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GM Ray Shero on NHL Live: 5PM ET

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Old
04-26-2012, 07:46 PM
  #51
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Originally Posted by PenguinTommy View Post
Can anyone explain me please, what the obstruction is? or what is coming back?
Essentially, holding that isn't called.

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04-26-2012, 08:03 PM
  #52
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It's another word for interference. You see a LOT of obstructing on face-offs and dump ins.

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04-26-2012, 08:05 PM
  #53
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fogel View Post
Essentially, holding that isn't called.
Quote:
Originally Posted by M0NTY26 View Post
It's another word for interference. You see a LOT of obstructing on face-offs and dump ins.
I get it now, thanks a lot.

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04-26-2012, 08:40 PM
  #54
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I get it now, thanks a lot.
Contratulations. You now know more than the average NHL referee

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04-26-2012, 08:59 PM
  #55
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Originally Posted by PenguinTommy View Post
I get it now, thanks a lot.
It is what was supposed to be extinct after the 2004 lockout and the "new nhl" but now it's basically back and we're in the dead puck era again where the refs are swallowing their whistles. Players after a dump in will have the defender step to ride them a bit into the boards after they dump the puck, enough to slow them down so their defensive partner can get the puck. That used to be called obstruction interference but now it isnt being called at all anymore.

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04-26-2012, 09:04 PM
  #56
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Originally Posted by Jonjmc View Post
Shero was on 93.7 The Fan today, on the Seibel, Starkey and Miller show sometime between 3:30 and 4. Most of it was the same old same old, but Starkey did ask a couple tougher questions. When talking about Crosby and Staal, he said he needed to sit down and talk with each of them about what they wanted and how they saw the future going. Now, this is my opinion but he seemed less certain about Staal than Crosby. At one point Starkey said that if it's true that Staal didn't want to be a third line center and wanted to be a top 6er, could the team accommodate that? Shero paused and actually laughed out loud and said, Well he is playing behind Malkin and Crosby. Then he pretty much repeated that this is why he needs to sit down and talk with both of them to see.

It was Starkey again who pressed him about Martin, even going so far as to ask if the the idea of amnesty for one bad contract appealed to Shero and if he would consider using that on Martin. Shero was very firm in saying that he opposed the amnesty concept and has voiced that opinion to the league, and even if it was an idea that was implemented he wouldn't use that on Martin or any player on the team saying.... he doesn't believe the Pens have any bad contracts and the big reason he opposes the amnesty idea is that he believes that GM's should be accountable for any bad contracts they sign.

Starkey then talked about obstruction creeping back into the game and if it's here to stay is the defense properly constructed to deal with that. Shero said, that's a very good question and one which they have already had discussions about. Shero seemed to allude that if obstruction is back, they they would probably need to adjust the roster.

My take on this is:

If Stall does indeed want an expanded role, then he is probably the odd man out.

If obstruction is back, then Martin is also probably out.


If anyone listened to this, feel free to add or make any corrections as I am doing this from memory.
I listened to it as well, what was a bit disturbing is how fervently he defended Martin. I mean I expect him to defend the guy but he seemed to have a ton of conviction where he believed he is a good/great defensemen and referenced how Martin had offers for more money but made a choice to come here. To me it sounded like he's unlikely to be traded or anything based on that. He also seemed surly but this is the first I heard him in an interview like this. I am loving the 93.7 I discovered on my recent trip to pittsburgh. I have been listening to it on my computer for the last few days.

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04-26-2012, 09:10 PM
  #57
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I believe part of the reason for the obstruction is the concussion stuff. I think the league, after a huge pile of concussions this year despite rule 48, decided to buy into the idea that the game has become so fast that it is more dangerous / more likely to cause these injuries. The other part of it is that the refs this year (all year and part of last) were ****ing terrible. I mean, demonstrably worse than your usual fan saying "the refs suck". Many of these games were called in a totally incompetent way.

I don't know if they promoted a bunch of AHL refs last summer and had the combo of inexperience with new rules or what, but the NHL needs to fix it.

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04-26-2012, 10:10 PM
  #58
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Originally Posted by Gooch View Post
I listened to it as well, what was a bit disturbing is how fervently he defended Martin. I mean I expect him to defend the guy but he seemed to have a ton of conviction where he believed he is a good/great defensemen and referenced how Martin had offers for more money but made a choice to come here. To me it sounded like he's unlikely to be traded or anything based on that. He also seemed surly but this is the first I heard him in an interview like this. I am loving the 93.7 I discovered on my recent trip to pittsburgh. I have been listening to it on my computer for the last few days.
He most certainly defended Martin and actually seemed to be defensive about the criticism of Martin. But what I took away from that whole exchange about Martin and the defense was him almost admitting that if the game is changing his defense must change.

And did you get the same impression I did about his comments on Staal?

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Old
04-27-2012, 06:55 AM
  #59
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The only thing I hated about Shero's interview was him going back to when he brought in Martin and Michalek, as too say, I don't have a reason to adjust because they were good in the regular season defensively (1st/3rd on the PK for two seasons) and they were/got under 200 goals the first one. Using that they won 51 games is a cop out considering they were still giving up goals at a good clip. They were tied for 15th with 2.66 GA with two other teams.

Times change(d) quickly and they were not addressed. So he has a right to be pissed from the effort from all, including himself. If he needs a month to way in on what the defense needs that has been apparent throughout the year I don't know what he's thinking.

Regular season<<<<<Playoffs

What has his team done in the playoffs (note to the fact of missing Sid & Geno for Tampa series)

All I get is that he traded a playoff season for a draft because the cost was too high.

Stanley Cup Playoffs>>>>>Draft

Chance for a Stanley Cup>>>>>__________(s) or pick(s)?(Not saying we traded the 1st)

They had a lot to offer and even some they'll loose for nothing.

Defense showed signs all season it needed help regardless of the final regular season outcome.

Shero crapped the bed hard where he's usually the best at. Adjustment at the deadline. One was needed and he traded it away for the draft.

For me it makes this draft evermore sour and a tossup if I'll even go thinking I could of just watched them play for a possible cup instead of drafting 18/21st in the draft.

It's all sour grapes for me.

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Old
04-27-2012, 07:11 AM
  #60
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What I still don't understand is Shero's staunch defense of the coaches. Yes, the players didn't execute and play well, but I didn't see any adjustments throughout the game. Bylsma is stubborn about "getting to his game" , but it doesn't always work in playoff hockey.

Watching the other teams last night, you could almost see what was lacking in the Penguin's game with the Flyers. The intensity and tight defensive play just wasn't there. Maybe my memory is clouded, but when we won the cup in 2009, I could swear that adjustments were made according to what team we were playing.

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04-27-2012, 08:30 AM
  #61
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ugene Malkin View Post
All I get is that he traded a playoff season for a draft because the cost was too high.

Stanley Cup Playoffs>>>>>Draft
To be fair, most of the glaring defensive issues started appearing after the deadline. Pretty much everyone was fine with standing pat given the way the team was playing at the time.

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04-27-2012, 09:39 AM
  #62
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I'm not worried about Disco. He's either going to make adjustments this summer and have a better defensive gameplan next year or the first sign of an extended losing streak (losing 5 in a row, 6 of 10, etc) Shero will send him packing. Wouldn't be surprised if he talks to some people this summer to let them know he might be calling on them. I would, if I were going to keep my coach in this situation.

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04-27-2012, 12:53 PM
  #63
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Trading Paul Martin at the deadline wasn't such a bad idea, eh?

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04-27-2012, 02:21 PM
  #64
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Originally Posted by Chancellor Vitale View Post
I believe part of the reason for the obstruction is the concussion stuff. I think the league, after a huge pile of concussions this year despite rule 48, decided to buy into the idea that the game has become so fast that it is more dangerous / more likely to cause these injuries. The other part of it is that the refs this year (all year and part of last) were ****ing terrible. I mean, demonstrably worse than your usual fan saying "the refs suck". Many of these games were called in a totally incompetent way.

I don't know if they promoted a bunch of AHL refs last summer and had the combo of inexperience with new rules or what, but the NHL needs to fix it.
Yes, it's smarter for the league to mandate obstruction back into the game to reduce concussions, instead of doing something about the equipment that people have been talking about for about twenty years now.

I honestly don't get it. It's like the body armor they wear for elbow/shoulder pads is the giant elephant in the room, and instead they look at every other alternative to reducing head injuries instead of the one that might actually be the biggest cause of it.

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04-27-2012, 02:40 PM
  #65
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Gotta believe that Shero's just playing the role of a smart GM who is defending his player (Martin) because he wants to maximize the return, and because said return MAY now somewhat be in question because of his porous play in the playoffs. Trying to nip the albatross in the bud, so to speak.

Otherwise, he's losing his touch.

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04-27-2012, 04:34 PM
  #66
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Originally Posted by hophog View Post
Contratulations. You now know more than the average NHL referee
Thanks dude. I don't know if it's compliment or insult

Quote:
Originally Posted by Gooch View Post
It is what was supposed to be extinct after the 2004 lockout and the "new nhl" but now it's basically back and we're in the dead puck era again where the refs are swallowing their whistles. Players after a dump in will have the defender step to ride them a bit into the boards after they dump the puck, enough to slow them down so their defensive partner can get the puck. That used to be called obstruction interference but now it isnt being called at all anymore.
Yeah, thank you too.

I did know about that rule. It was more about the language than knowledge about the rules. I just didn't know it's called obstruction.

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04-27-2012, 06:23 PM
  #67
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Originally Posted by Sidney the Kidney View Post
Yes, it's smarter for the league to mandate obstruction back into the game to reduce concussions, instead of doing something about the equipment that people have been talking about for about twenty years now.

I honestly don't get it. It's like the body armor they wear for elbow/shoulder pads is the giant elephant in the room, and instead they look at every other alternative to reducing head injuries instead of the one that might actually be the biggest cause of it.
Didn't something with the shoulder pads change this year? I don't remember what though ...

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04-27-2012, 10:10 PM
  #68
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Originally Posted by Sidney the Kidney View Post
Yes, it's smarter for the league to mandate obstruction back into the game to reduce concussions, instead of doing something about the equipment that people have been talking about for about twenty years now.

I honestly don't get it. It's like the body armor they wear for elbow/shoulder pads is the giant elephant in the room, and instead they look at every other alternative to reducing head injuries instead of the one that might actually be the biggest cause of it.
I wasn't suggesting it's smart, only suggesting an explanation for the leniency on obstruction. Typical NHL move. Take an already confusing situation, make it more confusing. I agree many of the pads should be banned at this level. All elbow points and shoulder points should have an element of give to them. Make em thicker underneath to protect, whatever... but they should not be able to use rock-hard plating on anything but shin pads, chest plates, lumbar protectors and pants. And helmets obviously.


Last edited by Darth Vitale: 04-27-2012 at 10:20 PM.
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04-27-2012, 10:15 PM
  #69
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Originally Posted by Jag68Sid87 View Post
Gotta believe that Shero's just playing the role of a smart GM who is defending his player (Martin) because he wants to maximize the return, and because said return MAY now somewhat be in question because of his porous play in the playoffs. Trying to nip the albatross in the bud, so to speak.

Otherwise, he's losing his touch.
There's also the outside chance that Shero just won't be able to move Martin at all. Then you're stuck with a guy you just threw under the bus a couple months earlier. I mean I want Shero to make changes as much as the next person, but he's not going to completely abandon his professionalism to do it.

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04-27-2012, 10:33 PM
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Come on guys, seriously, did anyone expect Shero to thrash, and throw under the bus likes of Martin and then try to trade him?

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04-27-2012, 11:00 PM
  #71
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There's also the outside chance that Shero just won't be able to move Martin at all. Then you're stuck with a guy you just threw under the bus a couple months earlier. I mean I want Shero to make changes as much as the next person, but he's not going to completely abandon his professionalism to do it.
If you re-read what I said, we're saying the same thing.


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04-28-2012, 04:02 AM
  #72
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If you re-read what I said, we're saying the same thing.

Oh I know, just agreeing with you. Probably should have made that clearer.

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04-28-2012, 05:46 AM
  #73
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Come on guys, seriously, did anyone expect Shero to thrash, and throw under the bus likes of Martin and then try to trade him?
Yeah. He obviously has to be positive in the media about Martin for leveraging purposes if a deal can be made.

I do think there's some truth with him still believing Martin is a good player though. He mentioned how our fans probably don't remember how good Martin was in New Jersey and that's probably true and Martin can probably be that player again in the right system or maybe we tweak our system to help the D and Fleury. He didn't seem opposed to that idea in the interview.

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04-28-2012, 05:50 AM
  #74
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.. but they should not be able to use rock-hard plating on anything but shin pads, chest plates, lumbar protectors and pants. And helmets obviously.
back in the days...a little tape and pro toe on the elbow pads worked wonders. not that i ever...just sayin.

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04-28-2012, 06:08 AM
  #75
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Yeah. He obviously has to be positive in the media about Martin for leveraging purposes if a deal can be made.

I do think there's some truth with him still believing Martin is a good player though. He mentioned how our fans probably don't remember how good Martin was in New Jersey and that's probably true and Martin can probably be that player again in the right system or maybe we tweak our system to help the D and Fleury. He didn't seem opposed to that idea in the interview.
If so, I agree with him. You aren't a great player your whole career and then magically lose all of your ability at 29 or 30. Don't get me wrong, Martin had a horrible year. But frankly, a lot of guys did. I don't think it's a coincidence that Martin, Michalek and Orpik all had the worst year of their careers this season. I'm usually not one to jump on Bylsma, but when this many formerly very good NHL dmen are playing this badly, there's a good chance it's the system. It's the coaches job to realize if he has the guys to play a specific brand of hockey. If you don't, you adjust to what you have. You don't crowbar a certain type of player into a role in which they aren't suited.

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