs)
+ a D + a G

Rangers not too shabby, after this, though a bit depleted.
Have follow up options...


Yeah that would be awesome! Give up our #1 goalie with no prospects good enough to take over in a nearby future. Then trade one of our few RD's.


Would be nice to get Malkin and Staal but getting them would destroy us as a club.


Have you ever heard the term: ''one man does not make a team''?



We would be worse after this deal. Get Malkin but trade away all offense and let him do it all himself somehow doesn't seem smart.

Not to mention gutting our D.

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04-25-2012, 01:14 PM
  #185
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Happy Hallidays View Post
Honestly wouldn't Edmonton be a near perfect partner?

Can offer an elite winger on an ELC, gets Malkin out of the conference, gives Pitts potentially a great pick next year, and an Elite Defensive prospect.

Yakupov
Lander/Gagner
2013 1st
Klefbom

for Malkin
Martin
To answer your question, no, and definately not based on that package.

First, I don't see the Penguins moving Malkin for a package in which Yakupov is the most important piece--he won't peak for, what, 5-6 years? That's a bit out of line with the rest of the Penguins core.

Second, Edmonton doesn't have an excess of young, top-end NHL defensemen (to put it charitably). Assuming the Penguins move Malkin, I'd expect that the package would have to include a young, near-peak wing and a young, near-peak top-pairing defenseman.

The Blues wouldn't move Pietrangelo, but that's really the model (not, for example, Gardiner, who has much more to prove).

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04-25-2012, 01:15 PM
  #186
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I'm amazed that people are assuming that the 3C model is what deserves to be in question. I can't stand the Penguins but the success of this model is undeniable.

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04-25-2012, 01:16 PM
  #187
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kadri schenn 5th pick mac arthur and d`amigo...sadly it`s still not enough (...

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04-25-2012, 01:16 PM
  #188
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jeh82 View Post
To answer your question, no, and definately not based on that package.

First, I don't see the Penguins moving Malkin for a package in which Yakupov is the most important piece--he won't peak for, what, 5-6 years? That's a bit out of line with the rest of the Penguins core.

Second, Edmonton doesn't have an excess of young, top-end NHL defensemen (to put it charitably). Assuming the Penguins move Malkin, I'd expect that the package would have to include a young, near-peak wing and a young, near-peak top-pairing defenseman.

The Blues wouldn't move Pietrangelo, but that's really the model (not, for example, Gardiner, who has much more to prove).


Sounds like you want something like: Gaborik + McDonagh/Del Zotto + 1st + Thomas for Malkin.


I'd be EXTREMELY shocked if Malkin gets traded. Staal is the odd man out most likely.

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04-25-2012, 01:17 PM
  #189
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jeh82 View Post
To answer your question, no, and definately not based on that package.

First, I don't see the Penguins moving Malkin for a package in which Yakupov is the most important piece--he won't peak for, what, 5-6 years? That's a bit out of line with the rest of the Penguins core.

Second, Edmonton doesn't have an excess of young, top-end NHL defensemen (to put it charitably). Assuming the Penguins move Malkin, I'd expect that the package would have to include a young, near-peak wing and a young, near-peak top-pairing defenseman.

The Blues wouldn't move Pietrangelo, but that's really the model (not, for example, Gardiner, who has much more to prove).
I think one of the main reasons for this deal is the Pens would save nearly 8 Million in Salary.. but fair enough. I know there is no chance of this happening just thought it looked good on paper! You could add Suter/Parise in the offseason which I think is a huge bonus to the trade

Parise/Suter
Yakupov
Klefbom
Lander
2013 1st

for

Malkin
Martin

?

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04-25-2012, 01:29 PM
  #190
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Happy Hallidays View Post
I think one of the main reasons for this deal is the Pens would save nearly 8 Million in Salary.. but fair enough. I know there is no chance of this happening just thought it looked good on paper! You could add Suter/Parise in the offseason which I think is a huge bonus to the trade

Parise/Suter
Yakupov
Klefbom
Lander
2013 1st

for

Malkin
Martin

?
You're kinda dumb.

Just because the Pens sign Suter or Parise doesn't make your crappy trade any better.

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04-25-2012, 01:30 PM
  #191
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That's a cute proposal.

-Does it include your top player or 2nd best player? No (Pietrangelo/Backes)
-Does it include your best prospect or 2nd best prospect? No (Tarasenko/Shwartz)

Hey everybody! Lets make proposals for the probable Hart trophy winner and offer up our 3rd-4th best players and 3rd-4th best prospects!
Pietrangelo wouldn't be traded. Backes is another center. Just cause our 3rd-4th best players/prospects are damn good doesn't mean that you have to be jealous. Clearly Ryan Kesler and Edler have no value, because they're not the best 2 players.

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04-25-2012, 01:38 PM
  #192
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Originally Posted by RomanianLeafs View Post
kadri schenn 5th pick mac arthur and d`amigo...sadly it`s still not enough (...
not even close to enough. Start with Kessel and Gardiner

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04-25-2012, 01:40 PM
  #193
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You're kinda dumb.

Just because the Pens sign Suter or Parise doesn't make your crappy trade any better.
lol good response genius.

Maybe offer a counter proposal? People like you are the reason this board is unbearable at times. Plus I'm pretty sure adding Parise and Suter is very significant and yes would make my "crappy trade" better.

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04-25-2012, 01:44 PM
  #194
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Originally Posted by Happy Hallidays View Post
lol good response genius.

Maybe offer a counter proposal? People like you are the reason this board is unbearable at times. Plus I'm pretty sure adding Parise and Suter is very significant and yes would make my "crappy trade" better.
Honestly, I don't think Edmonton has the pieces to do anything other than a massive (quality) quanitity for superior quality deal.

In other words, at some point, packaging some combination of Eberle, Hall, picks and prospects would get to the point where Pittsburgh would be forced to accept the deal--but by that point, it would become devastating to Edmonton.

Another team, like, say, the Blues, could move a much smaller package of assets because they have the "right" assets--e.g., a young #1D, an impressive collection of reasonably young forward depth, etc. (But, as has been said, I don't think the Blues move Pietrangelo for anyone in the league).

You don't move a piece like Malkin for cap space to make another move. Give Martin away if that's the goal, etc.


Last edited by Jack de la Hoya: 04-25-2012 at 01:50 PM.
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04-25-2012, 01:50 PM
  #195
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I dunno where this "malkin might be available" idea came from. I just watched the conference ...

http://www.nhl.com/ice/news.htm?id=629520

There's no way in there can you even imagine he hinted Malkin being available. If anything was hinted ... it's Staal and even there, nothing was clearly stated.

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04-25-2012, 01:51 PM
  #196
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PIT

Phil Kessel
Luke Schenn
1st 2014
1st 2013
Joe Colbourne/Nazem Kadri




TOR

Malkin



Thoughts?

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04-25-2012, 01:52 PM
  #197
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Originally Posted by Happy Hallidays View Post
I think one of the main reasons for this deal is the Pens would save nearly 8 Million in Salary.. but fair enough. I know there is no chance of this happening just thought it looked good on paper! You could add Suter/Parise in the offseason which I think is a huge bonus to the trade

Parise/Suter
Yakupov
Klefbom
Lander
2013 1st

for

Malkin
Martin

?
No. The problem here is the salary cap.

If the Penguins had the money to sign Suter, Parise, then give the raised demanded by Staal and eventually Letang...then why trade away Malkin in the first place?

The problem in Pittsburgh (assuming there even is one) is this: 3 top notch centers, one needs a $2-2.5mil raise which they can not afford.

Trading Malkin gives you $8.7mil in space and Martin gives you $5mil for 13.7mil...which is about what they'd be spending for Suter and Parise. But then where does Staal's raise come from?

The two scenarios as I see it are:

Trade Staal for equal valued wing (think Ryan).

Trade Malkin for 2 young top notch wingers (or 1 plus a VERY high pick - think Eberle + 1st OV) who's total salary cap hit would less less than $6-7mil for quite awhile.

Then you have consider the fact that Shero could just dump someone like Martin and use the money for Staal + cheaper dman. Shero doesn't have to get rid of anyone. The return is (whether people think it will or not) going to be a vast overpayment for either of them. Malkin is a top tier talent...possibly the best natural talent in the NHL. He can carry an entire team. If you think EDM would be worse off with Malkin than Eberle+Yaks...think again. Malkin is always going to be worth more than the sum of the pieces coming back...which is why a trade for him would be purely cap related and why it will have to involve young top notch talent.

Staal is a young, all around beast of a 2C. Has a great offensive upside and an already solid defensive game. Those are whats in demand. Several teams have proven that depth at center > depth at wing. its harder to come by a great 2C than a winger. Staal can PK too which adds value. If you want him...you're gonna have to pay up (think about Neal/Nisk for Gogo...Dallas needed a PMD more than the Pens wanted a winger...so Dallas had to give up a little more)

Trades are not always about 1:1 value people. Realistically a team may have to gut itself to get Malkin...or give up a significant piece to get Staal. I mean these are the Penguins core players...they are not coming cheap from one of the shrewdest GM in the league.

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04-25-2012, 01:52 PM
  #198
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What I gathered from his Press Conference is that he no longer committed to the 3-center mold. I also get the feeling Malkin is the odd man out...

I disagree with this so so so so so so so much.... and I cringe at trading the best player in the world.... but maybe there is something I don't know or cap reasons
Just think what PIT can possibly get for him at this time.. a LOT more then 2 players who are both pending UFAs after next season.
PIT can get just about any package they want for someone like Malkin.

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04-25-2012, 01:53 PM
  #199
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Originally Posted by 416Leafer View Post
It'd probably be ~Backes + Shattenkirk + Tarasenko then. I wasn't even saying I would move Pietrangelo, I was just saying that some of the earlier proposals were garbage (Oshie + Shattenkirk + Rattie). Any team that's trading for Malkin is going to HAVE to include either their top D, top prospect, or top forward. You can't really throw proposals out there that are Top 6 Forward A + Top 4 Defence B + secondary prospect and expect to get... a Hart trophy winner / top 5 centre in the league.
The first proposal was low, but it was workable. I could easily see that being a first offer to just get a ballpark reading. I do think that that's closer value than you're giving it credit for. The Blues' best and most valuable player is unquestionably Pietrangelo, but after that, a case could be made for a number of guys on the Roster. Oshie is still a younger guy who is improving. His numbers have gotten better each year. He led the Blues in scoring and probably would have had 60 points with a healthy roster. He's very good defensively, too. The difference between him and Backes might not be as much as you think.

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04-25-2012, 01:58 PM
  #200
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Originally Posted by TMLOBI View Post
But I'm pretty sure that isn't enough. We'd probably have to give up something like

Gardiner
Kessel
2012 1st
Kadri
lol wtf no

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